Shooter

Nice bagel, I like it! It seems very plausible we could finally find ourselves in Paris after all these years. Also might finally explain the picture in Der Riese of the zombie underneath the Eiffel Tower. Good stuff here.

Next week at the latest.

Well hello there not so stranger. I certainly remember your username you were a pretty active member. You were a Donator as well, weren't you? Well welcome back my friend. :)

That's definitely possible. The problem we face right now is the term Divinium is not real. It's obviously been made up by the developers. But in the world of Zombies, perhaps Divinium is a a name given to newly discovered elements that do not yet have a real name. That's what I don't get. If Maxis refers to it as Divinium (a new element with no name) in 1917, why would he rename it Ununpentium in the 1940's? Both terms aren't that different, both are used as a filler for a name. Or what you're saying is when Maxis first discovered 115 , he labeled it Divinium, then changed it to Ununpentium in the later years to give it a bit more of a descriptive name? I suppose that might make sense. Where's a Chem major when you need em?!

It's probably safe to say the number one thing to make this map unforgettable would to bring the O4 back. I don't think there's anything I miss more about W@W and BO zombies than their hilarious voices. Other than that, I hope there is an assortment of radios on the map, like we saw on Tranzit and Die Rise. The last two maps have lacked any real radios, so I'd like to see the return of the old style type radios that fill in some of the gaps of the overall story.

This is interesting, and contradictory. If you guys recall the chalkboard from Der Riese and Kino Der Toten, presumed to belong to Dr. Maxis, you'll remember the elements listed. On the upper right corner of the chalkboard, both Element 114 and Element 115 are listed, with the symbols Uuz (don't recall what it was for sure) and Uup. I find it strange how it was once referred to as "Uup" on Maxis' chalkboard, yet it is now being referred to as "Dv" on his original Periodic Table. Maxis had that chalkboard with Uup since 1945, so at some point between 1917 and 1945, the name of the element seems to have changed. I sure hope they did their research on this, cause things ain't adding up. :|

I already know your name, but hello anyways! Thanks for making an intro Ducky! Keep up the fine work sir. Now, go get yourself that Intro Medal! Also, penguins and ducks are awesome. Cats are not.

Hey ZombieGK, any word on how the scripts for Buried are coming along? I skimmed through them and heard quite a few interesting ones, would love to get the text versions. No rush, just really looking forward to them. I'd do them myself, but I got something else to work on. Thanks again for all these GK!

Thank you for all the positive comments on this everyone. I'm glad I decided to officially release it. As of right now, I'm waiting to see how the rest of BO2 plays out before adding any of this information to my Zombies Timeline thread. I think there's enough evidence to support the creation of the Manhattan Project and the Ascension Group from Group 935, but I'm still unsure about the whole AEC thing. Hopefully BO2 plays out like it has been so I can add a lot of these things in. @ PINNAZ Couldn't agree more man. It really did seem like at the time of BO2's release that we were moving in this direction of the Nuclear Age, but GLF had to go and screw everything up. My research pretty much came to a halt after hearing about Great Leap Forward. Hopefully all this research won't be for nothing. :)

Treyarch tried that on TranZit. It was called Survivor Mode. And it went over terribly. :lol:

How do I know if it's real? If it's from Treyarch or Activision. If it's a leak, there's a 99.9% chance it's fake. Just stick to official announcements.

Double Tap II and Speed Cola is the way to go. Then Quick Revive if I'm on Solo or Mule Kick when playing Multiplayer. Substitute Vulture Aid for Mule Kick on Buried, simply for the stench in Vulture Aid that gives you time to reload. Sometimes, it helps to smell like Nikolai :lol:

NDU and Moon gets my votes, with Ascension and Buried following up.

Go post in the Off Topic section if you want to rant about your complaints.

I was tempted for a second to vote for equipment Weapons.

According to you the mobsters are reliving the same night of their death (NYE 1933), yet it's somehow in the year 20--? You're contradicting yourself. I see what you're saying about them being stuck in the cycle for 100 years, but there's nothing at all to support that. Plus if they're repeating the cycle for 100 years, they're still repeating the night of their death ,NYE 1933. The map and events of the map are occurring in 1933, regardless of how many years you think they we're repeating the cycle. Also, if you think all maps have occurred chronologically, you need to look at Kino more closely. If you want to discuss this more, PM me. We're starting to get off topic here ;)

"That dude" is usually what I call him when I play. We could just call him Electric Jesus instead...

Just because Fergeson was there from 1933-1944 doesn't mean this map didn't happen in 1933.. The single day, New Years Day, keeps repeating itself FOR THE CHARACTERS.. Everyone else's timeline went on.. Theirs is a REPEATING CYCLE.. Reincarnation doesn't move the timeline forward, it's a repeat of the same time over again. So if Fergeson said these events occurred then, then that's when the map's time frame is.. They died in the chair that night.. For murdering Weasel, just as they die in the game to go back to the prison.. Over and over again.. IF you break the cycle and escape that time frame.. Well, the game ends.. +1. Exactly. Plus, you do realize that Ferguson is killed in the intro for Mob of the Dead, right? The intro for Mob of the Dead and the "radios" for Mob of the Dead are in direct conflict. This was done on purpose by the zombies team to show that there are two seperate chain of events on MotD. One where Ferguson lives and Al dies (radios), and one where Ferguson dies and Al lives (intro and game). Both of these events began on December 31, 1933, and that is the only date you should be concerned about. There's no proof that time kept going on as they repeated the cycle. In fact it's quite the opposite. I did a full analysis of the story of Mob of the Dead when it came out, I suggest you check it out if you'd like to know more: viewtopic.php?f=149&t=32121

Yes, Mob of the Dead occurs on New Years Eve 1933. There are conflicting dates on Mob of the Dead: a water tower from 1942, a bridge from 1938, a cafeteria sign from 1932, a radio from 1933. Of all these things, the radio is the best indicator for a date. Also, the characters do indicate it is New Years Eve during the map, supporting the date of New Years Eve 1933 as the date for the map. If you HAD to put a date on Mob of the Dead, that would be it.

I interpret the message in two different ways. 1. A reference to the description of Der Riese from W@W: This is where it all began. This is where the master plan took shape. Is this where it all ends? 2. They're referring to Mob of the Dead, where the zombies storyline technically starts in terms of chronological order (1933). And that's why they had the MotD window opened, it was a reference to that.

I personally don't see them bringing back revamped versions of the W@W and BO maps this time around. If they did, they would really have to add a lot of new features like buildable stations , perks, and new Easter Eggs. The updated guns in the box would not be enough to justify rereleasing them. If they do release a zombies only final DLC, I would have to think they would be five all new maps. Personally, I don't see it happening this time around. I can only pray that it does lol.

You sir just became my new best friend. Seriously, this is an extremely useful thread for us storyline guys. I praise you for posting this. Tac does have the majority of the Tranzit quotes scripted, and I did scripts for the Mob of the Dead quotes, but it's always nice to have another resource for the quotes. Also, neither of us tackled Die Rise, so it's awesome to finally have some scripted. I have a question on two quotes from MJ. During your time going through Die Rise, did you hear a quote from Marlton about a 3D printer? I can't remember how it went when I listened through it, but I think it's a pack-a-punch quote, but I'm not sure. I know it's somewhere in the Die Rise Marlton quotes, I just can't remember how it went. If you come across it again please let me know. I really wanna know what exactly the quote was. And secondly, did you happen to hear a quote from MJ on Die Rise that starts "Pavlov's dog, Schrodinger's cat,..."? I don't remember how it ends, but I know that's how it starts. And I can't remember if it was Die Rise or Buried where I heard it unfortunately. If you come across it let me know. Again, I thank you for compiling all this. I will put it to great use in the future. :D

5/23/13 Welcome to one of the many unreleased threads I've written over the last 6 months or so. Over the next month or two I will try to finish up and release some of the better ones, so keep your eye out for more. This has been my favorite thread to write. And I'll be honest, I never planned on releasing it. I started writing this thread a short time after Black Ops 2's release last year, when the Hanford Site was confirmed as the first map. It was a theory I and a few others were pondering for awhile, and when I saw the Hanford Site being the first map, I decided to start this thread. What ensued over the next few weeks was an insane amount of research. I can't tell you how many times I'd go from link to link, going so far off the original idea because of how interested I was. The connections and similarities were just so intriguing to me. Unfortuntaly, I don't think I'll get a lot of responses from this and I understand, most people only care about the BO2 discussion nowadays. Totally get it. One person I do hope to hear from is MixMasterNut, as he also made these connections a long time back as well. I know this is a lot to take in and read, but ANY feedback from you guys would be absolutely amazing. What do you think? Do you think these events could have happened in our zombies storyline This will in part go into my Rise of Richtofen thread, but I'm still not sure what all I'll use. Summary: This thread details the events that followed the capture of Der Riese by the Americans and the Soviets. It also details what happened to Group 935's members and research after their capture, as the members went on to help both the American's Manhattan Project and the Soviet's Ascension Group. I've just been doing alot of reasearch on things lately, and have been looking for a way to tie it all together. And it just seems like the same ideas keep coming up. Rockets, The Space Race, Soviets, The Moon, 115, nuclear energy, nuclear propulsion. It all keeps reemerging in the research, and there seem to be ALOT of connections with real life events. I think I may be seein the bigger picture. Let's start from the beginning: 1942 and the Wunderwaffe Program. In the Project Nova intel, a list of projects from the Wunderwaffe Program are shown, and are listed in descendeding order of priority. The first two subjects listed that are of the highest priorities, and are the two we need to focus on: [*:ftvw93gj]Analysis of the "The Uranium Club", a German Nuclear Energy project whose purpose was to weaponize nuclear fussion technology. The project was believed to have been cancelled in 1942. The Uranium Club bears many resemblances to Group 935's beginning at the Der Riese facility right before the beginning of WWII. [*:ftvw93gj]Analysis of German V2 rockets which were capable of launching heavy loads (i.e. satellites) into low Earth orbit. In the decades following, these two subjects will become the greatest of importance to both America and the Soviets with the events of the Nuclear Arms Race and Space Race. But it all started with the capture of German Nuclear Physcists and Rocket Scientists from the Wunderwaffe program. The Uranium Club and Group 935. 1939-1942 The Uranium Club, a project of the Wunderwaffe program, was an attempted effort led by Germany to develop and produce atomic weapons during the events of World War II. This program started in April of 1939, just months after the discovery of nuclear fission in January 1939, but ended only months later, due to the start of WWII, where many notable physicists were drafted into the war. However, the second effort began under the administrative auspices of the German Army Weapons Agency at the beginning of WWII (September 1, 1939). Eventually it was assessed that nuclear fission would not contribute significantly to ending the war, and in January 1942, the German Army Weapons Agency turned the program over to the Reich Research Council, yet continued to fund the program. Afterwards, the program split up between nine major institutes where the directors dominated the research and set their own objectives. At this time, the number of scientists working on applied nuclear fission began to diminish, with many applying their talents to more pressing war-time demands. It was also around the time of Group 935's beginning in 1939 that the first stages of the Manhattan Project were shaping up in America. The US could not risk coming in second to the Germans when it came to nuclear power, and the Manhattan Project was set up to ensure they would be the first to harness the godlike power. On August 13, 1942, The Manhattan Project was officially started in hopes to be the first country to create a nuclear weapon. Towards the end of the Alsos Mission in 1945, Der Riese was successfully raided by the Americans. They were able to gather invaluable data and personel from Group. The Americans and the Alsos Mission members searched for personnel, records, material, and sites in order to evaluate the German Nuclear Energy Project, further American research, and prevent their capture by the Soviet Union. Alsos personnel managed to find and remove many of the German research effort's personnel and data, most notably information on Element 115's nuclear characteristics and V2 rockets. Near the end of the raid at Der Riese, the Americans ended up in a faceoff with Soviet Allied Forces, who had been excuting a raid of the facility as well. Both sides were after the same thing: data and personnel. Scientists captured by the the US would go on to work under Operation Paperclip and the Manhattan Project, while scientists captured by the Soviets went on to form the Ascension Group. During the Manhattan Project, Los Alamos hosted thousands of employees, including the Wunderwaffe scientists captured during the Alsos Mission and Operation Paperclip. The location was a total secret. Though its contract with the University of California was initially intended to be temporary, the relationship was maintained long after the war. Until the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Japan, University of California president Robert Sproul did not know what the purpose of the laboratory was and thought it might be producing a "death ray". The only member of the UC administration who knew its true purpose—indeed, the only one who knew its exact physical location—was the Secretary-Treasurer Robert Underhill, who was in charge of wartime contracts and liabilities. But while Los Alamos remained the central facility for the Manhattan Project, there where two other main facilities for the project. After purchasing the land, the federal government relocated some 1,500 residents of White Bluffs and Hanford before beginning construction of the site. Disputes around the land acquisitions process dragged on and was not completed until after the end of the Manhattan Project. Two other reactors, D Reactor and F reactor, came online in December 1944 and February 1945, respectively. By April 1945, shipments of plutonium were headed to Los Alamos every five days, and Hanford soon provided enough material for the first nuclear bombs. The Hanford Site would continue to produce nuclear material for the decades following. Is it possible that the personel at the Hanford Site were conducting experiments or possibly even producing Element 115 within one of it's secret reactors? Element 115 research and production at the Hanford Site? Back to the note from Der Riese. It's likely that scientists of the Manhattan Project had been studying the effects of Element 115 as early as 1945 at the Hanford Site. The resulting radiation from the research would lead to the zombies during the Green Run map. But is it possible that the Americans began developing it on their own as well, after successfully reverse engineering the element. The note from Der Riese states "Element 115 is produced by bombarding Americium-243 nucleus with a calcium-48 nucleus...", so it seems plausible that the Americans could have been attempting to produce their own supply. Just something to keep in mind throughout this discussion. The work of Manhattan Project members at the The Hanford Site and the Los Alamos National Laboratory from 1943-1945 would culminate in the creation of the first successful atomic weapon, which would be used in the first nuclear test near Alamogordo, New Mexico. While America was getting ready to take the lead in the nuclear arms race, the Soviets had begun operations of thier own after discovering America's progress from atomic spies such as Klaus Fuchs. The Soviet Atomic Bomb Project. 1945 The Soviet project to develop their own atomic bomb began during post-World War II, in the wake of the discovery of the United States' nuclear projects. Because of the bloody and intensified war with Germany on the Eastern Front, the large scale efforts prevented Soviets from developing the atomic bomb during the war like the Americans did, but accelerated the program after the discovery of the Manhattan Project and the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. After the atomic raids on Japan and the subsequent Japanese surrender in 1945, the Soviet Union expanded it's research facilities, military reactors, and employed a number of scientists including its atomic spies who successfully penetrated the American nuclear weapons efforts. The first step in the Soviet's plan was to acquire Wunderwaffe and German scientists of their own into what became known as the "Russian Alsos". Russian Alsos and The Ascension Group. Early 1945 The Russian Alsos was an operation by the Soviets which took place in early 1945 in Germany, whose objectives were the exploitation of German atomic related facilities, intellectual materials, materiel resources, and scientific personnel for the benefit of the Soviet Atomic Bomb Project. One such location that was raided by the Soviets was the Der Riese facility in Germany. As the American's were raiding Der Riese, the Soviets were simultaneously attempting a raid of their own. It eventually lead to a standoff between the two, and both sides agreed to cooperate. While America and the USSR were allies during the war, both sides had personal motives for their missions. The Soviets were able to capture a variety of personnel, as well as plans for the V2 rocket and information detailing Element 115. One of the Wunderwaffe scientist, Frediric Steiner, was able to escape with a small group as well as Nova 6 research and material being kept at the base. Steiner, who had been one of the high value targets by both America and the USSR, had escaped north towards the Arctic Ocean. Due to miscommunication between the US and Britain, the Soviets were able to capture Dr. Steiner and bring him back to Russia. Shortly afterwards, Steiner would go on to create The Ascension Group. The Ascension Group. 1945 Tac wrote: In 1945, America's British counterparts in MI-6 inaccurately reported that the original NOVA 6 test site located outside Cottbus on the border of Poland was destroyed under heavy bombing. Reports from the time indicated that the NOVA 6 compound was transported on the Elbe River to the North Sea where it was moved to a freighter for transport to an unknown location. MI-6 reported that the freighter ship was destroyed on direct orders from Winston Churchill and everyone was killed in the resulting explosion. Steiner and the remnants of the Wunderwaffe scientists disappeared on October 29th, 1945 near the Arctic Circle. Around the same time, the Soviet Operation designated "Olympus" consisted of the 3rd Shock Army Special Operations unit led by General Dragovich. When Dragovich infiltrated their ship, Steiner gave up his own men to save his own sin. We now know that as the minimum, Dragovich, Kravcenko, and Steiner escaped with samples of the gas and headed back to Moscow. From there, the Ascension Group was created. The Ascension Group was headed by Steiner himself, but organized by Dragovich. Steiner's main purpose was his workings of NOVA 6. This was the Soviet resurrection of the German NOVA6 Program. Other Group 935 members captured during the Russian Alsos had also been working in the organization. So while the American's had the Manhattan Project in the works, the Soviets began the Ascension Group in hopes to compete and excel past the US. The Nuclear Arms race was in full effect. But for the Soviets, it was too little too late. On July 16, 1945 America succeeded in building the first nuclear weapon before Russia. The test was codenamed "Trinity" The Trinity Test. 1945 The Trinity Test was the code name of the first detonation of a nuclear device. Conducted by Manhattan Project members and the United States Army on July 16, 1945 at the White Sands Proving Ground in New Mexico, the Trinity Test is considered by many to be the beginning of the Atomic Age. The Baruch Plan stated that the United States (at the time the only state possessing atomic weapons) would destroy its atomic arsenal on the condition that the U.N. imposed controls on atomic development. These controls would allow only the peaceful use of atomic energy. The plan was passed by the Commission, but not agreed to by the Soviet Union who abstained on the proposal in the Security Council. Debate on the plan continued into 1948, but by early 1947 it was clear that agreement was unlikely a reasonable conclusion. The Soviets had refused to the Baruch Plan, and for good reason. Work on the first Soviet nuclear weapon had already begun by the Ascension Group and other Soviet personnel, and they had no plans of halting it's production and come across as a weaker power than America. In just two years time, the Soviets would be ready to launch their first nuclear weapon. In the meantime, America would continue their nuclear development and testing after the Soviets refusal of the Baruch Plan. United States Congress decides to hand all future nuclear research and development to the newly formed United States Atomic Energy Commision. United States Atomic Energy Commision. 1946. The Atomic Energy Commision (AEC) was established after the Manhattan Project to foster and control the peace time development of atomic science and technology. President Harry S. Truman signed the Atomic Energy Act on August 1, 1946, transferring the control of atomic energy from military to civilian hands, effective from January 1, 1947. After the AEC came into being in 1947 , former Los Alamos National Laboratory director Robert J. Oppenheimer was appointed as the Chairman of it's General Advisory Committee (GAC), the commitee responsible for providing the high-level scientific and technical advice needed. From this position he advised on a number of nuclear-related issues, including project funding, laboratory construction, and even international policy. Throughout the 1960's, the AEC would fall under scrutiny for limited regulation in several important areas, including radiation protection standards, nuclear reactor safety, plant siting, and environmental protection. The fact that the AEC was in charge of both nuclear development and safety regulations regarding the testing, led to many tests that exposed civilians to lethal doses of radiation. After the Atomic Energy Commission (AEC) came into being in 1947 as a civilian agency in control of nuclear research and weapons issues, Oppenheimer was appointed as the Chairman of its General Advisory Committee (GAC). From this position he advised on a number of nuclear-related issues, including project funding, laboratory construction and even international policy—though the GAC's advice was not always heeded. A little more than a year after the AEC's formation, they would go on to begin their first nuclear test, Operation Sandstone. AEC's First Test: Operation Sandstone. 1947. Operation Sandstone was a series of nuclear weapon tests conducted in 1948. The tests were first authorized by President Harry S. Truman June 27, 1947. Research and development and other technical aspects would be handled by the Los Alamos National Laboratory like previous nuclear tests. It was the third series of American tests, following Trinity in 1945 and Crossroads in 1946. Like the Crossroads tests, the Sandstone tests were carried out at the Pacific Proving Grounds, although at Enewetak Atoll rather than Bikini Atoll. They differed from Crossroads in that they were conducted by the Atomic Energy Commission, with the armed forces having only a supporting role. The purpose of the Sandstone tests was also different, in that they were primarily tests of new bomb designs rather than of the effects of nuclear weapons. The successful testing of the new cores in the Operation Sandstone tests rendered every component of the old weapons obsolete. Even before the third test had been carried out, production of the old cores was halted, and all effort concentrated on the new Mark 4 nuclear bomb, which would become the first mass-produced nuclear weapon. More efficient use of fissionable material as a result of Operation Sandstone would increase the U.S. nuclear stockpile from 56 bombs in June 1948 to 169 in June 1949. - US operation crossroads 1946 -roswell 1947 majestic 12 started 1947 -first soviet nuke rds-1 1949 -Green run months later test to detect radiation 1949 -oppenheimer reads files about verruckt event/vbush files 1955 -first soviet rocket sputnick 1956 -project rover 1957 -JFK speech, goal of "landing a man on the moon and returning him safely to Earth" 1961 Another technology that emerged from the ruins of the Second World War was advanced rocketry, to be more specific, Rockets powered by liquified fuels (chemical rockets). It was Nazi Germany who made the biggest technological contribution with the V-2, the world's first ICBM (Inter-Continental Ballistic Missile). It's designer Werner Von Braun envisaged his machines carrying satellites and eventually man into orbit around the earth and beyond. But at the time, if he wanted to see his ideas developed, there would have to be a military application. So despite his best intentions, unless his devices could be used militarily, his ideas would have never got off the ground (pardon the pun there!). When he, and a group of german scientists who worked with him surrendered to the americans, not only did america have the most destructive weapon known to mankind, but also a delivery system with the potential to deliver the deadly payload. Unfortunately for Von Braun, the american military lost interest in his rockets as a missile delivery system, in favour of using long distance bombers. But the Russians had other ideas. After WWII the allies (UK, USA, France, USSR) decided to divide Germany in two, with the Soviet Union (Russia) taking possession of the east, while the rest shared the west. A underground V-2 development site at Mittlewerk fell under the jurisdiction of the russians, and with the help of their foremost rocket scientist Sergei Korolev it wasn't long before the russians had their own version of the V-2. It wasn't until the Soviets launched their first man-made satellite Sputnik did america sit up and take notice. The Space Race had begun, and america was losing!. After Sputnik the russians saw the huge propoganda value of these rockets and the Space Race served as a distraction away from the frightening realities of the Cold War. Here we had two countries of differing ideoligies threatening each other, each one having enough nuclear firepower to not only destroy each other, but the entire planet! The americans were now playing catch up, and with the russians being well on their way to the next step, putting a man in low earth orbit, they had challenging times ahead. But that's when the americans work best, when faced with a challenge. And with the original designer of the V-2 on their team it wasn't going to be long before they were 'back in the game'. Russia beat the americans again, to put the first man into orbit Yuri Gagarin in 1961, but after that it was america all the way. It was during John F Kennedy's presidency when he set a goal that before the 60's came to a close that america would have a man on the moon. And they did!. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Back on-topic..... Sadly, President Kennedy was assassinated in 1963 but the Apollo moon program continued and nearly 6 years after his death Apollo 11 became the first manned spacecraft to land on the moon. It was during President Kennedy's term that he had his sights firmly set on Mars as the next objective after the manned moon landings. His idea was to have a man on Mars before 1980, and he was keen to explore the most efficient methods of getting there. He was very interested in Nuclear Rocket Propulsion and even paid a visit to Jackass Flats in 1962. Much of the research and development on chemical rockets was carried out at White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico whereas with nuclear powered rocketry it was decided that all research and testing was to be done within a 254 square mile area on the South-western fringe of the NNSS (Formerly NTS) designated Area 25 or Jackass Flats. A number of experiments with Atomic power took place here: •Project Rover (Nuclear Thermal Rocket) - cancelled in favour of.... •Project NERVA (Nuclear Engine for Rocket Vehicle Application) •Project Pluto (Nuclear Ramjet for cruise missiles)

I tried doing the Maxis side solo shortly after it came out (more so to hear the quotes than anything else), and I was unable to the last two steps. I got to the step where you knife the signs in the cavern system to get the wisp to appear. I could get the red orbs to appear by the signs after knifing, but the wisp never appeared. I tried this quite a few times to no avail. And I think a lot of people covered it, but the shooting gallery step would be impossible with only one player.

I don't think anyone here can say the overall cost of the business expenses that Activision goes through when creating a game. Production costs, hiring a development team, designers, concept artists, writers, producers (big name movie producers BTW), voice actors (celebrity voice actors BTW), music composers (famous music composer BTW), overhead costs, marketing costs. All these things go into the making of a game, and they're costs are astronomical nowadays. It's the reason it costs you $60 to buy a game these days. Unless you know the total costs of all these expenses, it's impossible to say how profitable a separate zombies disk would actually be. And again, it's not "will it make us money?", it's "will it make us ALOT of money?". It's not about profit, it's about NET PROFIT. If the extra zombies disk flops and doesn't sell well, Activision will take a major hit. It's all a matter of Risk vs. Reward. That's just business unfortunately.