Chopper

I was checking something out - you put your guns in 10 seconds after my 2nd game in my video, had 6 less kills but still ended up at around the same kills as me at the same time of 2:45, albeit you used 1 more bullet than me (before the crazy 2!). I just sense that there is a limit, and it's basically around 100ish kills for 2:45. Maybe as much as 110. As far as I can see if you had had my start, you would be at least 7 kills up when you started the kite. Plus 10 seconds better of. The fact you caught that up says something to me but I'm not really sure what. I feel that even with my start you would have ended up in the same position. It's almost as if the first few spawns after PAP even themselves out in a strange way. I agree with the methodology of using 1 bullet on smaller groups in certain circumstances but the issue is ammo wastage. The stupid thing is that could be completely irrelevant - If you need 10 bullets to kill the final hoard that you possibly can, and 10 minimum does it matter if you are 2 bullets short or 10? - you are still short.

Very nice mate. Imagine how much more you could get if you PAPed from the bottom ;)

Yes Jay that is the biggest problem with the second grenade, the dogs. You can sometimes manage them into the group with the correct kiting path....I don't know if it comes across like this to you but my paths always look kinda erratic, as if I'm kinda stumbling around lost. Well that's me trying to manipulate the dogs AI and physics to ensure they are at the back or side when I release the grenade. If they are at the front you are screwed. Well, you can survive but say goodbye to those easy additional stabs and shot kills. Seriously, a dog can cost you at this point up to 10 immediate kills and 1000 points. I've been doing some more testing.....after the first grenade is 'clear' only go for dogs. Just get rid of them ASAP. And now try not to kill any zombies. Wait until you have the pack, and then unleash at chest rather than head height. You are sacrificing a couple of slightly earlier kills for some good reasons - If you kill close to the second grenade, know that one is spawned somewhere and likely to bite you in the arse as you are dazed. But even worse is when a dog spawns in a really inappropriate location compared to you and at best you delay your grenade, at worse you don't even live to see the damage!

Here's the thing, past level 35 or so the game changes. It's when the spawns are at a point where although not at full speed you should have less issue. On topic they will work in theory up until level 44 or 45, that's when it starts taking 12 bullets at your feet to get through a few zombies. It may be slightly less shots but I know by round 45 I only use them for trying to get ammo on maps where you have been spamming the wonder. Certainly with COTD, which I may try for 50 on in an hour actually, you should forget about them past round 35. It's a completely mental thing, my kiting and I'm sure others is the same is cleaner when I do not have a wonder weapon out. You are much less sloppy when you don't have a get out of jail free gun. If you are aiming for much past 40, especially on COTD get rid of the reliance on them ASAP, you have a long way to go when you can't use them effectively so I say try earlier :)

Mate I totally understand where you are coming from I've had it ready for about 6 weeks now, but then I've started doing a lot of other stuff and have kind of neglected it. Then when I play I tend to mess around trying new things 90% of the time. I've had one or two mega starts, I even had a 310 the other day 18 bullets left and then made a stupid mistake. That would have come mighty close I think, definitely 340 + As I say in the video to actually do it and pull it off you have to be awesome from start to finish and the spawns have to match. It's a rare combination. The most frustrating thing I find is when I have a full group and just slightly mistime my doubleshot and hit a single dog and don't kill 1 zombie. It sucks. And for what I personally believe is the absolute maximum of 370 everything has to be perfect.

These starts are far from perfect. You can be as much as 10 kills up on these numbers at the same points in game. The spawns are so erratic which is the biggest issue on a high kill run.

COTD lighthouse door and George. Hey, I would still use it. But only for breaks on really high co-op runs, it just means that nothing accidentally goes wrong and you come back to see yourself spectating ;)

Congrats guys, if you post in here you'll get some brains for sure.

You will see in the video I promise, a massive part of it is how you start and in going on the pad. The games I will show aren't even the best starts, they could be at least 10 kills higher with the right things happening.

Tom's method is by far the most fun I've ever seen!

Ok guys, a guide has been discussed between Eye, Super and myself, looks like it is going to happen. I am making a video at the minute comparing 2 starts I did today pretty much back to back. The results are interesting. Just to tease one game I had Juggs, 102 kills and 6 M&S used in 2 minutes 45 seconds, the other I had no Juggs, 104 kills and 5 M&S used in 2 minutes 43 seconds. This is mainly for you Tom ;)

This may help one or two people out. uWG_l_JZY0U

This has always been the only thing I have never been able to make up my mind with on NML, 1 shot into 1/2 a group or 2 into a full group. Alot depends on the time, which you can only feel. If you get everything done very quickly you can use 1 shot after PAPing and clear nearly 20 zombies if done correctly and within time. However, if you are not going to beat the buzzer that stops them being 1 hit M&S kill it's better to clear the crawlers and a couple of dogs ASAP. I've spoken with Eye about this a lot, I know that in a few of the videos that he has seen of mine he believes that the starts are better with 1 shot at a time. I think it entirely depends on the spawns. If they are fast wait for a full group, if they seem slow and you have 10 get rid of them. Just be aware that if they don't die on 1 shot you have in effect wasted a bullet.

Like Super my opinion changes regularly, at the minute I am absolutely loving Verruckt, there's more to the map than you first think. Just for killing zombies though Kino takes some beating.

Nice work Super, these figures are pretty similar to the ones I have. The only slight difference I take into account is time, especially where you are at the 5 minute mark when they start taking 3 shots to kill each group. All the high games I studied the only one which is different was Steve's recent 354 when he was at around 180 kills for 5 minutes. But the spawns he had after that point were amazing which helped him catch up before the 8 minute mark or so when they are 6 or more.

Massive congrats mate, this is seriously impressive. I've been working so hard on trying to get a No Jugg 300 that I've kinda let my score linger. This has given me the incentive to try and bump it up again D) I was talking with Vizual Venom, we both believe that someone will definitely at some point hit 360 and the absolute max is 370. I'd love to see the video, was it recorded?

It seems pretty simple to me tbh, having 2 people in this area only makes it easier. Especially if two people are good at reading each other's movements. That's of course if the people are highly skilled at kiting and merging. Eye we could do this no problems at all.

Thanks mate, I'm convinced it is the quickest way to get to 50...if I can work out how to incorporate both traps. Otherwise the time you gain on the collection will be negated by having to wait for the trap upstairs to cool down.

If you can get past 30 then it becomes so much easier. Round 17-25 can be a bit problematic with the spawn speeds, the late 20's are ok if you are careful but then it just works!

Hey guys, here is my latest video on Verruckt which shows how I do things between levels 11 and 18. I've never heard or seen of anyone using the strategy of keeping the QR door shut......damn it's effective! lqSSvM58seo

Damn that was on point Tom. [brains] I thought I could kill on sight for longer with a wall gun than you actually can, but from some Verruckt earlier it's apparent it's more like 11 or 12. The main one I want to know is, and Tom gave his answer on at what round does the speed of spawn overwhelm your ability to select zombies and kill, within a very small moving area. And it's somewhere between 15 and 20, which on thinking about it I agree with.

You're very welcome mate. I know you only have 5 posts but you should definitely stick around on here. I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one to admit that being on CODZ, reading and participating in the various topics has made me a much much better player :)

Hey Guys, So a topic which I personally have put a lot of thought into is when it's optimal to do certain things. Now none of this is necessary in anyway, it's just something I like to think about. At what point in the game does it become quicker to hoard and kill rather than kill on sight with say a Ray Gun? At what point in the game does it become quicker to move from a wall gun to a box gun, and still be able to kill immediately on sight? At what point during the late 20's to 40's do the levels start becoming slightly quicker as the spawn speed picks up? Any ideas?

I'm talking about solo mate. When I first started playing I could play on Kino for 2 hours and be happy with just messing around and getting to round 35 or so, going slowly. It's not often anymore that I just sit down and play zombies. I'm always trying for some kind of challenge, and if that is a high round game I would do it that way, fun until 20, maybe 25 and then straight up hoard and get rid of.

I think Tom makes a great point. It's why past round 20 I pretty much go into a hoard and rid mode, the first 20 are for fun with the wall guns and then you want it to start going quickly most of the time.