Mattzs

Shangri-la is a reference to "Paradise": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradise I know that Shangri-La means paradise, but it is a Buddhist paradise. All cultures and ethnicities have their own paradises and words for paradise, but this whole concept is East Asian. The actual word and concept of the place is based on the mythical kingdom of Shambala. Shambala is included as a part of the Pure Land sect of Buddhism. It is specifically a Buddhist parades, which is why I did not get the Aztec vibe. The term is culturally specific.

I figured that. I realize that there is not enough evidence, but I thought it might be neat to bring up. Although it does seem like the cult is in response to the outbreak, maybe the cult was "underground" before the time of Moon. Maybe by the time of the outbreak the cult finally emerged from hiding to take control of the chaos. It would be a perfect time for them to "surface" because their worship of the undead/the controller has appeared on a global scale. The outbreak could be "their second comming", there savior (the announcer and his zombies) has finally arrived on earth. Maybe it would even be like their rapture. The earth will be born anew i.e. filled with death and destruction. A new age would begin for them. I also said it might be more of a precursor to the cult. I know that there is not a clear reference to Satanism, but didn't followers of the cult worship Richtofen until they rejected him. What is interesting is in the Die Rise radios the cult talks about how science and religion have failed "us", but the cult has the answer. So they must look to some type of higher power? Again, I know there isn't much evidence, but I wanted to bring it up.

The title essentially says it all, but with all the ritual alters, sacrificial tables, and skulls, cold this map have the precursor to the Cult of Flesh? Just a thought. What do you guys think?

Although, I personally believe that the announcer is some type of Demon or Satan who has bestowed power and has been worshiped by the Vril People, I am open to the idea that it might be an Aztec God. I just had a few questions that I was wondering what your insight would be on them. My first question to you is, how do you connect your idea to Infest Lithium’s Cerberus theory? I know you have addressed your interpretation of the Hellhound in MotD, but Lithium’s post makes a great connection to Cerberus. I even noticed that in one of the pictures linked in that thread, the dog outlines on the walls in MotD make it appear that the Hellhound might have 3heads. The thread: viewtopic.php?f=149&t=31193&p=298014#p298014 My other question is, how do you approach the classical/Christian references in the map? Although the Aztecs did preform human sacrifice, sacrifice has also been associated with Paganism (which had been associated with Satanism). In one of Julius Cesar’s writings of his campaigns in Gaul, he writes that the Celts preform human sacrifice. Whether or not that s true is open to debate, but the connection still remains. I have also heard that one of Billy’s quotes refers to Pandora’s Box. Essentially the Greek Myth in a nutshell is the story of a woman that is given a box that contains all of the world’s monsters/evil inside. She opens the box and boom, all evil is released. Could the Box be the MPD? The map along with its Native American mythological influences also has a heavy European mythological/religous influence. Now the connection of the Classics to Satanism lies within the concept of Hell. The Christian concept of Hell comes from the Classical concept of Hades/Pluto’s underworld. Along with the concept of Hell, Christianity and paganism are also connected in that fact that they oppose each other. Paganism is like the antagonist to Christianity. Also, remember Faust in Kino? The final question that I have is with Shangri ’La. Shang baffles me. Even when I first started playing it, I felt like it had a Aztec vibe. But, what bothers me is that Shangri-La based on the Buddhist Concept of Shambhala. It should have had a Tibetan or at least a Chinese feel to it. Even if Shang was on Mars (which I do not believe) it would have still originated psychically and metaphorically from the East. I know Eldorado is an Incan concept, but it would have made more sense to name it that than Shangri‘La. Overall, I really think you are on to something! But I think we need to think bigger! Since we have gotten references to many forms of death/demonic gods maybe the announcer is just a death god in general. He could have inspired the Vril people and created legends of himself throughout the world. Please I am not trying to be mean or discredit you, I am just curious. You did a great job and asking questions is my specialty! As long as it is not aliens, I am fine with this theory! I am sorry if my post does not make sense. I hope it is coherent. I am currently multitasking and am rushing to get all my ideas down before I forget.

Disclaimer before reading - I truly and wholeheartedly do not believe this tinfoil hat theory. But, it might be some food, possibly unhealthy, food for thought. With the "Fear Rus" theory, the "Stop Rus" theory, and "Russ is the man in the sky" theory, I thought I might aswell put my conspiracy cap on. I made this post in another thread so it might seem a little out of place, but here it is: I hate to fuel the fire, because I truly don’t believe the Russman theory. But let’s say this is true- IS Russman the devil? If all this “fear Rus" stuff is true and that is his face is in MotD(which I personally do not believe), then he could be the controller of the zombies or some ethereal being. I believe his character could point to the possibility of him being something else( NOT someone else). HE is a scruffy looking, vagabond type character. He has no home, nor does he belong anywhere. His is homeless, unnoticeable to the public, someone in the background. A wanderer, he goes anywhere becuase earth is NOT his home. Just like a spirit he roams. No one would guess him to be any harm. He appears as a powerless man on this earth. This all hints that his home, place of belonging, and true power lay elsewhere. It would be easy for some type of being to take the form of a homeless man. He is right under our nose. Who would guess it? Most people see "Oh, here is just another crazzy, senial, old man. Walk away, don't make eye contact". But, that is exactly what "Russ" would want, he doesn't want people to know. Is that why he takes kindly to Stu? Which is why he would connect to the Satanic Atmosphere of MotD. Although it doesn’t really explain why he was able to be killed in the Die Rise trailer (I know he isn’t dead, I know it was a part of the cycle) but, he could have easily faked his death as he is omnipotent. And how he knows Misty prior to Green Run but, he could have been on earth for a while. Annnnd that is about it for my tin-foil hat of the day theories. Please take this with a KILO of salt. I don't believe it either and I am not crazy! Trust me, I have much theories and ideas. Don't judge me by this one. :D

Infest Lithium, I really do think you are on to something. I remember in another thread, I asked if there were going to be any more Classical references in MotD given the fact that we have a character named Brutus, a plane named Icarus, and then including them in a story featuring an Italian character, possibly two(Is Billy Italian? I know Sal is). And you have answered my prayers! Now all we need is some Latin and Greek writing and we will have the full package ! Anyway , when I look at the picture above me, the heads on the left and right almost look as if they are attached to the same body. Notice how the left and right head is slightly angled. Think about it, if they weren’t on the same body, why would the left and right head be titled? They would be facing us in straight position, like the center head. I believe it is because they can’t be centered. The center head is literally the "center head".

I want to connect this theory further to Der Riese. Now remember before BO1 came out, and even months before MW2 , that there was the “1:15 Clock theory” in Der Riese. Essentially just like the clock in MotD, the clock in Der Riese kept resetting (or was it stuck?) on the same time, 1:15. This led some to theorize that In Der Riese, the O4 were stuck in a time loop. What if they really were? Ironically, since this team worked on Der Riese before, I think it is possible for them to re-use some of Der Riese’s themes. What if the O4 could have been stuck in this rift for ages until an anomaly happened? Off course they wouldn’t be ghosts, but they still could have been in this cycle of unknowing repetition. What if somehow in this loop Richtofen broke the cycle when he used the WunderWaffe and it miraculously, by fate or chance, sent them into the Future? The events of Der Riese might not have been linear. Maybe the O4 lived the cycle in Der Riese for a while until this different result occurred. I believe this theory that the O4 were stuck in a loop should definitely be re-examined considering the events of MotD.

I don't know about you, but I don't think getting a good chunk of your side being chomped off is exactly "faking". Lol, he must be a good actor. No, what I meant was that he, if beng a supernatural being, could fake dying in a human form. He isn't human, he takes the form of one. Trust me, I don't believe it either. But if it is true maybe that is why he has a close relationship to Stu? Honestly, I thought it might not be God, but the devil or something. I don't think God would appear in that vile of a form to them. It is defintely something toying with them. I whole-heartedly and truly do not believe my tinfoil Russ theory, but I might as well throw it out there. And, I hate jump scares. I am so glad I found that out before I played the map. Now I am too scared to scope around the map.

I hate to fuel the fire, because I truly don’t believe the Russman theory. But let’s say this is true- IS Russman the devil? If all this “fear Rus stuff “is true and that is his face (which I personally do not believe), then he could be the controller of the zombies or some ethereal being. Even his character could point to it. HE is a scruffy looking, vagabond type character. He has no home, nor does he belong anywhere. His is homeless, unnoticeable to the public, someone in the background. A wanderer, he goes anywhere becuase earth is NOT his home. Just like a spirit he roams. No one would guess him to be any harm. He appears as a powerless man on this earth. This all hints that his home, place of belonging, and true power lay elsewhere. It would be easy for some type of being to take the form of a homeless man. He is right under our nose. Who would guess it? Most people see "Oh, here is just another crazzy, senial, old man. Walk away, don't make eye contact". Is that why he takes kindly to Stu? Annnnd that is about it for my tin-foil hat of the day theories. Although it doesn’t really explain why he was able to be killed in the Die Rise trailer (I know he isn’t dead, I know it was a part of the cycle) but, he could have easily faked his death. And how he knows Misty prior to Green Run but, he could have been on earth for a while.

But why is that? Well when you get off the island you get a sign saying no one escapes the prison or what not. But the achievement pop goes the weasel ends with by killing some who caused it or sacrificing that person to break the cycle. The greatest thing about this is did Sam knew this the whole time back on moon. Oh no, I understand that, but what I was saying is that the song is an overview of their struggle. It is not necessarily the end of their journey, but a song more about their process. This is and possibly isn’t all before they broke the cycle. BUT the key concept to the song is this “cycle” of death. It emphasizes their fear and uncertainty on their escape, their attempts to achieve freedom, and the possibility of even dying. The repetition of the lyrics like “How do we know, Where do we go” evoke this idea of being stuck in a cycle as they are repeated throughout the song. BUT the ending of the song either shows their death or “deaths” (if they are still in the cycle). My interpretation of lyrics “Where do we go, When we let go” – When we die what is or is there an afterlife? “I feel I’m falling, From here, From here”- Entering the afterlife, That stage in between life and death. Maybe this is where they become trapped i.e. purgatory “Don’t let me go”- Fear of death, wanting to return to reality “Is it the calling We Hear We Hear”- Is this really death? Are we leaving now? “How Do How Do We Know”- Continuation of message above. The song is open ended as it could be argued that they finally died by the end of the song and are being “released” to the afterlife OR it could also be argued that this “release” at the end of the song is them entering purgatory once again. Even the tune of the song points towards this idea of entering true death or cyclical deaths. The tune is very ethereal like and almost floats. Most of them don’t remember, if not vaguely their past attempts so- “How do we know”? What is interesting to note is that they are prisoners afraid of death. They have done terrible things and as their time draws near where would they fear? Do they fear going to Hell? Which is intriguing given the layout and atmosphere of the map. All of the zombie songs give a type of backstory to each map. None of them would actually reveal the entire easter egg or the ending. The songs give the players more insight on the map.

I thought it was them being stuck in the "cycle". Just repeated attempts to escape and not getting anywhere.

On the official Call of Duty Black Ops Facebook page they have posted two bits of info on MotD. I am not sure if there is any useful information on the actual page, but they recently released pictures of the four characters and their bios. Before Uprising came out, they released 4 individual pictures of the MotD characters. Whatever character’s picture received the most likes, Treyarch would release a bonus picture of him. Billy won and now there is a "bonus" picture of him on the page. Now, I am not sure if that was meant to be a snapshot of what the map/gameplay looks like or if there are easter eggs in the picture. I am curious, did anyone else see this? And if you have, did you find any significance in the picture? ALSO, today they released a short video briefly explaining our character’s backgrounds/personalities. https://www.facebook.com/#!/codblackops?hc_location=stream Both on the front page. Thanks for readin’!

I saw that in Kevin's video and I was thinking the same thing. Maybe we need to match up its corresponding RNA and then figure out the whole protein? If I remember correctly: DNA - RNA T - A A - U G - C C - G

In the scene with Sal talking to the guard, there are tally marks behind him! I know this is common in the stereotypical movie/tv prisons, but we also have tally marks to count the zombie rounds.

Thanks,I appreciate it! I try my best. I am sure we have a whole lot more coming by tomorrow.

I know this wouldn't make sense given the fact that the we have the whole purgatory, limbo, and death concept but, DO you think it is possible that the electric chairs aren't really electric chairs at all and are really teleporters? Like, the don't really kill you per se, but still send you to purgatory. The idea of a teleporter would tie in with our previous zombie theme of teleportation. Ironically, Der Riese was the first map to feature the in game teleporters and this specific team assigned to make the map made Der Riese as well. Also, do you think when we die we can switch bodies with other downed players? Being that we don't know how you chose your own character is it entirely possible that when you die you can enter the body of another downed player? Could this be a part of the easter egg?

This may be a stretch, but do you think that there is any significance that two of the characters (I think Billy is) are Italian and the map is filled with these Greco-Roman Classical references? Now, I understand the Italian Mafia was highly active during Prohibition Era, hence the Italian characters in Alcatraz. But, since this era pre-dates our Samantha-Edwardo timeline, it could have easily been omitted from the zombie storyline and we wouldn’t have ever put much thought into a connection to the Prohibition Era- Great Depression. The zombie’s team could have easily chosen any other time period to continue the story and they specifically chose the 20s-30s. I find it interesting that we have Italian Characters with references to the Classics. Will there be Latin or Greek Phrases on this map? I hope I am making sense, it has been a long day. Also could it be possible that, Brutus is an allusion to the Minotaur and Alcatraz is an allusion the Minotaur’s Labyrinth

You may want to check it out this thread : http://callofdutyzombies.com/forum/view ... 49&t=30935 Aaaaaannd, I was beaten to the point. Sorry about that.

He refers to the plane as Icarus, is that another hint that they are going to fail or get trapped within the cycle? Icarus is a story from Greek mythology and if I remember it correctly… The story of Icarus goes- Icarus, the son of a craftsmen, and his father are imprisoned on the Island of Crete. Their jailor is the Minotaur (Maybe some connection to Brutus?) and they are kept within his labyrinth (Alcatraz = Minotaur’s Labyrinth?). They soon decide to escape by making wings out of the feathers from their pillow sheets and sealing them with candle wax. Their escape is successful, but the father warns the son, once they leave the Labyrinth not to fly to close to the sun as the wax will melt. Long story short, he flies close to the sun, wax melts, and he perishes into the sea. I am assuming that the plane does make it to the Golden Gate Bridge, but I still think that this reference doesn’t exactly make the mobster’s plane their savior. Any thoughts?

The MDT is more of the outer shell in this sense. Think of it as the skin that encompasses everything within it. The device itself is a constraint of what we know as the gateway to the Aether. Samantha's body acts as the skeleton for which a physical form was granted access, yet the spirit and soul is the nervous system. Once the spirit "turns on", it can control the Aether as a tool for destruction. This is why Richtofen switched souls; he could realistically just move her body and attempt to place his, but even he knew that the Aether would not embody him in that way. Instead, he used the ancient Vril technology to make the transfer of souls happen. Power soon became his as the switch happened. The body does not change because it cannot and will not change - it's nothing more than the outer layer that surrounds the central being. If you remove the body, then you also remove the connection between the Aether and the real world. Why would Richtofen want remove such a link when all he has to do is switch souls and instantly obtain control? Sorry, I don't think explain my self enough sometimes. What I meant was that if each MDT reflected apart of man then why didn't the body MDT require a body. I was thinking that each MDT embodied a specific apsect of man, the body, the soul, and the spirit (mind?) and so I thought that it would require the right key. Think of it as the stereotypical child’s toy where you have a cube, pyramid, and cylinder and you have to put them in their corresponding wooden slot. The cube goes in the square hole, pyramid goes in the triangle hole and cylinder in the circle hole. Now take the blocks and shapes and replace them with the parts of the “body” and MDTs. Each part of the “body” would have to go in the corresponding MDT. The soul MDT would require one’s soul, the body MDT would require a physical body, and the spirit MDT would require a spirit (mind?). I was just basing my question on this theory. Also, if spirit= mind, then doesn’t Richtofen control the minds of the zombies? Since the zombies have a hive mentality, then Richtofen must have some influence over their thoughts to keep them in line. Unless..... the will and spirit of the zombies are trying to fight back. That would tie into my theory of the “We all Fall Down” song. One of the lines says something like “Controls are feeling fine despite the awful sounds”. My theory is that the awful sounds are the sounds and thoughts of the zombies he is controlling. Maybe he hears them because he can’t control their rebellious thoughts? Hope I am making sense.

Like tac has said, I doubt they wouldn't have the exact details of gryphon station planned out from the start but rather they put orange dots on the moon, and then confirm them to be 115 in the terminal, so that going to the moon would always be a crazy option they would have. There was a picture of the Eiffel Tower in Der Riese but if they bring out a pairs map in BO2 that doesn't mean they had that map planned since then, just that it was an idea that they had Ok, that is what I was thinkng, but I wasn't sure. Treyarch has been so cryptic that I tend to not know what to make of everything they do. But, its Treyarch's specialty to play mind games with us.

Sorry what I meant by the 115 crater was the orange lights you could see on the moon in Der Riese. You had to zoom in with the PTRS-41. You would see a ring of orange dots. The dots later seemed to actually be the Moon Base, but I am confused on whether or not this ring was intended to be the Gryphon Station from the start. UPDATE- Sorry Tac, I guess we posted around the same time. I didn't see your quote til now.

Oh no, I meant the significance of his 16 crimes. Not why he went to jail, but why did he have 16 similarly to Billy's 116. This is another thing that confuses me. Did Treyarcg ret-con this? Back in WAW in the map description for Richtofen said he has schizophrenia. I can't seem to find it now. I will try to find the quotes and post them later. I did find this description, but I KNOW there is an official description of him somewhere that says he has schizophrenia. And there was another statement that said before the war he was a black-market plastic surgeon. "Beware The Doc". A message that was scrawled across walls of every town under Axis control. Starvation may cripple you, dysentery may wreck you, and gunfire may rip the flesh from your bones, but "Beware The Doc". This is Dr. Richtofen, known affectionately as "The Butcher" to his victims as they scream in agony moments before he snuffs out their light. All through his career, Richtofen has been at the forefront of torture and information extraction research. Richtofen is an incurable sociopath and sees no moral distinction between natural death and murder; the victim is the victim, regardless of how their demise manifests itself. Doctor Richtofen has a collection of stuffed animals, most of them posed in positions of terror at the instant of their death." Although the above statement can be argued that he became a sociopath after touching the MDT, the quote above seems to state that he was always somewhat mentally unstable. The moon backstory only refers to his work with 935, but nothing of his torture research and pre-war surgery. Was all of this retconned?

The one that got him in jail Wow! That makes a lot of sense. Neat! I am going to give this theory more thought. I will be back, lol. But what about Finn?

Getting back to the different team question, how much creative control was this team given? Did the zombie guys give them the story and the main idea for an easter egg, but let them fill in the blanks with gameplay/visuals and minor plot details? Why did these guys work on Der Riese?