83457

51 on WaW or BO is quite beastly. 51 on BO3 is a bit more feasible, but quite nice. /my opinion. I also imagine pc mouse control to be much better than console, as is true for most games where I've played both versions. However, I've not played pc zombies, so I might be off. During BO2, I studied all the folk on the leaderboards, counting only those who played a map at least 100 times, so that you know that they tried. I found a very tiny percent made it past 30 in any map. I find most folk in random games try to camp and survive, which made Treyarch seem out of touch these last couple of games by forcing the training/kiting on folk. If they made zombies more camp friendly for early rounds (in map and spawn design, not in willy nilly perk design), it would appeal to a much larger audience, while still allowing 5% of players to do the long game training sessions. /my 2 pennies worth.

Delgado means slender more or less. Jack Slenderman. Eeeek!

Ah, then perhaps I'm just slightly less mad than the universe likes to portray me as. I would never have even noticed had those fellows not been so surprised by it.

Wow, good question! And thanks for that info. Send 83457 money: Lourdes Ayton 666 Ninth Level Terrace Living Inn, Missouri

This is a companion thread to my SoE thread "Moar Zombie Maps Inside!" and the Der Eisendrache "Moar DE..." thread, dissecting and discussing the map and playing options. (Note that these 2 mentioned threads have been renamed "Moar of Shadows of Evil" and "Moar of Der Eisendrache", so all of my "Moar of..." threads align and can he searched easily. I have a Moar thread for each map except Gorod Krovi so far. 1.25.2019). Too often, I hear "The Giant is just DR reprinted, so go read up on that". But not everyone played WaW or the BO1 reprints, and the game is a little different now too, with Gobblegum, different weapon-types in old spots (Shotgun is on Thompson side), extra Perks, Perks and Box that randomize, and the Annihilator. Even the way the zombies move is changed (note that they fall into the tunnel now). So, this thread is here to describe the map rooms, item locations in said rooms, common map openings, uncommon map openings, unusual gameplay options, and camping and training spots of varying quality. ------------------------- Most abreviations are as SoE "Moar" thread, but in short: (####) = Amount of points to purchase or use item. TP = Teleporter (TP A, TP B, TP C). Note that they are called teleporter 1, 2, and 3 by the Maxis Voice (announcer). BL = Box Location (950). PL = Perk Location (Various Pricing). GG and GGm = GobbleGum and GG Machine. GGm prices are not listed, starts at (500) each round. MB = Monkey Bomb. TM = Trip Mine (1000). BK = Bowie Knife (3000). PaP = Pack-A-Punch Machine (5000/2500). Trap = Electric Trap (1000). MF = Mainframe. 1. Camp = Move little while mostly facing one direction. >Window = Window watching player [calls out if swarmed] >Marksman = Headshotter [Calls out reloads]. >Shortstop = Often between Window and Marksmen, helps Marksmen mostly, but is also Window's definitive back-up, giving support where needed [Should have MB, and fast reflexes]. + 2. Train = Move around zombies. >Loop = Long distance training around map. >Circle = Train in a relative circle around zombies in a single spot. >Reverse = Turn tight 180° to go back the way you came, either making an 8 or C shape, or if blocked while looping/circling. ------------------------- Areas and Items Available: [Stand at PaP, face Clock. TP A area will be to the <Left; first room on left is Room L1. TP B area will be >Right; First area on Right is Room R1. Many rooms have specific names, (even several), so I'll use this method to start, then address individual rooms of note after]. # (< is Left, > is Right, - is centered) -Mainframe (Pack-a-punch): All players load here at Start. Each Teleporter takes you here. Items: Shieva (500), RK5 (500), PaP [Link all 3 TPs to Mainframe to access PaP]. Doors: Ramp Door (750), to Room L1. Steps Door (750) to Room R1. # <Room L1 (Aisle 4, Flytrap hall, The Alley): This is the end of a hall of the Concourse that makes up the middle of the map once power is on. It is blocked off by a metal wall until then, making it a room. Items: GGm, L-CAR-9 (750), Trap w/L2 open. Doors: Mainframe door (750), Room L2 door (750), Power-activated door to Concourse. # >Room R1: This is the end of a hall of the Concourse that makes up the middle of the map once power is on. It is blocked off by a metal wall until then, making it a room. Items: GGm, KRM-262 (750), Trap w/R2 open. Doors: Mainframe door (750), Room R2 door (750), Power-activated door to Concourse. # <Room L2 (Animal Testing, Lower Left): Items: GGm, Kuda (1250), BL, Trap w/L1 open. Doors: Room L1 (750), TP A (1250), Upstairs Left (1000). # >Room R2 (Warehouse, Garage, Thompson Room, Lower Right): Items: VMP, BL, PL, Trap w/R1 open. Doors: Room R1 (750), Upstairs Right (1000). # <Upstairs Left (Juggernog Hall): [Juggernog likely won't be there, but that's it's old name]. Items: Trip Mines (1000), PL. Doors: L2 (Animal Testing) (1000). Drop spot to Concourse below. Bridge to Upstairs Right with power on. # >Upstairs Right (Double Tap Ledge [DT2 likely won't be there, but that's the old name], The Ledge). Items: PL, GGm. Doors: R2 (Lower Right) (1000), TP B (750). Drop spot to Concourse below. Bridge to Upstairs Left with power on. # <Teleporter A: (Left TP). Items: TP to MF (1500), M8A7 (1500), BL, Frags (250). Doors: From L2 (Animal Testing) (1250). If you are here, it's open. # >Teleporter B: (Right TP, Upstairs). Items: TP to MF (1500), HVK-30 (1600), BL, Frags (250). Doors: From Upstairs Right (750). If you are here, it's open. # -Concourse: (Power, by Power Switch, by ?Box [it always started here in Der Riese]). Items: Vesper (1250), PL, BL, (Hidden PL too), Trap, Power Switch [Activating Power Switch activates PaP, Perks, and lowers the Bridge and the metal walls by L1, and R1, making them ends of hallways of the Concourse, and therfore connecting the map in one or possibly two paths back up top to the Bridge. If Room L1 was not open at all, that area is now a team camp spot]. Doors: TP C (1250), 2 simultaneous power-activated doors to Rooms L1 and R1. # -Teleporter C: [Opposite end of map from mainframe]. Items: TP to MF (1500), GGm, KN-44 (1400), Frags (250), PL, BK (3000). Doors: From Concourse (1250). If you are here, it's open. ☆That's the basic content of The Giant's areas. + ☆Specific Areas and Uses: ♢ Each TP Room. >1. Camp 4 player. Basically 2 Window, 2 Marksmen. ♢ TP ? >1. 'The Catwalk'. Go up the tall steps, camp at the end, 1-4 players. 1 player can be in the opening over BK (solo or mp). >2. The Floor solo: Good circle training, and run up KN-44 steps and jump off/repeat is effective. >3. 4 Player Perk Camp. 1 Window, 2 Marksmen, 1 Shortstop. [Alternately: 1 Catwalk, 3 Perk Room]. This window is hard to maintain, i don't recommend this. >4. Solo camp KN-44. Headshot w/Turned LMG. <30 Rounds. ♢ TP B: >1. A CODZ member recommended running solo clockwise around vat next to frag room. ♢ Room L1: ["Clean up in Aisle 4"-Tank]. >1. 'Aisle 4': 2-4 Player Camp (Best w4). Turn on Power through Right Side, come to Room L1. P1 is Window, P2 is Marksman, P3 is Marksman, P4 is Shortstop. [Players choose their role]. Emergency Escape w/Trap to L2, or EE to MF option. ♢ Room R2 (Thompson Room, Lower Right, Garage, Warehouse): >1. Open Left Side to Power, cross Bridge, open Stair Debris between Upstairs Right and Thompson. >1a. Camp. Walk down steps, make right, turn to face VMP wallbuy. Headshot. If 2+ players, mix with 1b. Emergency Escape to R1. >1b. Camp. Down steps, cross room, go right to corner. If 2+ players, mix with 1a. >1c. Solo Train. Near Trap door to R1. Mix with 1a, above. Emergency Escape to R1. >2. Hard Camp 4 player. Instead, open R2 only from R1. 2 Window, 2 Marksmen. Semi-Escape to Upstairs Right. Electric Trap to reload and/or double up on Windows momentarily. >2a. Solo Train. Activate Trap if desired. ♢ Mainframe Room. >1. RK5 Solo Camp. Camp by RK 5, circle as needed. May work with 2+. Seems to be best with Ramp Door closed. >2. Camp 4 player. Ramp Door closed, Steps Door open. Windowman by Ramp Door, 2 Marksman by RK 5 (circle + camp), Shortstop on Mainframe proper (stay near PaP, watch railing break mostly). ♢ Concourse: [area by Power Switch] >1. Solo circles (or circle mp games alone here). >2. MP lone player camp/circle. With campers at the catwalk, stay closer to the bridge than the Power Switch and you should get almost no rear attacks, stay left by barrels, headshot. ♢ Room L2 (Animal Testing). >1. 4 Player Camp. This should be easier than WaW. Open from L1. Don't open Steps Debris. [TP A can be open]. 2 window [effects may help each other], 2 Marksmen. L1+2 Trap can help. Emergency Escape Steps. ♢ Room R1. (I call this Aisle 5). >1. 4 Player Camp. This was doable, but hectic in WaW, should be easier in BO3. 1 Window man should be able to cover both windows with Sniper or LMG early, 1 Shortstop/Window back-up, leaving 2 Marksmen on Hallway. Emergency Escape: R2 Trap Door (possibly camp R2 next if R2 was still sealed), or EE to MF option. ♢ Upstairs Left (Juggernog Hall). [This was a disaster in WaW, I haven't tested it this in BO3, but I'll mention it]. >1. 4 man camp. 2 Window by perk. 2 Marksmen on Bridge. Communicate well. >2. 4 man camp. 2 Marksmen on Bridge. 2 Marksmen by door to animal testing (By Trip Mines). Bridge players drop down to escape, Trip Mine players may drop down or open animal testing (L2) for escape. ♢ "The Pit" (The Original, revisited) + "The Pit Extended". [For 'No Power' Game Modes. Only 'Anywhere But Here!' GG can get you out]. >1. 'The Pit'. Drop from Upstairs Left or Right. Do not activate Power nor open TP C. [Vesper, BL]. >1a. 'The Pit Extended'. As 1, but open TP C also. [Vesper, KN-44, BL x2, Bowie Knife, Frags, GGm]. ----------------------------------------------------------- Perks in The Giant: [5 Randomized Perk Locations as 'PL' above]. Any PL may be; >Double Tap 2 (2000) [Fire 20% faster, each bullet becomes 2]. >Juggernog (2500) [Strength: 2 more zombie hits]. >Mule Kick (4000) [Carry 3rd gun until downed]. >Speed Cola (3000) [Faster reloads+]. >Quick Revive in 2-4 Player (1500) [Revive others time halved]. + >Quick Revive Solo (500) [Self revive. 3 purchases allowed]. Hidden Perk: [Under snow in Aisle 4]. >Stamin-Up (2000) [Run some] Or >Deadshot Daiquiri (1500) [Headshotaide]. Expose hidden Perk: Get Monkey Bombs, throw an MB into a TP (weird sound), then (any player) teleport(s) to MF. Repeat for each TP. A green light will light up on the MF small panel each time. When all 3 are lit, a red button will flash. Hold X (ps# □) to activate. The extra perk is randomly DD or SU. ----------------------------------------------------------- Special Weapon (From "Hide and Seek"/Flytrap. Rechargeable): Annihilator Pistol; 15-shot high-power pistol. ----------------------------------------------------------- Check the Zombies Library thread above for details of Special Weapons, Hidden Perks, and various 'Easter Eggs', if you are seeking that knowledge. Thanks to Pinnaz. ## ## ## ## ## ## ## ## ## ## ## Map Builds: These designs will show how to utilize different areas or be for fun, like GobbleGame, No Power, or worse. Maps separated by ######... ############################### Basic Giant Map 1: "Catwalk and Run"; Solo or 2P Loop [with guidance for beginners] [Map can be played by 4 players, loop is good for up to 2]. [This is the most common map opening of WaW, due to in-game factors of that time. Currently (BO3), this gives the quickest access to all perks, since a Perk Location has been added in R2]. [I used to start on the DT Ledge in WaW, but that ledge is harder in BO3, and The Catwalk is easier, so i often start at The Catwalk and then run the loop, giving me an easier headshot train at The Ledge. Use caution with the "Warehouse Defense" electric Trap (R1-2) as it will cause massive respawn traffic coming down the steps. Freely use the "Bridge Defense" (Bridge Trap) around 30+ or when desired. Rules: Specific Map openings only. Map build: From Mainframe, open Room R1 Door (750), Room R2 Door (750) [Recommend VMP (1300)], and the Steps Debris to Upper Right (1000) [Camp on Ledge opposite PL, or drop by Power Switch for early points]. Drop to Concourse, activate Power Switch. Open TP C (1250) Door. Link TP C to MF. [Recommend Bowie Knife early]. Make points. Open TP B (750) from Upstairs Right and link the TP. Open Room L2 from Concourse Hallway (Aisle 4, Flytrap), open TP A from Room L2. Link TP. [Recommend ?Box. Recommend PaP]. Now, do the Loop: Drop off of Catwalk or Bridge Ledge, move to the other spot, using Bridge Trap as needed. Run Circles/Reverses in TP C, Mainframe. Camp Mainframe, Catwalk, Ledge. [It's reasonable to Catwalk camp to 30+, then Loop]. Generally move and fire thusly: 1. (Either start here) Drop off Bridge Ledge, fire and/or activate Trap [always use switch nearest BL]. Move to TP C opening (past BKnife), turn and fire. Circle here if needed, go up steps, Camp in opening over BK and headshot until dangerous, drop. [Go to 2 below]. 2. (Or start here) Dropped from Catwalk, run the Power Switch side of Concourse, activate Trap if desired, go through door to right, then head hard left towards perk location. As you approach Area R1, turn and fire. Move to Room R2, turn and fire and/or dash upstairs to Ledge, Camp until Dangerous. [Go to 1 above]. Repeat 1 and 2, use Teleporters as an escape route or "TP Dash" strategy. [TP Dash involves camping a TP until overrun, using that TP, then running to another, possibly using Traps on the way. It was an endgame strategy for when nothing else worked]. + Optional "Aisle 4". Leave L1/L2 Trap Door closed, open TP A from Juggernog Hall (Upstairs Left). This gives "Aisle 4" 4 Player camp spot (L1), with Emergency Escape w/Trap. ############################### Basic Giant Map 2: "Down in a Hole". [In WaW, it was rare to see this opening, but it offered interesting Thompson room options. It is much more player friendly in BO3]. Rules: Specific Map openings only. Map build: Open Left Side to Power and TP A when able. Open R2 (VMP/Thompson Room) from Upstairs Right only. (Do not open R1/R2 Trap Door unless Emergency Escape). This offers the Thompson Camp/Train, Left Side loop, and 4 player R1 Camp, as well as the usual Catwalk. + Optional: "ThompsOn"; Open Thompson from from R1. (Do not Open R2 Debris Steps to Upstairs Right). 4 player Thompson Camp w/Trap. Long path to TP B. + Optional: "ThompsOff"; Do not open R2 (Thompson) at all [may depend on R2 perk]. This offers 4 player R1 camp, with Emergency Escape w/Trap to "ThompsOn" 4 player camp above. ############################### Old's Cool Maps: "The Pit" and "The Pit Extended". For Old's Cool Game Mode or GobbleGame Mode. # Game Modes explained: >Old's Cool Game Modes = (See Old's Cool Mode under SoE 'Moar' thread for more details). -In the Giant, your Old's Cool Options are: 1. No power. 2. No PaP. 3. Restricted PaP (No Alternate Ammo, or specific AA). 4. No Perks. 5. No Annihilator. 6. No BK. 7. Ban or Restrict GobbleGum (Limit which GG can be used or create specific packs). Mix and match as desired. + >GobbleGame Game Mode: PaP and Perk purchases are Banned. Perkaholic, and Wall Power are Mandatory. [Could be No Power games, but not necessarily]. ÷ Back to the maps, now that the Game Modes are understood; ####### 1. OC Map: "The Pit (the original)". [Hard] 1-4 Players. Rules: Specific map openings. Power Banned. GobbleGum Banned. You may purchase exactly 1 wall gun before you enter "The Pit". You may purchase Trip Mine. Map build: Open either side, exactly 3 Doors to Power. (Do not activate Power. Do not open TP C 1250 Door). In The Pit, you have a Vesper wallbuy, and a BL with a 1 in 6 chance of the ?Box spawning there and that's all. At least you can take 3 hits. ####### 2. OC Map: "The Pit Extension". (TPE). [Medium] 1-4 Players. Rules: Specific Map openings. Power Banned. 'Anywhere But Here!' GG Banned. You may purchase exactly 1 wall gun before entering "The Pit Extension". You may purchase Trip Mine. No other purchases allowed before entering "TPE". (All wallbuys, GG, and ?Box locations that are in "TPE" are allowed). Map build: Open exactly 3 Doors to Power. (Do not activate Power). Open TP C 1250 Door. Available: [wallgun on way], [Trip Mine on way], Vesper, KN-44, Bowie Knife, Frags, GGm, BL x2 (Roughly 1 in 3 chance of ?Box). + Alternate TPE 1: As 2 above, but with GobbleGame Rules. (Wall Power and Perkaholic are Mandatory. ABH! is still Banned). + Alternate TPE 2: No Power, but allow all Door purchases, Mandate 'Anywhere But Here!' GG. Players play full map, only ABH! can get you out of TPE. [+ option to play GobbleGame Game Mode; Pack includes ABH!, Wall Power, Perkaholic + 2 GG of choice] ############################### OC Map: "Der Riese Reprint #2"; Rules: PaP Restricted [No Alternate Ammo allowed]. GobbleGum Banned. Annihilator Banned. Map builds: As desired. "Seems like I've been here before, fuzzy then and still so obscure" -Born Cross-Eyed, the Grateful Dead. ############################### >The Other Old's Cool Builds and Ideas: If you turn on Power, you are basically playing "The Giant", but you could still Ban TP areas*, or one side (Dont open Left or don't open Right), this would leave you without PaP, for a WaW ZV or SNN feel (With optional GG). Otherwise, without power, you have the Pit (+Pit X), or you can build minimaps off of Mainframe for NDU style maps with varying guns (but you take 3 hits and have GG option). This is more fun than expected. I know that very few will try these, but you're the ones that I type for. ############################## *OC Map: "The Not So Giant". Rules: Restricted openings only. Map build: Do not open any of the 3 Teleporter Rooms. What this means to game play: 1 Perk, by TPC will be inaccessible. PaP machine will be inaccessible. Box may be inaccessible or become inaccessible. Consider Wall Power GG. [Perk: Juggernog, Quick Revive, or possibly Mule Kick are the least needed]. 4 Player camp options (not listed above): See above for other options. >1. TPC door camp by power. >2a. Animal testing (L2): Upper Left debris closed, open from L1. 3 Window, 1 Marksman with Trap option by L1. >2b. Animal Testing (L2): Door to L1 closed, open steps debris to Upper Left. 1 Window by TPA, 2 Marksmen on Hallway, 1 Shortstop usually on Hallway. >3. Exploit (if unpatched): Open Left Side, keep VMP steps debris closed. All zombies load in window by TPB door, if all players stay there. (Sort of cheating, but you won't break any records doing this, so have a laugh). ############################### >NDU map options (should be obvious): Play just the Mainframe Room only (Start Room Challenge). Or Mainframe + L1 or R1, or both. (Adds gun and GGm). Then maybe open L2 or R2, or both. (Adds decent SMG). Then maybe add Upstairs Left or TP A area on Left, Add Upstairs Right, or all of these...et cetera, until you could play all but the Pit. Maybe add Pit or TPE, and ABH! to escape. I think that you get the idea. ---------------- Have fun with 1-4 player NDU style games, use GobbleGame Mode if desired. ################################ I've build you this NDU (Perkless) Style Map to point out the Wall Power GG and Annihilator trick. --------------------------- >OC NDU style Map: "Annihilator Violator"; Rules: No Power. Specific Map openings. Wall Power GG Required. Do not enter The Pit (area by power). [May play GobbleGame Mode]. Map build: Open Left Side to Bridge. Open TP A. Open Right Side to Bridge. Open TP B. (Do not enter Pit). This accesses the entire map except "The Pit Extension" and the Bridge. Get Wall Power and use it, activate Flytrap, shoot Bears and Monkey, get Annihilator Pistol. [Flytrap: Go to L1, look out of map by the corner window, shoot the small switch on a column with a PaP'd gun. (Power-ups appear and fly away) (Gun must have some range). Enter TP B area, go to left side of left vat, jump to see and shoot Bear in Vat (voice confirmation). Go to Ledge, shoot Bear on highest fire escape above Power area (voice conf). Go to TP A, shoot Cymbal Monkey in alcove under TP (sound and voice conf). Go to Furnace in R2 (Thompson) hold X (PS# hold Square) to pick up Annihilator]. MP Camp Juggernog Hall, Ledge (don't drop), TP A, TP B, or Mainframe, Solo Mainframe. Trip Mines help slightly. Strong GobbleGum can change up the game play. ############################### NDU-Style Quick Start OC Maps: Remember, you have .5 Juggernog built in. -------------- This is the best flow I've found for an NDU (perkless) map; Simple Map build 1: Open Room R1 (KRM-262, GGm) and Room R2 (VMP, BL). Fight by RK5, if routed, run to VMP, train and return to RK5. VMP for headshots, KRM for dogs. Optionally, open Steps in R2 and open TPB for HVK-30 or extra box location, if desired. -------------- Simple Map build 2: Open L1(L-CAR-9, GGm) and L2 (Kuda, BL) instead. This map has terrible flow, forcing you to play the Mainframe mostly, but that works fairly well and plays differently than if you opened R1 and R2, for a different quick map experience. Optionally, you can open TPA (M8A7, Frags, BL) and Upper Left (Trip Mines) without affecting gameplay much. ############################### Hybrid Mode: "Earned it". Start Old's Cool, finish Full Power. 1. Pick a Side (L or R). Open that side entirely, do not drop to power, do not open Doors on the other side. 2. Play the chosen side (and Mainframe) until the end of the first Dog Round. As soon as a player picks up the Dog-spawned Max Ammo, you must open the other side entirely. 3. Play on both sides until the end of the second Dog Round. As soon as a player picks up the Dog-spawned Max Ammo, drop to Power. Do not activate Power Switch. 4. Play "The Pit Extended" (TP C can be opened) until the end of the third Dog Round. As soon as a player picks up the Dog-spawned Max Ammo, activate Power and play as "The Giant" without restriction. ############################### Racing Game for 2 or 4 players: "Powers Which?". Start: Form 2 teams [Team Left, Team Right]. Each team can only play on their Map Side and Mainframe and purchase Doors and wall buys on their side. Team that activates Power wins. ############################### Notes: [Mostly for WaW players]. You take 3 hits to kill. 5 with Juggernog, instead of 2 + 4. Guns can have earned attachments. You can run and reload. Zombies are more aggressive, but easier to get around, unlike the 8 foot wide WaW zombies. Zombies drop in tunnel now from "QR Room". Zombies path erratically, not a smooth flow directly at you as WaW. Bouncing Betties are replaced by the less effective Trip Mines. However, TMs can be held in hand for faster melee, or for slightly faster run if you have heavy guns. Opening either side is viable now: a useful gun added and steps not frequently blocked by zombies on TP A side, as happened in WaW. An SMG now awaits either side, the Shotgun (KRM-262 now) has moved to the first door out of the Mainframe on the Thompson side (R1). (Early shotgun is still a bad point making strategy, but if you love it, it's there). The location of each Perk is randomized each game, like WaW Shi No Numa (5 perks though). Quick Revive can be bought Solo 3x, for 3 self-revives (500 points), then the machine basically becomes invisible and inaccessable (it's still there though, don't get caught on it). A fifth Perk Location was added in the Thompson Room (now VMP there), if you had the BO1 reprint and were connected to the internet, Mule Kick was there. GobbleGum adds pizzazz. 5 machines dispersed around the map. Training is generally much easier. Alternate Ammo (re-PaP guns for 2500): 1. Turned: Makes friendly zombie; Great for Camping, but not windows (no longer triggers out of map). Also good for emergency shotgun as the Turned zomb will immediately blast zombies away, like built-in Thunder Wall. 2. Thunder Wall: Verticle Thundergun effect; Blasts a few, looks silly, can be good in emergency. 3. Dead Wire: This causes a slow 'WW DG2' effect; Not great for hard camping as it blocks your view, and is underwhelming in other uses. 4. Blast Furnace: Great for circling; fire into crowd, crowd dies while you reload, gather horde, repeat. Decent window watching option. 5. Fire Works: Great for camping or circling. Works well at windows. Instead of a reprint that was less than the original, as BO1 gave us, BO3's "The Giant" is at least as much fun as WaW's "Der Riese", if not more. ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ Happy gaming!

Correction: under both "PODS", and "Lil Arnie", you have pod contents listed. Both lists are different and are different than in-game currently. Maybe the game changed, or 360 is different, but I've never seen an L-CAR-9 in a pod (i won't rule it out, but haven't seen it in 28+ days of playing). Pods frequently give Man-O-War, which is not listed above. It's not uncommon to search 4 pods in a row and get 4 MWR in a row. Tip: if you search pods a lot, unlock and pimp the MWR.

Both times that i heard something, i ran up the VMP steps in Canal and could see Icarus (that's the MOTD plane, to those not aware). It seemed that the sound came from there (I have 28.5 days of bo3 playtime in, so this was new to me as far as i could tell). Icarus flies over part of Footlight (i think?), Junction, and the first half of Canal. It heads where the tram line leaves the map from the Canal Station. Maybe listen at different points? ----- (Canal is a Station, a waypoint along the line, though we can't ride it out of the map. Footlight and Waterfront are Terminals, at a terminus of the line. Just some Train nomenclature).

Interesting stuff. I have 2 small things to say: 1. From the character quotes in DE and Giant, i get the feeling that the o4 are heading to a fight with the Apothicons, where we will see the Arbgwaoth. "(Fore)Shadow(ing)s of Evil (to come)" is what the name SoE may really mean. 2. The Icarus only flies over the map once a player enters Junction. I swear that i hear voices from it if i run up the Canal steps as it passes over. Maybe it is meant to be triggered by someone entering Junction and someone else (or a few people) has (have) to be in the right place(s). Grapple up by SU, grapple plane...i doubt that, but I'm feeling feverish.

I knew that the waw weapons would not return, so that didn't bother me. I like the Bo3 weapons well enough, but i disliked bo1, so I'll be much happier with bo3 Giant, than bo1 DR, I'm sure. Add GobbleGum and alternate ammo, and I'll be happy to play it.

The Giant is available on 360 as of July 5, 2016. $5.99 That is all.

Random thoughts: Bring panzer in there. Drop Ragnarok up top of steps. Kill zombies in the tower.

See Quick Start OC Map below (☆☆☆). ------------------------------------------------------- I thought that I was done. Again. The design of SoE allows for literally thousands of slightly different survival map variations. I could never even think of each incarnation as there is simply too many variables and build options, but I really tried to touch on a bunch of builds; from small Old's Cool maps to convoluted Pro maps, showcasing the genius of SoE's design. In the past week alone, I've filled another post to the brim with map builds, and added to previous posts. Then I thought that I was done. Again. But here I am with a very special build. The exact reason that I made this thread was to bring some quick play map options to the marathon map that is SoE. Pro maps were just an extra feature to flesh out the thread. So, I've saved the best for last, perhaps. The fastest map ever in zombies. Forgive the preamble, but I'm just too verbose for my own good. -83457 ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ What if Treyarch made a survival map for quick games in BO3; a map that had Power on, 5 Perk options, 2+ large kiting areas, a shotgun, rifle, and a couple of smg wallbuys, with a 40-round(?) trap, all ready to play on round 1? What if it had 4 zombie types, random digs for Power Ups or guns, and GobbleGum? What if you might be able to trade Juggernog for a box location and a different perk? Or maybe get a box and Juggernog? And what if that map had 6 builds that were possible? What if...? But that would never happen, would it? ################################### ☆☆☆ OC Map build: "The Fastest Zombies in the West". There are 6 variations (3 maps, each with Loop option), the map is complete and playable on round 1, for fast action Old's Cool games. [I've come full circle, these are essentially Post 1 Map: "Easy Street Extension" maps, with Subway added and Loop option. (Easy Street Extension Plus" and "ESEP + Loop)]. <Rules: Strict Old's Cool (Posts 1 and 8). [You don't have to check the OC Rules as the map design won't allow anything illegal except Perks, which are allowed in this build]. All Perks available within the map parameters are allowed. <Map: Options: [Pick 1 Junction-District 1000 point Door to open (Choose either the Juggernog, Speed Cola, or Double Tap Perk District, or pick the District with ?Box). Then, decide if you want to open the Junction/Subway steps to complete a loop or not]. [Solo, 3-Beast description follows. This description will work well enough for 3 and 4 players also]. [For 2, 3, or 4 players, have P1 open the Junction 500 point Door. P2 hits Chang's for +500, then opens the District for 1000]. + [For 2+ Players: P1 can Beast (District Perk, Steps, and) Rift Door while P2 may be able to hold X immediately after to open the Rift to allow Beast through to Subway. How effective this is depends on the District. You may need the second round to power everything with 2 players]. >Open Junction 500 point Door (hit Chang's for +500). Use Beast on Quick Revive, Loading Dock (room with Power Up), and Nero's Steps. (Stab 5 zombies for points). >From Junction, open the chosen District's 1000 point Door. Use Beast to drop Steps, power Perk Machine, and open the Rift to Subway. >Enter Rift to Subway: Use Beast to power Mule Kick, Widow's Wine, open Door to Junction, power Stamin-up. (If you want the Junction/Subway Door closed, either power Stamin-Up up on Beast 1 if you can, or else Beast it on on round 2). ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ [That's it, the busywork is usually done on round 1. Just play; You, perks, zombies, guns, and a trap]. Perks: Mule Kick, Stamin-Up, Widow's Wine, Quick Revive, and your choice of Juggernog, Speed Cola, or Double Tap 2. (You can go Jugg+QR, one or the other, or semi-NDU style with neither). Guns: RK5, Shieva, L-CAR-9, KRM-262, and Vesper as the default wallbuys in each version, with FL (Vesper, Kuda), WF (Kuda), or Canal (VMP, Kuda) options. May have ?Box Location. Pods may give guns. FL and WF offer a Trap path, and Canal offers the Fancy Grind Arches camp spot, and the canal raceway with Trap to train in. There is training in Junction and Subway, with a loop option available. No Sword, no Shield, no PaP, no Apothicon Servant, no busywork. Box will likely leave if you have one (though it may go to Subway and be accessible). GobbleGum can be simple Classic effects, crappy Megas, or game changers like Wall Power, Perkaholic, Immolation Liquidation, or just basic Power Up drops to feel old school. Adjust to taste. ########################## OC Map: "83457's Fast Map Extension" Rules: Strict Old's Cool Mode. All accessible Perks allowed. Map build: Choose 2 Districts [I choose Juggernog and DT2 Districts usually]. Open those Districts and their Rifts, making a loop. . [Stamin-Up, Juggernog, Double Tap 2, Mule Kick are my usual Perks for that old school feel]. Utilize training spots, or run loop with Traps. ########################## Regarding Traps; These are almost completely pointless in SoE, as there is no need to use them with all of the power available. They used to work through round 42, now they don't even last that long. However, they are actually useful in Old's Cool Mode, so here's a couple of OC Maps dedicated to Trap use. ---------------- OC Maps: Trap Maps: Rules: Strict Old's Cool. Apothicon Servant Banned. All Perks allowed. [Best with Double Tap 2 or Juggernog available in the small builds. Also consider the Box location in your choice of District to use]. Trap Map builds: 1. Waterfront; From "Fastest Maps..." above, or "Easy Street Extension Plus" (Post 1); Open WF 1000 point door from Junction, Drop Steps, Open Rift, activate perks. Description: Gather in Junction, run through trap, gather in Subway, run through trap as needed. 5 Perks available. Possible Box. + 2. Footlight; "Der Verrückt Riese 2.2" Build option (Post 1); Open Footlight 1000 point door from Junction, drop steps, open 1250 CP Switch Door. (Optionally open Rift, or use Tram for additional perks). Description: Gather in Junction, or by Black Lace, run through trap as needed. Up to 7 perks with Tram and Subway options. Possible Box. + 3. Canals; Canals, by itself, is a Trap Map. You just need to get there, so here are a couple of builds: = 3a. Canal "Easy Street Extension Plus" build (Post 1), or "Fastest Map" build. Open Canals 1000 point door from Junction, drop steps, open Rift (for perks and U-turn options). 5 perk options. Possible Box. Description: Run Junction to Canal and back through trap, or just run Canals through trap, or use Junction and Subway to make a U-turn and head back through the trap. 5 perks. (Or) 3b. Canal "Homeboy Plus" build (Post 1, 4); Take Tram to Canal, Open 1250 RR doors. Open Fuse area to Perk area. Open Rift. Description: Grab perks on way, plus 3 choices in map build. Gather at workbench, gather in Subway, run through trap. Possible Shield option. Possible Box, or Box on way option. + 4. Subway/PaP Trap: could be "Hell" map, or "Gate to the underworld" [w/Canal for 2 trap map] map, or just play in Subway/PaP with any map build. For this, you need to do the 4 rituals and open the PaP wall. Do not do the PaP ritual (or Restrict PaP; no alternate ammo). It's a little bit of set up work, but the trap is well placed, and you have a PaP option. [Suggestions: No Sword. Build shield. Restricted PaP allowed on Round 20 (No alternate ammo)]. Description: Gather by PaP altar, run through trap, gather in Subway, run through trap. ########################### (Again with the italics and missing edits?) I'm done. Again. I think.

Welcome to the funhouse.

Solo Camp Feedback: I was doing lots of solo camping tests on 50+ rounds. This is my feedback. Storm Bow is the only hard core camping bow. Demon is on par if you run circles, as it acts like a trap as well, but for boring stand-your-ground camping, take the Storm Bow. Fire is the third best as a trap/long term killer. QR alcove is excellent for Survival gun camping/headshotting. It would be a blast for old school 4 man camping (no bows). However, for Bow camping, it is not the best for seeing drops, and can be very dangerous to get the drops down the steps. It actually plays faster with QR 750 point Door open. Tram nearby, GGm nearby. Shield by Pyramid, or over DT2. Before mid-40s, with QR Door shut, Death Machines couldn't ask for an easier place to be. Best I've seen: Tram alcove is what QR alcove wishes it was. Easy to see what's coming, easy to see drops. Tram deliveres directly to you, and the GG machine is easy access. If you haven't tried this, do so. I did my highest game here [61], just camping. Boring, but fast. Shield by pyramid or above DT2. I had the door towards DT2 open (so I could also do the QR alcove test), it may load faster with that door closed, so open start initially from QR (if so, build shield by pyramid). One of the best: Parapet by clock tower (fire bow ring, w-fizz, landing pad there): Better than QR alcove, less than Tram alcove. This is almost as easy as the Tram alcove, but drops may be hidden behind wall or on steps, Tram is far away for Fuses, GG machine slightly harder to access (in Void Bow room, below). Easy shield access above DT2. Stand and fire, with circle/reverse runs right there if overrun. Some zombies load by church balcony, over WS, so it's not the fastest, but still excellent. DT2 Wundersphere: By 50ish, this is a death-trap; zombies will come out of the side window, ignore your Storm Bow shot, and surround and down you while the WS fails to fling you. That area may be held with multiple players, but not recommended for high solo rounds. In Clock Tower, on steps: Drops may be out of sight, and it's a bit small. 2 GGm nearby, shield in Church or by DT2. Not the best. Demon Bow room with Courtyard Door closed: This had the same issue as the DT2 WS; windows right there mean constant shots to stay alive. Fine for circles, but terrible for camping the small steps. QR Door camp (open Demon room from courtyard, walk down to QR Door). This isn't a thing. Very slow loads. Same with Mule Kick area. The Pit: DT2 1000 point Door closed, Start Room Door 750 point Door to DT2 area closed. Open 500 point Barrier above DT2, drop down. Use ABH! to escape this area. The logistics are a pain, but the loads are insane. Easy to miss drops, run out of ammo, or get surrounded. High risk, fast rounds. Shield could be over DT2, GGm in area. Not for the faint of heart. Camp on Start Room steps, use door for escape. Don't even bother with this until past 40 or 50, then burn through rounds. ABH! GG can get you out, but most likely you'll need to open Start to escape, so this is a one-shot camp often, maximize it by going in after a Panzer Round, with Alchemical Antithesis (or ABH!), Ragnarok charged, and a new Shield. Wunderfizz room lower courtyard: I thought that this might have some fast loads, but it has no redeeming qualities. Fail. ----- I plan to test Church steps (with barriers closed), Church balcony (though I feel it loads slowly), and Rocket test TP room with Storm Bow camping, as I've already heard good things about them or played them with Demon Bow. I've tried the main TP room with Demon Bow, but not Storm, it seems to load a bit slow, but I'll try it with Storm at a higher round. ****Edit: More Solo Camp Feedback. WS shell protects zombies, in it with you, from Storm bow shots. TP room (main complex). This is not a camp spot. While you technically can stand in the TP, not moving, and fire Storm Bow shots, you can't see well and have to panic fire often. Running in front of the TP works well though, just not camping. Decent load speed. (Running circles is not camping to me, if your terminology differs, call it camping then). TP (Rocket Pad). Camping is not great as they load fast but spread out. But a simple C-shape (while facing out) on the small steps of the TP, or tight circles, works fairly well, just keep dragging the fastest zombs back and forth between shots. Camping Church Steps, outside Church Balcony, (and the crappy Steps across from Balcony) all have slower loads. This makes them fun for gun-headshotting, but not the fastest for high rounds. (The last steps are nearly impossible without bows, but i wanted to be thorough in testing). Camping the Church steps (window steps, upper left) inside gives the best "line up for a headshot" trains that I've seen in BO3. With the Balcony debris closed still, every single zombie head gets lined up. For comparison, even QR alcove has 2 lines merging. And the slower loads allow higher-round gun camping. I wanted the stairs under the lower courtyard to be campable, I hoped that the zombies wouldn't load up top if i stayed near the bottom of the steps, but this isn't a thing. Dangerous and dumb. ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ Solo Training Spots: Parapet (by Clocktower). Reverses, circles and headshot camping, all in one. Shield by DT2 (fling back to parapet via WS). Undercroft Column (below Dog Bow wall run spot). So easy. A bit slow. Shield by pyramid. Pyramid. Always changing paths, yet easy. Shield here. Undercroft TP room. In front of TP. Shield by pyramid. Upper courtyard: either by Church or by Demon Bow Room (best with 1000 point debris intact). Slow loading. Shield far. Tomb (Where Bow spawns). Hectic. Panic fire often. Shield in Church or Pyramid. Bastion. Trap, WS escape. Hectic but open. Shield over DT2, (fling to parapet, walk up). Tram Console. Hectic. Reverses and zigzags. Easier than you think. Shield at pyramid or DT2. Church (by dragon). Reverses and ovals. Shield here. The Pit: [DT2/GGm 1000 point Door closed, Start Room 750 point Door (to DT2 area) closed. Open 500 point Barrier by WS over DT2, drop down]. This may have the fastest loads in game, but is hard. Camp start room steps, or run circles by small steps (to zombie window). Open door or use 'Anywhere But Here!' GG to escape. Rocket pad in front of TP, between windows near TP, in front of blast doors, under launch pad, or on the launch pad. All of these are doable, none of these wow me. Fast loads in TP area. Bows, or high rounds (all zombies run) make most areas trainable. All courtyard areas (incl church) and pyramid areas load rather distant. Not the best for high rounds. Happy camping and/or training!

SoE is easier in the long run just because the Margwa is easier and less dangerous to run around than the Panzer. ------- Panzer helmet: first, don't use the claws until he starts getting hard to kill, then use them to kill him. Just walk him over to the claws, defend yourself from the zombs with a charged bow shot, monkeys, or Ragnarok and then shoot the claw while Panzer is in range. In plain sight would make the panzer run off, so don't use that for this.

Let's talk Revives in SoE; Most of these should be known, but compiling them in one post may help cement them together in player's minds. ------- Perks: Quick Revive. (1500 points). Obvious, but still overlooked often. Halve the time and get some experience. Widow's Wine. (4000 points). Less obvious, but gives you another second or so to finish reviving, and not get pushed off of the revivee. ------- Gobblegum: (500 points). If a player goes down, hit the GG machine if you don't have a GG. Maybe it will help. Mega: Phoenix Up. Won't work if the player was down when you got it, but otherwise made for this. Mega: Nuke. Buys you time to revive, gets crowd out of the way. Mega: Instakill. They can defend you as you revive. Clear the area first. Mega: Fear In Headlights. (Thanks Nieno69). Mega: Undead Man Walking. In Plain Sight. Safely revive or safely get through the crowd to get to the player. Anywhere But Here!. May take you closer to the player, or give you an escape after. Now You See Me. Pull zombies away from a reviving player. ------- Weaponry: Apothicon Servant. Fire at revivee, revive them. It is really easy. Alternate ammo. Turned, may help hold back the horde as you revive. Lil Arnie. Just like the monkeys of old. Reborn Sword. Defends you fairly well as you revive. (Next Gen, careful with those Rifts and the autonomous Sword as it may disconnect you). Shield. I didn't mention this initially because it's a given. Remember your shield! (As per Nieno69's comment). ------- Trap: (2000 points). Civil Protector. Watches your back or does the job for you. Call him in by revivee, or on the way to help get there. ------- Beast. If you have a Beast Mode available, this will quickly get you to the player and get them up. ------- Happy gaming!

Yeah, that's a nice straight shot (i listed it as QR alcove above). With multiple players, there are a few good ones that i listed above, but probably the best ones would be: MP1. Above the courtyard WS (with the Church debris intact (That is your emergency escape). 1 guy watches the window (storm or Void bow. Gun w/Turned). 3 by the door by the steps; all 3 shoot through the doorway for crossfire, 2 aim at steps, 1 aims at the Clock Tower door (alternately, this player could camp/train the parapet which would draw off the same clocktower zombies. He can fire [void/storm arrow] across the courtyard at the campers to help them also). There's some maneuvering room, a GGm to spam, and an emergency exit which opens to the other camp spot. Ragnarok blocks door or window, (and for emergency revives). MP2. (You can escape the first spot to here, or simply leave that debris closed, and enter from Church). MP Church camp: Go left up the steps with the window between them. Get on the balcony above (about middle of red rug). Turn and face the debris-door from example 1. The zombies don't come up the other flight of steps unless you back up way over to them. Some players can shoot bows at the steps below while standing on the balcony, while others headshot the ones that make it up top. Ragnarok dropped by balcony railing will kill zombies coming up the steps. Try not to open the balcony barrier (zombies will climb up if you back up), but it can be used as an emergency escape. MP3. Another camp and escape would be the TP room. Void on 1 window, Storm on 1 window (and watch the headshotters to keep them from being overrun), 2 with Turned/Fireworks on LMGs watch the long hall. There is room to run a tight circle while reload/monkey is pulled/control is regained. Communicate. TP escape if team collapses, WS to start, run to TP for revives. MP4. Pack 4 players in WS over DT2. 2 Headshotters stand, 2 bows squat in front. WS away, run down to WS in courtyard below, WS back to the first WS (pick up drops), repeat. Drop Ragnarok for panzer. Shield built there.

On 5000 at start: i was talking about solo. But, i wouldn't mind a slight raise in 4 player start funds on certain maps (like DE, and all of BO1 maps). IfyouknowwhatImean.

Double Trouble (The Pit) for speed high rounds? The Pit (or Double Trouble): 1000 point door by DT2 closed, start room 750 point door to DT2 area closed, 500 point barrier above DT2 open, to allow drop down into The Pit. When i was considering The Pit Challenge in DE, i first thought of Bows, but then realized that some might not be able to be made with that area sealed, and so i dropped the thought of Bows. Well, now I'm exploring it academically. Later, I'll try some real game application. Camping The Pit: in that area by DT2, there are 3 windows and 3 wall climb spots for the zombies. Above DT2, there are 2 windows, plus possibly the courtyard broken wall load, and the window heading above DT2 to the Bastion. So that's 8-10 nearby load spots. Camp by Start Room door (shoot steps) or circle by Fire circle. The Storm (electric) Bow can be made without entering The Pit and is best for camping (Demon/Void would be my second choice for this, but would require ABH! GG to escape during upgrade). So, the combo of Multi-load spots in a tiny section and the Storm Bow could make for the fastest rounds. Ragnarok for Panzer trap, or for eating through rounds (set by start room door, or circle it). Anywhere But Here! (ABH!) GG could get you out for a new shield. GG always available. Perkaholic, for if you go down maybe. Dragon's Glare (krm) w/BF (or turned), could be for zombies or Panzer (krm wallbuy in The Pit for emergency ammo). I'll try it, but I'm not too concerned with high rounds. Someone interested in high rounds please try this and give feedback too. Speedy gaming! Edit: by 35, the rounds were under a minute still. Zombies only came in through the 3 windows, and over the wall in 3 spots. None came from above DT2. Very fast spawns. Panzer fell through steps on 360 and was trapped underground. It was a bit too hectic for training and using the Shotgun w/BF on my first try, forcing constant bow use, but I'll give it more attempts. Edit2: using ABH!, i was able to exit the map at one point. The first use put me in the air, next to the barrier by the WS above DT2, so i just fell straight back into the pit (oddly, this is an actual load spot for ABH! as it's put me there previously, standing on air).

Understandable. It isn't broken at all, it's just like a choice; slow start to 3-10k on Round 1, or simply burn through rounds faster at the normal pay scale. In contrast, if the start room loading dock has Instakill, i always skip to round 15 and play from there. So it's not like I need the easy start, it's more that I'm amused by it: running around with the max # of zombies on round 1-3 is surreal. Usually 80+ zombies killed by end of round 3. It makes me realize that the game would simply be less time consuming (and therefor arguably more fun) if we started with 5,000, not 500. Cloning is like that, but slow.

(Name changed to Moar of Der Eisendrache to align better with my other "Moar of..." threads). This is the companion thread to my SoE thread; ("Moar Zombie Maps Inside!") which was recently retitled "Moar of Shadows of Evil" . This thread is about breaking DE into small maps and/or alternate-play game modes for variety, or shorter/faster games. See that SoE thread to better understand terms and acronyms used here. This will have considerably less to say in the Survival Map section, as DE doesn't have quite the clever design that SoE has for multiple Survival Map builds, so this is mostly about Old's Cool Mode. [See Moar of The Giant also]. I'll be honest, even "Moar of The Giant" has more to offer. So... Highlights of this Thread: 1. Build basic Bow (Wrath of the Ancients) and leave it in the tomb for 'no ammo' situation. Do not upgrade it, do not use Alternate Ammo types. This makes a great Der Riese feel with almost no busywork for limited time play. (Ragnarok optional). 2. The Pit (at Der Eisendrache): Dont open the Start Room door, nor GGm door by DT2. Open Barrier (500) above, drop to pit for fast loads or tiny map challenge. 3. GobbleGame Mode: No Power (or ban pap and perk purchases). Wall Power, and Perkaholic GG are mandatory in your pack. 4. Areas and Items Available added at end. Read on if you enjoy my Moar threads. ######################### Game modes and Ideas; Alternate Play Options: ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ Old's Cool Mode: This is for that old school WaW zombies feel. !!!!!!! >Rules: Strict; (Pre Der Riese style). Ban Ragnarok. Ban Bows. Ban PaP. Ban Bowie knife. Ban GobbleGum. MP Perks: Juggernog, Speed Cola, Double Tap 2, Quick Revive. (Others Banned). Solo Perks: Juggernog, Speed Cola, Double Tap 2, Mule Kick. (Others Banned). !!!!!!! >Optional Rules; If Strict OC is too strict for you, try these out: PaP allowed, but not Alternate Ammo Types [RePaP]. (Der Riese style). Bowie Knife allowed. (Der Riese style). GobbleGum allowed as "New Feature". This could be Power GGs, crappy GGs, Classic GGs, or old-school style GG like the drops (Nuke, x2, Instakill) and one's that reflect old abilities (Sword Flay/like BK, In Plain Sight/Zombie Blood). Perks allowed: MP all. Solo, Trade Mule Kick for another, or use GG for others, as "New Perk". Ragnarok: Allow as Wunderwaffe. This works well as the wonder weapon of the map; It's powerful, yet limited, and everyone can have one. Bow: Allow as Wunderwaffe. This kills Old's Cool Mode to be honest. I'd suggest for Solo Dog Bow Only (with Mule Kick) because it's the least overpowered, yet lasts for high rounds, yet has ammo issues. Dog Bow with no GG might be balanced enough for Old's Cool Mode. Find the right balance for you, but try to Ban Bows. You could keep a Bow by the Tomb for Emergencies Only; Like no ammo, or versus Panzer, just filling the Dragons and having the basic Wrath of the Ancients Bow as an emergency back up for all players would be acceptable. Try to only use a few Optional Rules, to keep it Old's Cool. !!!!!!! Some things to consider: (Much of this was incorporated above in Old's Cool). >PaP: Yes, No, or Restricted (no alternate ammo allowed). >Bows: Options; 1. Yes, all bows allowed. 2. No bows allowed. 3. Restricted Bow use (See Old's Cool above). 4. No upgrades allowed. No Bows means no busywork. Shield: Avoiding it is not in your best interest, but if you want some challenge, skip it for faster games. Ragnarok: Easy enough to get, and it doesn't break the game, i would always allow this, but skip it if you want to keep set-up shorter. Power: No power means; No Perks, Shield, Ragnarok, Bows, nor PaP. It's up to you (or your team), basic guns, and your GobbleGum pack. Some map areas will be inaccessible. Faster games. Solo QR is available. GobbleGum: Yes, No, or Restricted (ban or add specific GG to your pack). No Power map would love Perkaholic, Wall Power, et cetera. Camping GG would vary from Training GG. --- More thoughts on PaP and Bows; PaP is simple to add. PaP: Yes, but ban bows and you'll get pretty far, but with much less set up. Alternate ammo to the rescue. It's SoE 2! PaP: Restricted (no double PaP allowed). Ban bows and you have Der Riese 2, with GG! Other options would be to use only Turned, for camping, or Thunder Wall and Dead Wire only, as they don't take out entire crowds usually. PaP: Not allowed. With bows, this is stupid, leaving Ray Gun and XM-53 to shoot Panzer maybe. Without Bows or PaP, you have Shi No Numa 2, sans WW, plus GG, Shield, and BK (and Trip Mines instead of Betties). No Bows: Leaving these out is the biggest change that you can make. Suddenly, it's one old school type of play or another, depending on the PaP option (yes, no, or restricted). Almost no busywork. Bow Restricted: Keep for 'no ammo' scenario, or 'anti Panzer only', or 'reward for passing round X'. Skip the upgrades and leave "wrath" in Tomb. Ragnarok: As trap, revive aid, or Panzer holder, these help with any games. For shorter play times, I suggest No Bow, Restricted PaP games to completely change the feel of the map to Old's Cool, yet still have a powerful set up. ############################### Trap Map Ideas: Making Traps work (Because they are mostly useless in BO3). -------------------------- 1. Gate Trap by DT2: Open door (1000) by GGm, open Barrier (500) above Double Tap 2. Gather at DT 2 area, walk through and activate trap (when needed), wait for carnage, walk up steps, drop down (through Barrier opening), walk around trap through DT 2 Room, wait for zombies to wander through. ---------------------------- 2. Church Electric Trap: Gather zombs in Church, or Upper Courtyard, walk them through Trap. ---------------------------- 3. Bastion Electric Trap: Train at Bastion, activate Trap. ---------------------------- For fun using Traps, I recommend that you skip bows and restrict pap (no ammo types), and play Der Riese style and utilize the traps for higher rounds, so that they actually matter. ############################### Thirteenth Round Maps; Solo Challenge (you may ignore challenge and rounds and do as you please with these 2 small maps). Pro Map: "The Double Trouble Pit; (by DT2)". [See Post 2. See high round strategies thread]. Before start of round 13, you must be in The Pit; The Pit: Area by DT2, door to Start closed, Door by Dt2/GGm closed, barrier above DT2 open to allow access to The Pit. Drop in before start of round 13. Shield allowed: Can't be replaced in The Pit, so get a new one before you enter. Trip Mines allowed. GobbleGum restricted: No Perkaholic, no ABH!, no Undead Man Walking. Many GG will be pointless, so craft a pack wisely. Guns required: Krm-262 and the Start pistol must be PaP'd by End of Round 12, Blast Furnace on Dragon's Glare (krm). No other guns. Perks required: Juggernogg, Speed Cola, Stamin Up, Double Tap 2. No others allowed. Good luck, save the Ragnarok for the Panzers. (Add friends for fun. Drop SU for QR). ############################### Pro Map: "Rocket Pad (13th round)". By Round 13, be at the rocket pad and never leave. Weapons: Dog Bow and VMP w/Blast Furnace. Or PaP Start Pistol and VMP w/BF. Perks: Jugg, SC, SU, DT2. Shield and Trip Mines allowed. GobbleGum restricted: no Perkaholic, no ABH!. Some will be pointless. (Add friends: Bows banned, pistol and VMP w/BF only. Swap SU for QR). ############################### Racing Game Mode: "Power the Castle". 2 or 4 player quick racing game for limited time game or fun. 2 single player teams, or 2 two player teams. Rules: First Team to activate Power Switch wins. Each team must buy 4 doors to Power Switch (750, 1000, 1250, 1500). 2250 per player if evenly done in a 4 player game, or 4500 each in 2 player games. Team DT2 will open in DT2 direction (near GGm). Team MK will open in MK direction (from QR). Switch teams between games for fairness of play. Start: A player grabs the Tram Fuse and activates Tram. Ignore Instakill, take Max Ammo or x2. Team DT2 takes 100 from QR machine. (DT2 will get another 100 from DT2). (MK team gets 200 from MK, and SC). Round 1, split the zombies evenly, 3 per team. Round 2: Open your team's starting door and the race is on. In a near tie, the Player’s Character (Tank, Takeo...) who actually pulled the switch usually says a 'power on' script, so you know who got it. Like a photo finish. ################################# Old's Cool Team Mode. "Last Men Standing". Form 2 teams of 1, or 2 players. One Team buys past MK and can play from Start to Courtyard with Wundersphere. No more doors allowed. One Team buys past DT2 and can play from start to Courtyard with Dragon. No more doors allowed. Last team standing wins, then switch sides for next game. Only Classic GobbleGum allowed. Mega GG banned. Only Guns on your side may be bought, and start room guns. Box banned. No Power, so no shield, PaP, Bows, Ragnarok, nor perks. ÷÷÷÷÷÷ Optional: griefing allowed. Same doors open, once your team opens to the Courtyard, you may then play anywhere on the open map and may purchase any guns available. ?Box banned. ÷÷÷÷÷÷ Full Power "Last Man Standing" Grief Mode: Pick your Teams (best with 2 two-man teams, but can be 2, 3, or 4 Players out for themselves). Play as normal DE map, but only revive your team mate, (if you have one) and try to Grief the other Team(s). Last Team with a member alive wins. If a player is still bleeding out and the last man goes down, it's a tie (unless, of course, they are on the same team). ############################### Game Mode: "GobbleGame DE". Like GobbleGame on SoE, but it is a little more restrictive on DE. Rules: No Power (and all the baggage that that entails). GobbleGum: Perkaholic and Wall Power are mandatory. Map: Anything that can be opened, without Power, is allowed. The idea is to to survive using GobbleGum. Choose any 3 GG to go with Perkaholic and Wall Power and build your pack. ############################### Some Map Build ideas for Survival maps; -- Door between Demon Bow (Void) room and Wundersphere courtyard closed: Demon Bow room is excellent for circles, reverses. The courtyard area on the other side of that door is also much safer to train at. -- Area by DT2: You can keep the 1000 point Door by the GGm/DT2 closed and drop from above by DT2 to force you to go through the Start room door, which is usually full of zombies. This may make a 4 person camp spot in the lower courtyard right by the door (if zombies don't fall through the barrier from above). 1 on window, 1 watches left, 2 watch right (switch as needed). Or make The Pit style map. Build described below in The Double Trouble Pit. -- No power Church: if you open to church via the balcony over the Wundersphere (this also opens the other church door across the coutyard), you can camp inside (balcony, 15 feet through that door, turn and face that door that you opened) and the Panzer can't fit through the arch doors and waits just outside. Look out the door to shoot him. -- No Power Lower Courtyard MP camp: Camp by the dragon, 1 on window, 1 mainly watches steps and window on left, 2 watch courtyard overall. -- No Power Upper Courtyard MP camp: In front of church, 1 on window, 1 dedicated to left, 1 dedicated to right, 1 watches center and covers others. ################################# Areas and Items Available: (Bow upgrade items not listed). Start Room: >Items: Tram (w/power ups), Tram Console (needs random-dropped Fuse), Landing Pad (Rocket Test WS), GGm (500+), Shieva (500), RK-5 (500), Quick Revive (1500 MP, 500 Solo). >Doors: 2 (750) doors, near Tram (Right Door) and by Quick Revive (Left Door). 1 Power-activated Door to Juggernog. (Right Door open): DT2 Room: >Items: Double Tap 2 (2000), GGm, KRM-262 (750). >Doors: Start Room (750), Lower Courtyard (1000), Barrier [above] (500). (Right Side): Lower Courtyard: >Items: Landing Pad (Upper Courtyard), Wundersphere (500) (Parapet), Workbench, Wunderfizz (1500), GGm, Vesper (1250), VMP (1300), BL, Panzer Claw, Shield Part, Dragon Head. >Doors: DT2 (1000), Barrier above DT2 (500), Barrier outside Workbench area (500), Barrier by Dragon (500), Door to Bedrooms (1250), Power-activated Doors to Undercroft, and Bastion. (Left Side Door at Start): Mule Kick Room/Void Bow Room: >Items: Mule Kick (4000), L-CAR-9 (750), KRM-262 (750), GGm, Panzer Claw. >Doors: Start Room (750), Upper Courtyard (1000). (Left Side): Upper Courtyard: >Items: Wunderfizz (1500), Landing Pad (Lower Courtyard), Wundersphere (500) (Lower Courtyard), GGm, Shield Part, Kuda (1250), Vesper (1250), BL. >Doors: Balcony 2 Doors (1250), Mule Kick Room (1000), Power-activated Doors to Church and Bastion. (Left Side): Mission Control/Church: >Items: Speed Cola (3000), M8A7 (1500), Workbench, BL, Dragon Head, Wunderfizz (1500). >Doors: Power (1500), Balcony (1250 both open), 2 Balcony Barriers (500 each), 2 Power-activated Doors to Undercroft, and Upper Courtyard. (Center): Bedrooms: >Items: KN-44 (1400), Wunderfizz (1500). >Doors: Lower Courtyard (1250), Power (1500). (Center): Power and Bastion: -Power: >Items: Stamin-Up (2000), Bowie Knife (3000), Power Switch, GGm, Panzer Claw. >Doors: Bedrooms (1500), Church (1500), Power-activated Door to Bastion. + -Bastion: >Items: BL, PaP L, Wundersphere (500) (Rocket Pad). >Doors: 3 Power-activated Doors to Power, Upper and Lower Courtyards. (Center): Undercroft: [And Juggernog, Tomb, L Courtyard Steps]. >Items: Shield Part, Workbench, GGm, PaP L, BL, KN-44 (1400), HVK-30 (1600), BRM (1250) [Hidden Wallbuy], Juggernog (2500), Dragon Head. >Doors: Teleporter (1500), Power-activated Doors to Church, L Courtyard, Start. + Teleporter Room: >Items: Teleporter (500). >Doors: From Undercroft (1500), if you are here, it is open. (To) Rocket Pad: (Initial Access from Teleporter). >Items: VMP (1300), Trip Mines (1000), BL, PaP L, Landing Pad (Bastion), Wundersphere (500) (Start), GGm, Teleporter (500). >Doors: Rocket Test-activated Blast Door. ############################### Happy Gaming!

More map fun: Revisiting Post #1. ---------------------- The Pit (Revisited): in post 1, I discussed playing in The Pit in Waterfront. It can also be done in Canal, and now in Footlight (360 glitched death barriers removed). What you bring to The Pit is up to you, you could go Full Power, or Old's Cool modes. Footlight Pit: Do not open Junction/Footlight 1000 point door. Do not drop steps. Enter from the Tram, open the Fuse area 1250 door only. Drop down from the perk area to the Egg Statue area. Canal Pit: Do not open Junction/Canal 1000 point door. Do not drop steps. Enter from Tram, open the Fuse area 1250 door, open 1000 barrier, drop down. Extended Pits: open rift to extend Pit Map to include Subway room. Accessed Pit: open Rift in whichever Pit, connect all Rifts, play normally, just mainly running the Pit. ################################# From Post 1: This is Tranzit ll: "Go to El" melded with it's variant and some ideas from other post 1 maps into... ♤♡♢♧ Pro Map: "El Diablo" Full Power (PaP, Swords, Shield, AS, CP, GG), Pro (hard) Map, with restricted step/door openings only. Builds depend on Juggernog spawn location (check location asap), and your choice of what to do with the other 2 Districts. Each district uses 1 of these 3 (or 4) options; 1. Access to Tram from Junction, 2. Access to only open Rift to PaP, or 3. Access to Juggernog (2 districts have Juggernog Alternate Option). --- District Opening Options: >>>Footlight; FL to Tram: Open 1000 point Junction door, drops steps, open 1250 point Fuse door. (Do not open Rift, nor 1250 door by Civil Protector switch). FL to Rift: Enter FL by Tram, open 1250 point Fuse door, drop steps open Rift. (Do not open 1000 barrier, nor 1250 door by CP switch). FL to Juggernog: If Jugg starts here, enter from Tram, open 1250 point Fuse door, drop steps. (Do not open 1000 point barrier, 1250 door by CP switch, nor Rift). >>>Waterfront; WF to Tram: Open Junction/WF 1000 point door, drop steps, open 1250 point Fuse door. (Do not open either 1000 point barrier, 1250 point lone pod door, nor Rift). WF to Rift: Enter by Tram, open 1250 point Fuse door, drop steps, open Rift. (Do not open either 1000 point barrier, nor either 1250 point door surrounding the pod on the steps). WF to Juggernog: Enter by Tram, open 1250 point Fuse door, drop steps. (Do not open Junction/WF 1000 point door, either 1000 point barrier, 1250 point podsteps doors, nor Rift). WF to Juggernog Alternate: Open Junction/WF 1000 point door. (Then, enter WF by Tram). Open Fuse 1250 point door. (Do not open the podsteps 1250 point doors, either 1000 point barrier, nor the Rift. Do not drop steps). >>>Canal; Canal to Tram: Open Junction/Canal 1000 point door, drop steps, open Fuse 1250 point door. (Do not open 1000 point barriers, 1250 point Ruby Rabbit doors, nor Rift). Canal to Rift: From Tram, open 1250 point Fuse door, drop steps, open Rift. (Do not open 1000 point barriers, do not open Junction/Canal 1000 point door, do not open Ruby Rabbit 1250 point doors). Canal to Juggernog: From Tram, open Fuse 1250 door, drop steps. (Do not open 1000 point Junction/Canal door, 1000 point barriers, 1250 point RR doors, nor Rift). Canal to Juggernog Alternate: Open Junction/Canal 1000 point door. Take Tram to RR, open 1250 point Fuse door. (Do not open 1000 point barrier, 1250 point RR doors, nor Rift. Do not drop steps). >>>Junction: Opened from Easy Street, open to Tram district dictated by above. (Subway/Junction Beast-Door remains closed. The other 2 1000 point district doors remain closed, [exempting Juggernog Alternate]). ☆☆☆☆☆☆☆ Summary of play: {Start here}. 1. Open Easy Street 500 point door. 2. Locate Juggernog bottle in Junction; That district will require a Tram ride to open, and will be opened as '(District) to Juggernog' above. 3. Decide which of the other 2 districts will have the only open Rift to Subway/PaP, then open that district as '(District) to Rift' above. It will also require a Tram ride to get there. 4. Open the remaining district as '(District) to Tram' above. [You must open the 'District to Tram first', if that's not obvious enough, then open the other districts in either order. In effect, one district has Juggernog and requires a Tram ride, one district has the only Rift to Subway/PaP and requires a Tram ride, and the last district can access the Tram from Junction through that district's Fuse Area. Finished map is 3 small maps separated by Tram]. ----- This gives you 6 hard Full Power map builds to torture yourself and friends (8 maps with Juggernog alternates). Like Tranzit, revives can be nonpossible, but the CP can be called. This will add some difficulty to your solo or MP games if you need some more challenge. Shield in Footlight for most difficulty. ################################### Old's Cool Mode: ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ ° Strict Old's Cool Rules: No PaP. No Swords. No Civil Protector. No solo Quick Revive. Perks: Juggernog, Speed Cola, Double Tap 2, Quick Revive (Solo variable).>>> [Apothicon Servant optional. Skip it for shorter games]. ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ From Post 1 (OC Map 3; Shadow No Numa) and Post 4 (OCM 3.3; WaWbagger...). ☆☆☆OC Map 3.4; "Knife Life". Like "WaWbagger, the Infinitely Prolonged", except 1250 point Pod-step doors in Waterfront are open (instead of Canal RR doors), The Anvil is open, and the Rift in Footlight open. ••• Rules: Strict Old's Cool (°above). No Ritual areas opened (except The Anvil) Stamin-Up banned. Widow's Wine Banned. Mule Kick Banned. GobbleGum allowed. Pods allowed. Shield allowed. Trip Mines allowed. Bowie Knife allowed (and Anvil). Apothicon Servant optional *(see below). Tram restricted *(see below). ••• Map: Open each $Door in Junction. Drop the steps in each first area of each District. Waterfront: Open the $1250 Door by Pod-steps. Build Shield there. Call the Tram (but normally can't ride it). Open The Anvil (WF Ritual Room). Open Footlight Rift. Do not open other doors. +++ *Optional Apothicon Servant and assault rifle wallbuys Tram ride: Once you have acquired the AS parts, you may leave during 1 round, taking the Tram to both other Districts. There you may construct the AS, and/or purchase M8A7 or KN-44 assault rifles. Return that round, if able. Then Tram is banned. Optional: Allow Stamin-Up (since there is no QR in solo, this is how i play it). [Stamin-Up is in every possible SoE Survival map except "Easy Street", where you spawn at start]. Optional Solo: Allow Quick Revive for theoretically longer games. Optional: Allow Mule Kick. Optional: Allow Widow's Wine. Optional: Open Nero's Landing for just a little more room. ------------ Available Wallbuys: RK5, Shieva, KRM-262, Vesper, Kuda, VMP, HVK-30, Bootlegger, Trip Mine, Bowie Knife, with optional M8A7, and KN-44. ------------ Like WaWbagger, this feels old school, but this map is a little different, adding 2 more perk options (mk, w'sw), Bowie Knife, Trip Mines, and adding rooms off of Footlight (Subway) and Waterfront (The Anvil) to manage the horde. So whether you go down Canal, Footlight, or Waterfront, you'll have room to maneuver. Old school WaW feel if you just buy the O4 perks. Medium length games with no busywork, just jump in and play. ############################### ☆☆☆OC Map 3.5; "Footlight Lightfoot" (OCM3 "Shadow No Numa" specific build). Like Old's Cool Map 3.3; "WaWbagger, the Infinitely Prolonged", but with the 1250 point door by Perk in Footlight open (instead of Canal RR doors), and Rifts in Waterfront and Footlight open. ••• Rules: Strict Old's Cool (°above). No Ritual areas opened. Stamin-Up banned. Mule Kick banned. Widow's Wine banned. GobbleGum allowed. Pods allowed. Shield allowed. Apothicon Servant optional *(see below). Tram restricted *(see below). ••• Map: Open each $Door in Junction. Drop the steps in each first area of each District. Footlight: Open the $1250 Door by Kuda (above Perk). Build Shield there. Call the Tram (but normally can't ride it). Open Waterfront Rift to Subway. Open Footlight Rift to Subway. Do not open other doors. +++ *Optional Apothicon Servant, Trip Mine, and assault rifle wallbuys Tram ride: Once you have acquired the AS parts, you may leave during 1 round, taking the Tram to both other Districts. There you may construct the AS, purchase Trip Mines, and/or purchase HVK-30 or M8A7 assault rifles. Return that round, if able. Then Tram is banned. Optional: Allow Stamin-Up (since there is no QR in solo, this is how i play it). Optional Solo: Allow Quick Revive for theoretically longer games. Optional: Allow Mule Kick. Optional: Allow Widow's Wine. Optional: Open Nero's Landing for just a little more room. ------------ Available Wallbuys: RK5, Shieva, KRM-262, Vesper, Kuda, VMP, KN-44, Bootlegger, with optional HVK-30, M8A7, and Trip Mine. ------------ This map has a nice racetrack in Footlight, a link between FL and WF via Subway, and the usual Canal run available. It offers optional perks Mule Kick for Camping, Stamin-Up for running, or Widow's Wine for added safety. Otherwise, buy the old school O4 perks and relive WaW with new guns and enemies. Medium length games with no busywork, just jump in and play. ############################## OC Maps 3.4 and 3.5 Difficult Variant: "Shield Me, Please"; You can not build the shield until you have the Apothicon Servant built, then you (solo or team) must go to Canal Tram Station via the Tram (first ride allowed), Build Shield.You may now use Tram. You must all ride the Tram together. Quick Revive is a good friend. ############################### OC Maps 3.4, 3.5, and 3.3 (Post 4) end game option: Once the map is opened as allowed, each time that a Margwa spawns, together you must ride the Tram to a different District, and stay until the next Margwa /repeat. You can't open doors. ############################### Pro Map: "Gates of Hell". [Hard and fun]. This unique map is a clusterfuck of small maps with a need for ABH! (Announcer voice) "The deeper into Hell you go, the more powerful you become, but only Magic can get you out". Rules: Full Power. 'Anywhere But Here!' GobbleGum must be included in each player's pack. Specific Doors and Step only. [Without breaking map restrictions, do what you can with each Beast. When you first Beast-open each Gate to Hell (Beast Rift Doors in FL and WF), you might not want to drop down and open the Rift right away, but you will need to drop eventually, for Ritual parts, Swords, PaP, and maybe a Perk or two. Then ABH! is the only way back out]. Map: [Open all ritual areas for PaP]. >Open Junction (500). [Do not open Beast Door from Subway. Do not open Waterfront nor Footlight Doors]. >Open Canal (1000). Drop Steps. Open Fuse (1250) Doors. Call Tram. [Do not open RR (1250) Doors. Do not open Rift]. >Tram to Footlight. Open Fuse (1250) Doors. Open Rift. [Do not open Door (1250) by Civil Protector Switch. Do not Beast-drop Steps. You may open the (1000) Barrier]. >Tram to Waterfront. Open Fuse (1250) Doors. Open (1000) Barrier over Box Location. Open Rift. [Do not open the Pod-steps (1250) Doors. Do not Beast-drop Steps. You may open the other (1000) Barrier over Beast-fire]. [Once you drop down and open a Rift, only 'ABH!' GG gets you out. Solo, you can open one or the other and then come back for the other Rift, in MP you can open both easier]. ----------------- ----------------- This is a strange, restrictive map build. It's Die Rise without the Die, because here you have a training room while you wait to get ABH!, unlike the elevators. Passing through map sections requires coordination between teammates. Canal becomes like 2 small maps. The Tram/Ritual areas of FL and WF become small maps, and from either of them, you can drop down to Hell (Subway, and first areas of FL and WF), and only 'Anywhere But Here!' GG will set you free. ÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷÷ You could always build a "Hell" map with any 2 district Rift areas as 'lobes' of the Hell map, then play just that area only and Ban 'Anywhere But Here!' instead of mandating it. It could work as an endgame, or as an Old's Cool Map. If you had Quick Revive when you entered Hell, these maps would only offer Mule Kick (Vesper, Kuda, and/or VMP) and Widow's Wine when you revived. ########################## Pro Map: "Gates of Hell" 1 Rift variant: "Gateway to the underworld" builds; (3 options; Canal Gate, Footlight Gate, Waterfront Gate). ------- Rules: Full Power. Anywhere But Here! GG is mandatory. Only one Rift allowed open. ------- Map: [All Ritual Areas open]. >Rift District: In the only district that will have the open Rift, (from Tram) open only the 1250 point Fuse Door, and the 1000 point Barriers. (Do not Drop Steps. Do not open 1000 point Junction Door. Do not Open Subway-Junction Beast-Door). This will be the "Gateway to the Underworld". Open the other 2 Districts as desired. ########################## From Post 4 "Double Trouble Juggerton" build: OC Map build (Pro Map build is available: all items accessible). (Connect Canal to Subway via Rift for Bosium Build design: 2 maps instead of 3). (For Pro Map, open all Ritual areas). ------------------ OC Map (or Pro Map): "The Cat's Meow". >Easy Street; Open Junction 500 point Door. + Nero's: Drop Steps. >Junction: Open Waterfront 1000 point Door only (no subway door either). >Waterfront: Drop Steps, open 1250 Fuse Door. Open The Anvil (only if BK desired). You may open 1000 point Barriers. (Do not open pod-steps Door, do not open Rift). >Tram to Footlight: Open 1250 point Fuse Door. Open Rift to Subway. Open 1000 point Barrier. (Do not open the 1250 point Door by the Civil Protector Switch. Do not open Black Lace). >Tram to Canal: Open 1250 point Fuse Door. Drop Steps. (Do not open 1250 point Ruby Rabbit Doors. Do not open 1000 point Barriers. Do not open Rift). ------------------- This becomes 3 maps; Junction/Nero/Waterfront: Mostly run Junction, with Margwa path/Trap down Waterfront, and Nero's for a little more room. Footlight has the main loop, and the Subway to run, like 2 small maps in one. Trap/camp option. Canal has the workbench area looping spot, and raceway to run Margwas, or use trap. It's 2 small maps in one also. ---- OC Map allow: Shield, Trip Mines, Apothicon Sword (not Reborn), all ?Box weapons, Wallbuys, Pods. Apothicon Servant optional (it should be avoided for Old's Cool Mode as it is too powerful). ########################## Pro Map: "The Junction Function"; [This map is designed to use the steps in Junction for a change, while minimizing Junction flow overall by keeping Doors shut]. Fairly hard. Rules: Full Power map with restricted Door and Rift openings. Map: [All Ritual Areas opened]. >Easy Street: Open Junction 500 point Door. >Junction: Open Canal 1000 point Door. Open Subway-Junction Beast Door, when able. (Do not open Waterfront 1000 point Door. Do not open Footlight 1000 point Door). >Walk into Canal: Drop Steps. Open 1250 point Fuse Door. (Do not open 1000 point Barriers. Do not open Ruby Rabbit 1250 point Doors. Do not open Rift). >Tram to Waterfront: Open 1250 point Fuse Doors. Drop Steps. You may open 1000 point Barriers. Open Rift. (Do not open 1250 point Pod-steps Doors). >Tram to Footlight: Open 1250 point Fuse Doors. You may open 1000 point Barrier. Open Rift. (Do not open 1250 point Door by Civil Protector Switch). >Subway: Rifts to WF and FL open, Beast-Door to Junction Open. [PaP Area eventually open]. ---------------- The finished map is 3 main sections, connected by Tram, or Rifts/Steps to/from Subway. Junction connects to Canal, and to Subway via Steps (Beast-Door). But has less zombie paths with 2 Districts closed. Easy training. Canal has the Fancy Grind camp spot for the <35 rounds, with the raceway to run Margwas, and it also has the Workbench pooling spot for running circles for the latter game. Waterfront has the irregular training in and around The Anvil. Rift access on one end, Tram on the other. Footlight has the Black Lace oval and camp by Trap option. Rift access on one end, Tram on the other. Subway has the usual training, and is open to WF and FL via Rifts, and Junction via the Steps. ########################### OC Map or Pro Map: "Architectural Accomplishment". [This next map has some of my favorite openings: Canal with it's camp and train strategy on one side, and RR circling spot on the other. Subway proper is undisturbed with access only from Waterfront and Junction on the landing above, with no players materializing into your train from Canal or Footlight. It has the long run over Waterfront with it's sweeping views, and lower path to Subway. The Footlight oval is closed off by a door. Running a loop through WF to Rift, and back up the Junction Steps is a nice change. In MP games, each player can have a dedicated kiting spot undisturbed]. Rules: Old's Cool or Full Power. Map: [For Full Power, open all ritual areas. For Old's Cool, open only Nero's for map flow (open Anvil if BK desired)]. >Waterfront: Open Junction/WF 1000 point Door. Drop Steps. Open 1250 point Fuse Door. Open Rift. (Do not open 1000 point Barriers. Do not open 1250 point Pod-steps Doors). >Subway: Only the WF Rift and Junction Door open. (Do not open FL nor Canal Rifts). [PaP open in Full Power Mode]. >Footlight: Open Junction/FL 1000 point Door. Drop Steps. Open 1250 point Door by Kuda (above Perk). Open 1000 point Barrier. (Do not open CP Switch 1250 point Door. Do not open Rift). >Canal: Open Junction/Canal 1000 point Door. Drop Steps. Open Fuse 1250 point Doors. (Do not open 1000 point Barriers. Do not open Rift). ########################### Happy gaming!

I was trying the DT2 shield build and i found that it was annoying in the early game, while doing set up, but worked for the late game. In the intermediate rounds (building bows and such), it is annoying to get over there without flinging over to it and i didn't want to spend the points. I think i just need to get familiar with it.

I just checked the Bastion out again (now that the 360 hyperslappers were patched), it's much nicer now. I don't mind busy, but it was just too many hits there before the patch. Even as high as 50ish, i was surprised at how easy the column area in the undercroft is, below the dog bow wall run spot. Keep between the column, GG machine, and pap for the most part. Lots of escape routes*. Circle the Ragnarok if it's active, as opposed to the Parapet strategy, where it's more like an impenetrable wall (I literally just stand there). *2-4 player game: if you use the free lift from here to the courtyard, be sure to aim down with a charged shot ready in case a crowd of zombies is where you would land. I train everywhere also. Mixing it up keeps it more fun and you learn better the zombie movements of the entire map.