Dahniska

I disagree very strongly with you on this. Getting set up is very, very easy and takes far less skill than being able to consistently perform loops with trains of zombies for hours and hours and hours. The people who can get to rounds 100+ usually do have the best loadout, and can do all the other things you mentioned, easily, while the people who can do the things you mentioned often can't get to those high rounds. In a lot of maps, such as TranZit and MotD, you pretty much HAVE to be able to do all the side things (other than the easter eggs) to get what you need for those high rounds, such as building the Jet Gun, opening Pack a Punch, hitting up the box for monkeys or Blundergat, upgrading the Hell's Retriever, and more. The true skill is shown when you can stay on-point with the plethora of split-second judgement calls that keep you on your feet while you go through wave after wave of zombies.

I think I agree with Edward (above) for the most part. "High rounds" is a very subjective expression, but I do agree that it's more or less basically this: Solo - 45-50+ 2 Player - 40+ 3 Player - 35-40+ 4 Player - 30-35+ This does certainly vary per map. For example, 50 on TranZit is much harder to do than 50 on Die Rise. Likewise, 50 on Town or Nuketown is a real feat while 50 on MotD is nice but nothing near as hard as those two. It really depends on how strong your strongest killing options on the map are (Ray Gun vs Jet Gun vs Sliquifier vs Traps), and if you have Jug or not (cough Bus Depot). Generally, if you can get to 50 on a map other than MotD or Die Rise, you're probably seriously good at Zombies - if it's those two, 60-70.

This. ^ I've heard people say both of these things and I've never seen anything to conclusively prove either.

I agree with you, we have neither enough perks or enough weapons. Btw, the Death Machine from the box is bad, I don't even pick it up anymore. They should have used one of the Uzi spots for the Tommy Gun as well.

I'm surprised you didn't know of the fact that there was a damage multiplier to reduce Matryoshka dolls damage against George. In any case, you're wrong about Brutus having high health. Similar to the jumpers in Die Rise, you can still kill him at Round 60+ with the same claymores, Ray Gun or other weapon that you killed him with at Round 7, while you need traps or a lot of ammo from a good weapon (not just any gun) to kill a regular zombie. I never mentioned defense either, you did. I still think that we need more precise data about the tomahawk though, and that we cannot judge the tomahawk's power simply off of how well it kills the boss zombie, since we know that his health scales at a much different rate than zombies if it scales at all. Source? Round 60+ gameplay from me, and you can ask people like perfectlemonade to confirm this or go on YouTube.

No, sorry. But if it had infinite damage, it would kill Brutus all the time, which it doesn't. I'm sorry but I'm going to have to disagree with your line of reasoning. Just because the weapon doesn't 1-hit kill a boss zombie doesn't necessarily mean it doesn't have infinite kill power on regular zombies. In CotD the Matryoshka dolls had a reduced damage multiplier on George. While they didn't have infinite kill power anyways (just a lot) it's still an example of a weapon that is less powerful against a boss zombie. We as of yet don't have the specs for it, but I have played past round 60 on MotD and I can swear that the tomahawk has less power against Brutus than against the zombies. Why? Because I was 1 hit killing my trains with the tomahawk but it took a few throws to kill Brutus with it. But if I used my Ray Gun, I could kill him in 3-4 shots as opposed to a full magazine on my train.

Sharing access to the ZShield in the cafeteria or docks sucks in co-op. In Solo, there is no debate over who gets the Blundergat. Solo rounds move by a lot faster. People can't ragequit on you in Solo. Teammates can help you extend your afterlife in co-op, and revive you. You can train on the bridge and still get Max Ammos via your teammates in Co-op. You can carry all parts simultaneously in Solo. It takes more work to kill hoards of zombies using traps in co-op. There's more, but this is good for starts. Personally I think Solo is better in this map but it's my opinion.

This has happened to me as well.

Directly underneath Jug in Town, but needs turbine to access.

I was thinking about the very same thing today. It honestly seems like the new perk was made to compliment the Blundergat... but through hard experience, I'm starting to think it's not worth having this perk. We can upgrade the Blundergat and make it have a rather weak and not-so-reliable Awful Lawton effect. That's nice, and useful... sometimes. But there are a lot of times that the zombies seem to entirely ignore the acid effect and continue to swipe at you. Electric Cherry seems to help with that, so you can stun them in between shots when using Speed Cola. But then, they're stunned, so the little amount of time they spend chasing your shots goes down to basically nothing. So you're still trapped. And you get downed, despite spraying the heck out of them with your Acidgat. It sometimes feels to me that Electric Cherry removes the only chance I have of escaping death, by stunning the zombies so they can't move and they stay where they are, trapping me. Or I stun half of my train, and the others continue right behind me. When I double back, I find my train separated and caught between the two sides. I've started just using Deadshot instead. Honestly it's hard to really be sure if EC helps or not. It honestly helps the camper - the low level Zombies player - more than the train runner, the serious player. Now, there is a definitely good use for EC. If you're just using the Sweeper or basic Blundergat without the acid effect, you can simply shoot and shoot to get out corners in the 40s, if you have EC. Overall, it doesn't seem to compliment the monkey bomb effect of the Blundergat, but it does help camping, a little. I'm starting to think Deadshot is a better choice overall, though.

Mine are a bit different: 1. You shall not steal kills rounds 1 and 2 (unless there is an agreement). 2. You shall farm the box for Monkeys/Gershes. 3. Don't go in a corner mid-round after round 15. 4. By the end of Round 15 you shall be running trains. 5. You shall use up as much of your ammo as possible before Pack-A-Punching. 6. When you respawn after dying, focus on buying Jug first and then grab a wall weapon and run trains. Do not focus on the Mystery Box until a) your teammates are hoarding all the zombies or the end of the round. 7. Revive your teammates when it's plausible as much as you can, but don't go down to get them up. You are your team's greatest asset if you are properly equipped and you're more help to the team alive than dead. 8. Don't pick up free perks in Die Rise. 9. Never, ever ragequit. Avoid giving up and never leave a game unless your teammates are cool with it. 10. Don't do any game-breaking glitches or encourage anyone to do them.

This same feature is included in TranZit and Die Rise too, and is especially funny in those maps due to the character rivaly and dislike.

Really good read. Makes sense.

If you look underneath Hell's retriever, you'll see something not too different.

Nice writeup. I do something a bit different, but similar. I don't buy the Olympia and I like to shoot zombies on round 1, and get the Sliquifier round 1 too. Also I never do free perks if I'm gonna be training on Solo. Free perks are bad. I like your detailed post! It was a good one. Keep it up!

I personally think this is the hardest map for BO2 yet. Let me compare our maps: Tranzit: Pros - Tombstone (for co-op), lots of easy train spots, bank and fridge, monkeys. Overall an easy but time-consuming map. High rounds are possible but lengthy due to the Jet Gun. We have permaperks too which help. Cons - takes a while to set up, downed teammates can not be saved often, wall guns are sub-par, most buildables suck. Die Rise: Pros - Perma-perks again, Who's Who, best wall guns yet, amazing wonder weapon, monkeys, free perks and easy Max ammos from jumpers, great buildables. Overall an easy map and has 3 good training spots. Cons -often can't save teammates, lots of glitches. Nuketown: Pros - easy to revive teammates, easy map, simple to play, LSAT and M27. Cons - No good special wonder weapons, training is easy to do but not always safe, random Jug is so bad. Mob of the Dead: Pros - Afterlife is a free and mini Who's Who but not as good. New wall weapons and some nice new box weapons. Blundergat is OK but cannot match the Sliquifier. Hell's Retriever is nice. Traps are back at last too. Cons - Jug is in a bad spot, Afterlife doesn't let you keep your perks like Who's Who, does, PaP is a pain to get to, Brutus can really mess you up, hallways are narrow and risky to use, no monkeys which would help so much, no Semtex, Blundergat will not save you in a pinch, NO GOOD TRAINING SPOTS at all, new perk is nice but not that good like Who's Who, helping a downed partner is very risky, no perma-perks, no Quick Revive. I consider MotD to be a mediu-hard map.

I believe you can levitate in afterlife to get above the door. There should be a panel on the left to electrify, and going to the right and around a corner there should be another switch to electrify. I remember having trouble with that door as well, and that's what I did to open it.

Can you post some footage or audio clips for us? I'd go and check it out myself except I had to go to work today. I posted a theory that there was another, more evil controller of the zombies before Sam, several days ago. This interests me.

Hey guys. Wanted to post this strategy for you all. Got to round 17 in the first two hours of getting this map, and died because of the boss zombie. But the starting strategy I used seems to work pretty well so I wanted to share it! Round 1 - Activate the switch next to your character to open the double points up, then get yourself up with the afterlife. Knife all the zombies for kills, don't use M1911 yet. Round 2 - Camp at the window near the M14, window licking periodically till the zombies start showing up (wait till at least 3 are in reach). Grab the double points, then 8 shots to the chest of a zombie with a knife to finish them off. Grab the M14 when you run out of ammo. You should have a good deal over 3000 by the end of this round. Don't kill the last zombie, instead go ahead and open the door next to the M14 and go to the next room. Use the switch to go into afterlife mode, and activate all three afterlife things in the room quickly. If you're lucky, the Warden's Key will be here. If it's not, it's in the next room and you'll come back to it later. Round 3 - Use the M14 to dispatch of all the zombies (2 shots to the chest + knife or go for headshots), except 1. You can use the showers room for this round, accessed by a staircase near the afterlife switch used last round. If you have it, use the Warden's Key and afterlife to open up the washing machine in the showers area, and go ahead and activate it. You'll be attacked by a bunch of extra zombies, which is useful for racking up some extra points. Grab the plane part from the washing machine and continue on to the tunnels, killing the last zombie as you leave the room. Rounds 4, 5 and 6 - Descend to the bottom of the spiral room, and camp by the bottom door with the M14. When you're overrun (or you run out of ammo), open the door and buy the Uzi. Take a left in the wide tunnel after the Uzi room, camping with the Uzi near the 2000 point door to Juggernog. Once you get 4500 points, save a Zombie at the end of the round. Go past Juggernog to the docks area, and open the small area next to the Thompson with your Warden's Key. Go back to Juggernog, use the afterlife switch and be sure to turn the Gondola on and power the switch near the Thompson so you can grab the plane part there. Power up Jug, go back to your body, get Jug and pick up the plane piece. Backtrack to the Cafeteria (near where you got the Warden's Key) and camp there with the Uzi until you can open the door to it. If you got this far, you'll have Jug, the Uzi, and 3 plane pieces by round 7, along with access to the Acid Trap and the box. This works pretty well for me. ^^

This map has some potential to become a real classic, I think. I love a lot of things about it. I like the new box and color of it, the wonder weapon seems cool, and the traps are neat too. Overall this map is awesome. Seems to not have any super good training spots, though.

After playing the map a bit, I can offer this information about the Blundergat: -It's a box weapon. -You can get 3 parts found in the main building of Alcatraz, and put them on the workbench in the cafeteria to upgrade it to an acid-firing gun. -You can also PaP this upgraded weapon on the bridge, making the zombies chase after the shots like after Awful Lawton shots from BO1. I don't remember the names of the variants of the weapons or their ammo count, though. Also be advised that the basic version of this gun makes crawlers.

I'm not convinced, yet, but this was well written. Great job.

I feel ya, I get annoyed by constant ragequitting from the typical random, among other things. To get around these issues, I only play with people who can talk. That's the rule I go by. If they talk with you, most players are willing to co-operate decently enough. I do avoid the people with two bones though lol. Also "the guy who thinks he is amazing and goes off by himself"... I don't know what you mean, but in a lot of cases, the person who goes off and can handle himself is one of, if not the best, people to play with because he doesn't need constant babysitting and may be able to survive the round when everyone else goes down. So I don't mind those people. They usually know what they're doing better than most do.

I don't know what you're complaining about, honestly. It's fine as it is. I love it. To all the people saying they don't use M&S or Ray Gun because of splash damage, or for whatever reason, I'll simply say this: if you don't like it, the problem is you, not the weapon. Get better at the game. Aside from the Sliquifier (and possibly the SVU and mayyyybeee DSR) there are no better weapons to use in BO2 Zombies. Learn how to use them properly and you will experience better results than you'll typically get with weapons like the Galil, HAMR and AN-94.

I think PerfectLemonade said it right. Back in the day, with what there was, the formulated definitions of what was a Wonder Weapon made sense more or less. However, times have changed, and Treyarch is doing more and more things to mix up the pre-existing standards of Zombies. I'm in for the ride. And I personally don't think the Jet Gun is a real Wonder Weapon. No more than the Trample Steam is. But the Sliquifier and probably the upcoming Blundergat are true Wonder Weapons... weapons that fill a weapons slot of yours and have very much enhanced powers to kill zombies, far above your typical weapons.