ETEl2NAL407

LMAO!

Without Insta-kill, the M1911 can be a huge pain. I've had to empty 2 full clips into the head to get a kill with that damned gun.

Ask a mod to move it for you. I did a topic about all the achievements for Turned and, this one you speak of is quite simple, but takes a bit of luck. The hard part is getting the cymbal monkey power-up. Best way to try for this is use nades, go for headshots, go for multiple kills. Once you get the power-up, you just have to use it successfully once and after the Zombies kill your clone and die, they will drop another cymbal monkey power-up, grab that one and use it again. Achievement gained. These achievements are easy to attain if you have cooperative players, but without that, it's tougher because once they kill the clone, your actual self is again revealed and if the Zombies are close at that point, you may not be able to get the other power-up and use it before they can kill you.

Absolutely have an escape route. You can probably determine early on just where your camping spot should be by taking into consideration the skillset of your randoms, i.e. if they go down prior to round 3, you may want an area with lots of room and tons of easy escape routes like the roof, but if they seem to hold their own fairly well, give the buddha room a try. What I like to do is more or less sit back and coach in the early rounds. I'm not too concerned with getting setup because I know once the rounds get tougher, I'll probably have to start training and I'm secure I'll get my points. I like to let the randoms get most of the kills early on and just kinda coach them on tips, strategies, and step in if things get tough. This also gives me a good basis as to where they are as players by what knowledge they share vs. hearing them have some "Ah-ha!" moments. They usually enjoy the game much more by being able to get involved like this and feel more confident that an experienced player has their back and isn't just running away early on and leaving them to their own devices. So, I play support early on, engage the player to discover their skill set, direct a good strategy to give them the best possbile starting point, then I start thinking about my individual survival. This keeps my games interesting, challenging, and also helps lesser skilled players learn and newer players become involved.

I have a feeling the 100 perk dranks must be achieved while going prone. Maybe it's less, but that's the only logical conclusion I can come up with for some people getting it and others not. I plan on testing this weekend, but if you beat me to it, feel free to share.

I understand why so many replies claim there is no debate to this strategy. Clearly, camping is just too difficult in higher rounds and Training must be adopted in order to survive, but that's only true in a perfect online community. If, say, all of us we're on our own BO server, I'm sure we'd definitely use a hybrid strategy. Camp early to rake in points fast, then set up and hold down our respective train spots, but we're not that lucky. We have a whole universe of newbs and varied skill sets to play with. This is the main reason I find that camping becomes enjoyable. Given the randoms you play with have, at the least, a mic, an attempt can be made to direct their play towards a camping strategy. In the back of your mind, you may know that this game is not destined for high rounds, but if you can keep these random players alive long enough by a good camping strategy, they may not just quit out, feeling like they suck at Zombies. They may actually get intrigued by the game and when they do finally bleed out, they're more likely to spectate you running your train, thus learn how the game mechanics work. It's how I learned. Watching other skilled players train. I emulated what they were doing and eventually got the hang of it. On the flip side, if you decide to just train from the get-go, randoms may feel disconnected and when their skills fail them, they'll have no more reason to continue playing. It's because of this, that I think camping is the way to go when playing with randoms.

If I am waiting for an elevator with one zombie, I'll usually run him in circles and wait for my "Ding, Ding" cue, then leave the zombie on one side of the room and dart into the elevator. The elevators make two beep sounds maybe 10-15 seonds before they move, but this can be tricky to time if you're near two elevators as it will be tough to distinguish which one is moving next, though usually I wait for them to come up/down first before I wait to enter, so I can usually tell which one moves first. Do not mistake this "ding, ding" with the annoying, "Riiiiiiinnggg/Buuuuzzzzz" sound, as that means the elevator is about to go into the ceiling and if you jump in, you die. If the zombie happens to get into your elevator, run him in a circle, but don't just run. Run and pause. Run to the farthest corner of the elevator and wait for him to take 1-2 steps that way, then race around him to the other end. This will happen quickly, especially if he's running, so it's more or less going to seem like you're constantly moving, but the real trick is giving the zombie that extra step, so he just stays out of reach when you move to the other side. I usually accomplish this by strafing around him, hold right or left on the left stick and just adjust the right stick to keep an eye on the zombie. When he seems to get real close, adjust the right stick away from him to give yourself an extra bit of speed by changing your strafe into a direct run momentarily.

Without Jugg, the Zombie Shield is almost necessary with this challenge, but CaddyMan...You can't use the box for this challenge. What really makes this challenge tricky, I think, is reaching respectably high rounds. I'm sure we can all break 30 without too much effort, but beyond that it might get a bit dicey. I'm thinking that aid from the Machine gun turret or Electric trap might make it possible, but those will be a challenge to build and use effectively.

To try and make GR a bit more interesting, I propose a challenge... Rules: 1) No Perks 2) No Power 3) No Jet Gun, any other buildable is acceptable 4) No PaP 5) No Mystery Box 6) No Perma-Jugg 7) Training may only be done at Depot, Diner, or Tunnel This is meant to be a high round challenge with limited firepower, health, and training areas. Accessing other areas is OK, as long as it's only to acquire certain guns/buildables. Training in these areas (such as Power Plant) will only be acceptable if done during a round and only done to move a horde so they don't interrupt your building. Killing should be kept at a bare minimum for such activity. Let's see what round we can get to!

I ONLY built the Green Run Nav table and everytime I go into Die Rise, whether I host or not, the Table is built. Is this just because I'm playing with people who have built it, because I never built it in Die Rise, but it's there.

Kinda feels like masturbation to quote my own post, but getting back on topic and continuing what Flammenwerfer just said...my questions reamins unanswered.

Is this (allegedly) done on Local, like Perma-Jug, or Solo via Custome Game?

I see the reasoning there and I agree. I want this to be somewhat of a debate, so I'll play devil's advocate here and go back to the Kino stage as an example. I have three decent guns close by, M16, MP5, and MP40, so Ammo is not an issue. Claymores are also there and can be stockpiled, so it's not a big question of resources, but firepower. Eventually those guns will be ineffective against the hordes, even with the concentration of four players. At some point power will have to be turned on, so PaP at the very least can be opened, but by this time we may be at round 20-30, so it's a great start and the entire team should, theoretically, still be up with their guns and a good deal of points. The whole team can grab Jugg, teleport, PaP, and then go back to camping, Maybe the spawn at this point? One watches the stage and that window by the trap, two watch the window up top and the doors leading the the Mule Kick room, and the fourth watches the two windows against the broad wall and tries to pick off the Nova crawlers. Perhaps there's a better camping spot at this point? I think there is more to debate here because moving as a team ensures that players are revived, so firepower is maintained, and aid is not far away when you desperately need it. Of course, I usually adopt a mix of these tactics where I try to camp as long as possible as a team, but when the team starts to get overwhelmed and the camping spot overrun, I'll begin looping on my own and abandon the camp strategy to try and save the game.

Don't be mislead by the topic...This isn't a debate about game modes or whether you play with teamates or without, but a debate about play styles within a team match. When I first began playing Zombies, it was Kino. In the Kino spawn room there are four windows. So, it seems fitting to have four players guard their respective windows and offer aid to other players that are being overrun, if they can. As most of us know, this tactic will only work for so many rounds, as players will begin to get more and more overrun. I used a tactic, before I really knew about training/kiting/looping where we'd advance through the level as a team into each new room and continue to camp until we began to get more and more overun. In Kino, we'd usually camp the spawn room first (obviously), then skip through to the MP40 room and have two players camp the stairwell, one at the window above by the shotgun who could offer aid to the stairwell campers and/or the guy down by the machine gun trap who would camp those two windows. Next we'd make our way to the stage and camp there, having two watch the dressing room, one watch the window by those double doors, and one watch the window in the back by the claymores. We'd usually end up camping here for a great many rounds, especially if the box spawned here. Player positions could be swapped in between rounds for a democratic share of points, as it's obvious the players watching the path behind would gain many more points than those watching the windows in the new section. Most maps give us opportunities such as this, to slowly and methodically work through each section and camp/guard the Zombie spawn points. It takes teamwork and ammunition, but is a pretty solid strategy for high rounds and safer, since your whole team moves as a unit. Of course, the problem is finding the spots in the various maps that accommodate this style of play and certain maps may prove too difficult. On the other hand, we have the more readily accepted strategy of training/looping/kiting/hoarding. This is something that is done as an individual. I suppose, given a large enough area, two players could loop simultaneously, but I rarely see that work. So, you're training on your own and your teamates also are training in their respective areas. Players accomplish what tasks they can as they have an opportunity, whether it be to replenish their ammo, advance the EE, acquire new guns, etc.. This strategy works fine for me and for other skilled players, but if there's a weak link on the team, it can spell disaster. For example, you're doing fine, but as the rounds progress, a teamate on the other side of the map goes down and no one can reach him in time, so he dies. Next round, he'll respawn next to someone else and disrupt their rhythm either by messing up their loop route or by requring their assistance to protect them as they reacquire perks/guns. Regardless of how quickly said person can get set up again, there's going to be some disruption and that may start a chain of events that lead to a game over. The question up for debate is, Which strategy do you think is better and why?

NT > GR > DR Nuketown is first, for me, because it's classic survival that works. Small map, couple tricky looping areas, takes talent to survive and you also must be wise with how you spend your points. Green Run is second because of two big reasons: Refrigerator and Bank. The size of the map is great because your team can split up and comfortably loop/train in their favorite area. If everyone has points in the bank and/or a gun in fridge, then we can be setup and ready to go very early in the rounds and from there it's just, do your thing. Makes it nice and easy to slaughter. Die Rise is last on my list of BO:2 because it's more like survival, but without the benefits. Sure the TS is great, but the perks in the elevators means waiting, the different floors means waiting to travel, and no bank/fridge means I have to start from scratch every game. To me, it's like Green Run without the advantage of being set up early on. Too much can go wrong.

I can only speak of the differences between Zombies games, as, in my experience, the MP guns and the Z guns have never been strictly related, only loosely. Oh, how I craved to use the MP40 in MP BO:1, but I digress. I see what you are saying and I agree, but I don't think the (lack of) updated weaponry is a hint at all to storyline timeframes, with the exception of a few guns here and there, i.e. LSAT, SVU... I think it's more just the Zombies devs trying to establish some game staples, or being lazy. Off-topic: You really bash the FAL, my 3rd favorite box gun...It's always been 3 burst PaPed, even in BO:1. Why do you hate it so much? I think it's awesome, especially when you aim strictly for head shots. The burst in higher rounds almost ensures a headshot kill, whereas non PaPed you still have to spam the trigger and end up shooting 3-4 bullets anyways...

My favorite wall gun from BO:1 did not return. The MP40. That is a bummer. However, the new guns are pretty much just revamped clones, if you ask me. Take the LMGs for example. In BO:1 we had the HK21 and the RPK, among others, but for argument's sake we'll just compare these two. In BO:2 we have the HAMR and the RPD. This is a no brainer. HK21=HAMR, RPK=RPD. They are only cosmetically different, to me. I find myself in love with the LSAT in NTZ, starting to really enjoy the AN-94, but absolutely loving the MP5 + M16 combination in Green Run. That's probably the greatest thing about the new guns...I have learned to appreciate guns I overlooked in BO:1, the M16 especially.

I hope they aren't glitched... I had 4 perks, got one from the Jacks, PaPed AN + PDW, and was just waiting for the next Jack round, when I fell down an elevator shaft. *facepalm*

I made a post about this a while ago, http://www.callofdutyzombies.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=105&t=28673 Basically, that thread indicates my thoughts about COD Zombies being a super fancy, highly involved "Snake Game". Remember this game? Yeah, you run your snake into the fruit and make your snake longer, but you die if you run into your own tail. Here's a video: CvJNqaZS8Og Well, just imagine the zombie train is your tail and Voila, we have the same basic game concept, although not a crappy 8-bit overhead view. Now we get to shoot our tail, we can run over powerups (nukes, insta-kill) that help us destroy our tail, we can acquire different tools (wall gun, mystery box, PaP) to destroy our tail, but down to the fundamental basics, this is the same game. So, I believe trains are completely justified because, to me, that's what the game ios built around. EDIT: Changed the image for a better representation and added a YT clip for viewing pleasure.

I finished the Campaign in BO:1, was curious what the hell this "Zombies" was that I always saw in my menu and decided to give it a try. I really had no clue what I was doing, but I thought it was interesting and continued to play, gaining information from randoms that I played with. I didn't know there were doors to purchase until I played once and looked around after a round to see that I was all alone in the Kino spawn. "Ummm...where the hell did everyone go?!" was how I reacted. Lol. Of course, I also ventured into discovering things on my own and began to comb the web for guides and tips, but my time with Zombies and my PS3 ended shortly after the release of Shang-ri-la. I have missed the game ever since and decided to purchase an Xbox 360 this time around. Coincidentally, I got it for Black Friday with a copy of BO:2 and since encountering the major shift in story, I felt I had to dig deeper and I came to this website. I decided to purchase BO:1 again and rekindle my love affair with Kino Der Toten. Soon, I will purchase the other DLC for BO:1 and will have all zombies at my fingertips.

I would try this challenge, but I believe it would be unfair because I would just exploit areas in the maps that facilitate this style of play. The roof on Die Rise, especially since TS is acceptable, and the Tunnel in Green Run. I actually only run in circles in certain spots, usually I like to take the horde on a serpentine route, but since I end up re-tracing that route, I guess I understand what you mean by "circles". I actually make the trains enjoyable by switching my directions and altering the speed I run to try and create sticky situations, challenge myself to squeeze through. I also don't actually like to do EVERYTHING in between rounds, so I can test myself in other areas. For example, this weekend I was playing Survival on Town and wanted to hit the box in the middle of a round. The box was by the dumpsters, I was training by where Stamin-Up spawns in Survival. I took my train around the lava, in front of the bank, in between the cars where the pavement raises, then I ran into the box area, hit it, looped my train in by the box, around by the dumpsters, and out back to the clearing in front of the book store and the Jugg drop down. I then ran back into the box area to collect my new gun, looped my train back through that tiny area and back over to my preferred spot by Stamin-Up. My point is that even though I train my zombies, it can still be quite interesting if you test yourself with tighter areas, changing direction, or variating something for the love of god. Since I expect everyone I play with to have the same or better level of skill as I do (yes, I know those are high expectations), then I expect everyone to follow the same steps when playing, thus, I don't like training in the same area as another player.

Although the Green Run test site theory has been beaten to death in this forum and is more or less confirmed by now, the OP gives me a better idea about the N4. Are they just test subjects picked at random? I realize now that I know nothing of the N4's history and background. Perhaps we should be theorizing about that instead of the locations.

I understand what you mean about the execs not caring about the patches, but the thing that the execs do care about is money. Since everything costs money, man hours for patching, resources for running machines to program, etc.. the execs have more of a say in the patches than you may expect. It happens quite frequently that a small company has a great idea and manages to market the idea quite successfully, make a ton of revenue and decide to expand their company with their newly acquired fortune. Through the course of expansion, corporate America gets their stinky feet in their door and through the course of board meetings and conference calls, subtley the people who began the company lose their original decision making power. They, slowly but surely, are edged out of administrative power as the financial happenings are left in "better qualified" peoples' hands. It's only natural that a technical and creative person yields such decisions with the best interests of the company in mind, but unfortunately as they yield this power, consequentially they end up becoming just another employee of some corporate machine, driven by greed. I don't blame the devs. These are natural decisions. The problem here is greed. The only thing we can do to combat corporate America's greed is not play their games. Don't be greedy with your purchases, don't be sold by their shady marketing techniques. Just because something looks cool, doesn't mean you NEED it. Research your purchases and make smart decisions. In the end, the data these execs use to base their greed off of are the things we buy. So, if we are buying cheap stuff that looks cool vs. quality products that function well, we're telling these execs that we're buying things because of how they're advertised, not because of how they're made.

I see exactly what you're saying Nator and you're right. The deception was greater for BO:2. Of course, that's because of how well the HE sold for BO:1. 3arc knew, based on sales data, that another HE pre-purchase was bound to do well, so they did it. What may have happened to more or less negate the exclusivity of it could be that A) the HE sales didn't do as well as they thought so they threw NTZ in with the Season Pass to make SP more attractive and regain some sales, or they had the idea of maximizing profits through the HE+SP combo from the beginning. I tend to envision the latter, probably just because I've seen first-hand the dark side of corporate America and am somewhat of a conspiracy theorist, but either case is plausible. I don't mean to come off as looking down on everyone or pointing my finger at the whiners. I understand venting and if it makes you feel better, vent. I do, however, strongly advocate logic, so I can't help but try and nudge this discussion away from emotional release into a constructive breakdown of cause and effect, in hopes of alleviating others' pains by logical explanation. I fully agree with your original point about the Sliquifier, but don't have much input, as I'm not a big fan of Die Rise. Though we should take the bugs, flaws, and they way 3arc is fixing them as a huge clue to their current business practices. So far, we've been a bit disappointed overall, I would say. Is this a direct result of corporate America's intervention, cutting costs, maximizing profits, industrializing 3arc, etc.. Or do you all think it's the devs just dropping the ball? I believe the former, but I also believe the devs are losing to the execs in the decision making process, more than likely because of money.