NaBrZHunter

Yeah, a time period change would not be drastic enough to explain the change in layout. The map we've always known actually occurs on the same day, in the same hour, only 20 seconds before The Giant, as far as we can tell. How that works is yet to be seen.

@Black Hand Smith BAHAHAHAHA! Wow, that was the most disturbing answer you could have given, I think.

HAHAHA! I really don't know, TBH. Sometimes it seems he just plays the part to get on the others' nerves. But there's certainly nothing that would indicate that he isn't. LOL!

@Cheesegrater28 I need to write a post on this, but I believe we can confirm the Der Riese clock is at 1:14:40, proceeding to 1:14:43. I have taken into account the appearance of non-precision at the :40 mark. I'll fill y'all in soon. @edbuddles I would like to see more Peter McKay, but it is confirmed that he suffered whatever demise Richtofen had planned for him before September 1945, when Samantha entered the MPD.

Agreed, a cutscene confirming what Maxis meant by 'the earth and its inhabitants will not survive' meat would be fantastic.

It's so obviously not the Original 4. The biggest piece of evidence that debunks that theory is all the diesel punk technology. All that technology would have appeared in the future if it had already been invented and mass produced. Another piece of solid evidence is the fact that if they were indeed the younger versions of the original 4 then removing them from their time would mean that der riese would have never happened since none of them were around to actually grow up to become the Original 4. Haha! Uh oh! Here we go. I will take note of these arguments, and debunking can wait until after The Giant. Let's keep it at that for the moment, if y'all don't mind, just to keep this something of a repository of bad theories only.

Great work! I need to eventually read this whole. I scanned over it and just wanted to point out two little discrepancies, namely, that Der Riese/935 was established in 1939, and that 935 was, previous to WWII (though perhaps not in WWI) an international scientific research organization based in Lower Silesia, etc. Brains for the thorough discourse!

Brilliant. I was literally LOLing at this list. Brains for retaining all that erroneous knowledge (I am being serious!)

Respect this answer. Do research. Brains.

Nope, a bit choppy, but straight up. Good point, you're exactly right, there is no doubt about it now.

So, with all the building and theorizing, ripping, tearing and critiquing (respectfully, of course) that we do out here, I would like to hear y'all's input on what some of the worst, most far fetched theories y'all have ever heard proposed, for this thread, specifically in regards to the World at War/BO re-release maps, whether on here, YouTube, or elsewhere. Under Supported/Under Researched/Unfounded/Far Fetched: a.) Based on, or related to events in another game, narrative, or other media or literature that is not directly referred to, clearly implied (by virtue of relationship), or was not confirmed in a later map. b.) Directly, though not deliberately, contradicting existing (at the time) Zombies canon, or contradicted by later releases. Once again, respect for theorizing. Better luck next time. c.) Deliberately concocted for the purpose of garnering attention, making money, or building a personal fanbase Unless you are nominating a theory that you yourself thought up originally, and wish to volunteer that, the original author of your nominated theory must remain anonymous, even if their theory fits in the category (c), unless they themselves comment to confirm that they are indeed the author. Theorists are respected here-it's what we're made of. All the same, we learn from our mistakes. The reason a theory is flawed need not be explained-for instance, see my example below... Hope to hear from y'all! As an example, I present the theory that falls under clause (b): Maxis is a drone at the time of Der Riese, based on the premise that he always gives commands, never taking action, himself. This theory was seemingly well supported, and kudos to the theorist, but unfortunately, in the face of canon, falls through.

I would do it map specific but the meaning of some of the tarot cards relate more to people than maps to be honest. It wold more likely be characters than maps if anything in my opinion but I just think it depends on what the card symbolizes and whether it fits a person or an object or a location. This is true...

Tarot cards certainly aren't a preference of mine, but (though, potentially coincidence, as that is much of what a tarot card plays on, by nature), it still makes some sense when thinking of the death cards and the cursed card. Speaking of which, man, maybe Death = Alcatraz? It's the only post-mortem map to date. Justice may be Buried...? Maybe try rehashing this as being map-relative instead of icon-relative, 'cause that causes a landslide (not to discount the ingenuity of this theory). IE: Fool-Origins The Hanging Man-SSN The Hierophant-Der Riese The Emperor-Kino Moon-Moon The World-Tranzit The Tower-Die Rise The Chariot or Judgement-Buried Death-MotD Magician-SOE Just some thoughts... but again, kudos.

Brilliant. Ranking this alongside @MysteryMachineX's breakdown of the types and weaponization of 115.

This is short, sweet, and basically undeniable. I shall quote this as my own headcanon. I believe the O4 are the NO4, simply altered by the changes of time; I believe Old Richtofen knew something we don't yet know he knew. 935 is associated with Nazi Germany; Richtofen and Maxis were both psychologically compromised, and that Maxis was killed near the MPD. 1. SNN (Sept. '45) 2. Der Riese (Sept '45) 3. Ascension/Five (Early 60s') 4. Kino (Early '60s') 5. Call of the Dead (2011) 6. Shangri-La (2011) 7. Moon/Nuketown/Green Run/Die Rise/Buried (2025)

This is actually still an issue. I see this thread is 3 years old, however, I experienced this issue on Shangri-La last night. Did anyone ever discover a fix?

It's a beautiful post, OP, and I agree with a lot of what you state but I'm going to have to disagree just a little bit here. I agree that Peter McCain is the guy hanging, sure. However, based on what the characters are wearing and what they look like, I disagree that Peter McCain is the guy shooting zombies in the third panel. Hidden Content If the image placement worked out the way I'd intended, Peter McCain should be on the left, and Tank Dempsey on the right. Notice their appearance compared to the comic book versions. Unfortunately, we have no Peter McCain in the comic book that we can compare to the game's model of him, but I think it is quite obvious that the guy shooting the zombies at Shi No Numa is Tank Dempsey. The comic book version has blond hair, the game's model of Tank Dempsey has blond hair. Peter McCain on the other hand, has brown hair (or he has blond hair, but it may look brown because of the image being so dark). Hidden Content The comic slide itself suggests that Tank Dempsey is the guy shooting the zombies at Shi No Numa. If you look at the Der Riese panel, you see the comic book version of Tank Dempsey standing with the other three characters in the teleporter (fourth panel). That guy looks exactly like the guy on the third panel. This leads one to suggest that Tank Dempsey is in fact the guy in the third panel, shooting zombies at Shi No Numa. Remember, this is just my opinion (theory) but I think it makes more sense that the guy in the third panel is Tank Dempsey based on what I've presented in this post. Your 'opinion' is well founded. There is no evidence that P. McK ever actually faced off against the zombies. In fact, more evidence supports the opposite, as Richtofen apparently did something that lead to his demise (presumably resulting in his hanging.) Which, I might point out, is only truly supported by the iOS game which, having learned on it, I actually still have respect for.

@Nightmare Voyager Naw, I know that. And it's pretty clear with the vials of blood and all, I was just saying that would have been my preference.

And that is what's always made Nazi Zombies unique, is the strong, scientific background, even where Vril is concerned. In fact, so much so that the MPD and similarly charged devices are explained by scientists as being charged by 'energy from matter' when the braces on that energy are broken. Whether we'll see a change in that law is yet to be seen. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only one who calls this energy 'Souls' is Takeo. Richtofen (who is clearly the authority) has always referred to the process as an energy transfer. So we'll see. I would almost be okay with the MotD/SOE being its own story entirely as long as it didn't cross-pollinate with the original. Because yeah, like you said, no logic or explanation is required, and while it may feel mystic, eerie, or occultic, in the end, it's really just a cop-out.

Haha did you ever see the Southpark episode where they think there is a talking whale from the Moon at seaworld? The last scene of that episode, the credits roll as a dead whale lies on the Moon in silence, insert Samantha lol I do like the ripple effect theory. Remember Maxis/Richtofen only agreed to represent the Nazi regime because of funding. What if instead either Maxis or Richtofen has went back in time with perfected technology that was finished in a timeframe that didn't need additional funding? I'm pretty sure military attire didn't change just because Hitler became their leader. The symbols were added to an already existing outfit, which could explain why Richtofen LOOKS like a Nazi, but doesn't display the swastika. Obviously, they were taken out to prevent offending anyone, and more importantly, to increase world wide sales. Can't sell a game if it's banned in a certain area. But it's safe to say, anything can be explained WITHIN the game, so why not say the Nazi party wasn't needed in G935's goals. The only problem with this theory of mine is, if there was no Nazi funding, there was no need to make the Wunderwaffe. It was in the back of my mind the first time I watched the trailer if we were going to see the DG2, and as of now I can't say we have. "To improve the human condition" was their mission until they had to depend on the Nazis. No wunderwaffe, forsooth! I appreciate this observation, but more importantly, there would be no zombies! Based on what 935 was intended to be, there will be no severance between them and the Nazi party, because as you (and I, up a ways) pointed out, they were the malicious force behind 935's work. Otherwise, we're just going to end up with some lame ATLAS style story. One thing perplexes me, though... If Nazi (men who followed demonic agendas) involvement in the story is so controversial... Then why are demonic forces so well accepted? It's a little scary, if you think about it. Yet another reason I had hoped they'd continue in the sci-fi foundation over the preternatural.

@Villager Central well done! That was pretty sweet!

You have some very good points! Personally, I can't stand the 'great evil' direction the story has gone, as I feel it becomes more of a cop-out, as opposed to sticking to 'scientific' constraints. But hey, at least your theory makes sense.

Agreed, this is not a single linear time stream, but it is, IMHO, a single universe, with links to another dimension. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm never in an 'I'm right, you're wrong' stance unless someone were to straight up refute canon, such as saying 935 was disassociated with Nazi Germany. However, I do not believe that another "Dimension" equals another and "Paralell" universe. I believe it is possible for this to all carry on in our world; the same it has always been in. Now if there is a Canon source somewhere that specifically states that a parallel universe does exist, I have missed it up until now. But all I am aware of is theories based on pan-dimensional travel, time travel, afterlife 'purging' loops, and teleportation. Different dimensions carry themselves at different rates of time, I believe, much like the way Earth's trek around the sun compares to Jupiter's, without equal, apparent "time" passage. On that same note, as far as I know, there is not yet any indication that time travel into the past is possible (I know, that seems preposterous, but I believe Canon supports it.) What occurred following Origins was not, I believe, time travel, but actually did occur before our original story, influenced by the knowledge of what occurs in the future. And what Maxis said was an implication, not an explanation of how or why. I'm working on a potentially large project right now, and a thread for this subject will probably be a part of it. I look forward to continuing this discussion.

That's actually not the case. Those bios emerged with the characters themselves, specifically (if I'm not mistaken) at Shi No Numa, at which point they obviously knew where they were going. In fact, they Verrückt was, at a stretch, the last map they made in which they did not know what they were going for. But even Verrückt and the events there involving the Marines were later tied into the story. Like-who was it, Houston?- said in this latest interview on Conversations with Creators, they began developing a story after fans misconstrued a warped texture in Nacht. World at War Nacht. If you stick to Canon, it remains clear that nothing has yet been scrapped, and the story has remained consistent, and has not gone in another direction.

I am going to directly refute the Great Matuzz. I say so because I have much respect for your work. The 'different universe' theory is not confirmed as of yet, either. Personally, I still believe that they are the same characters. But yes, in answer to the original question, they are still Canon. Anything stated by Treyarch directly in the form of audio, video, image, or text is Canon. The only things that are not Canon are our own theories, speculations, or connections we make to other non-Treyarch science, or occult literary fiction. You may notice I am deeply devoted to differentiating between canon and theory. We had a big discussion on this on a past forum: http://www.callofdutyzombies.com/index.php?/topic/178904-canon-in-the-zombies-storyline/&do=findComment&comment=1726792 Some theories to explain the bios are that they are, in no uncertain order: a.) The ideas that Richtofen planted in his test subjects' minds' b.) That the new four are from another universe, specifically, a 'paralell' universe c.) They are all true accounts, with the NO4 being their younger selves, previous to those events, on a manipulated timeline following Maxis' victory at Resolution 1295 I am sure there are more which I may discuss in light of canon at some point in the future. Heheh.