What really are proper multiplayer manners? Is running bad?

[MegaAfroMan]

So, after playing many, many games with randoms, I have come to question whether or not there even is a proper way to play fairly in zombies.

I like running. However, is this fair to everyone else? In a map such as Kino there are not that many commonly known easy places to run. So if you are running in the lobby and getting half the zombies every round and point spamming them with an SMG is that really fair to the other three players trying to survive in the stage?

Zombies is a team game is it not? I know I found myself getting frustrated that this one player had nearly 60,000 points by round 20 or something similar when I had only near 20,000 because all of the places I knew how to survive in were already being used, and not wanting (yet) to be rude and kill steal I tried to survive in the aisle in the theater between the stage and lobby. I could not go anywhere either, as someone was running the stage and someone was running the alley and someone was running the lobby I was stuck in place. I know that if I was in any of their positions I probably would not being questioning the fairness of it all, however now I think about it often.

Is it really fair to horde the zombies and complain when someone kills them, even if you have a lead of one-hundred or more kills than the next closest guy? Is it really fair to extend the round so long, because you want to squeeze every last point out of the zombies with your SMG? Is it even fair to split up and leave your "team mates"? Granted camping will not allow long term survival, but the game itself really is not built to be team friendly, or at least, not in the way that it has come to be played.

As fair as we try to be, does buying that extra 1250 point door really make up for the fact that you will be later taking more than half the zombies every round and quickly tripling everyone else's points and kills? Some may say that it is fair because knowing how to run properly is a skill, therefore you deserve those points. What if it is a map that has a few running spots? Like my above Kino situation.

On Der Riese I have discovered that running in the spawn location will almost always give you more zombies than others will see in the map, due to the shaping of the map. There are many, more zombies spawns that would be closer to the lobby than most other running or camping locations. I have actually been asked not to run in that location when playing with my friends, and it is very noticable in our scores if I do or not.

If running is fair, regardless of the huge point leads, is it still fair in the Der Riese situation? Is that still skill? Or does it come down to a game of 'who gets there first' or 'who leaves first' if a stand off should occur? I would like to hear input on this matter very much.

Until then,

MegaAfroMan

[Team_Damian]

I don't think it's really so black and white. Sometimes running seperately to your team can take a bit of stress off of them, but then if you're taking it as far as to have so many points more than them that they can't afford to buy their perks back when they down then it's over the top.

Also it depends if you're still being a team player or not; some people just go off and do their own thing and just leave the rest to it, whereas some will do their own thing, but still go for revives or help out if a teammate is in a jam... I guess it really comes down to how you're running and how you're treating the other players, and as long as you're being considerate to the other players needs too then running is pretty acceptable, especially on smaller maps where maybe having the four of you in one place might just get you completely overrun.

Just my thoughts on it anyway :)

[Daveyjone]

many posts on this along the road. Response? As Damian said, it's not simple, but the truth is that it doesn't matter. Do you think our working out the proper way would do anything? If every site in the world dedicated to zombies said the same thing, and Treyarch also said it, would it stop those who exploit?

Well, the answer is that it doesn't, Treyarch have allready tried! Look at the tips at the beginning of every game. Even a more blatant, 'this is a team game, go alone and you will fail' comment wouldn't shift enough people to make a difference.

Ever heard of MAG? The aim was to make a game where to win you had to work together, i.e. the gameplay made it so you spawned in groups after 30 second gaps to encourage staying together, you got bonus xp for working together and you could benefit the squads (you were put into squads of 8) through a balance of skills, not just shooting. Result? No one plays it. Shame too as I love it.

[MegaAfroMan]

Its not entirely black and white yes, but that does that not mean we should not try to find the acceptable shade of gray? It is a very relative question however. It depends on the map, and the people playing it, and the goal. If its you and a few friends on a large map going for survival, then every man for himself would probably achieve your goal faster. My question is, what should you do with people you do not know? And it may be exploitation, but that exploitation is what makes the 'best' players the 'best'. If you try to rough it out in a small area with your team mates sticking together, the game will probably not get too far, as compared to one or all of you running in different areas. Just because it ensures survival does not make it fair however. Its usually unlikely to ever have a serious attempt at beating a record so why else play with randoms if you just go off into a corner and run in circles? It is not really a competition, it is not really social or team building, so what is it? Running at all is technically exploiting the zombies slower movement speed and limited path finding abilities. Where would any of you draw the line? If you were playing and doing really well, at what point would you decide it is kind of unfair to the other players?

[Daveyjone]

Its not entirely black and white yes, but that does that not mean we should not try to find the acceptable shade of gray? It is a very relative question however. It depends on the map, and the people playing it, and the goal. If its you and a few friends on a large map going for survival, then every man for himself would probably achieve your goal faster. My question is, what should you do with people you do not know? And it may be exploitation, but that exploitation is what makes the 'best' players the 'best'. If you try to rough it out in a small area with your team mates sticking together, the game will probably not get too far, as compared to one or all of you running in different areas. Just because it ensures survival does not make it fair however. Its usually unlikely to ever have a serious attempt at beating a record so why else play with randoms if you just go off into a corner and run in circles? It is not really a competition, it is not really social or team building, so what is it? Running at all is technically exploiting the zombies slower movement speed and limited path finding abilities. Where would any of you draw the line? If you were playing and doing really well, at what point would you decide it is kind of unfair to the other players?

Man of my own heart! [brains] for you.

The answer I give is that it is too much of a contrast between peoples views, i.e. you have the noob callers who rage about everything, but you have the others who can't stand trains or raping. If we could do anything it would be very simple things most people would allready know, like; Try to revive your teammates, don't rage and swear, don't leave mid game unless unavoidable etc.

[Tom852]

Thats how the game is.

I just had recently a game, 4ppl Kino, everybody split up. I was in the Speed Reload room and got no more than 2 zombs at a time. I enjoyed it so much. Finally no need to run all the time. As long as I have about 20k, I don't care if my mate has 200k or if I have half the kills than the other. As said, it's a team game, so doesn't matter how many kills each one has.

What we did in the high round COTD game was, we just switched the roles (in general the running locations) from time to time. So it equalizes again.

You also need to see, that other players might not be too well skilled, and maybe they are super happy that they do not get too many zombies!

In my opinion, it is definitely fair in general. Except that SMG Round extend thing. There is no need to super-maximize the points in Round 10+ imho.

[killallzombies]

in kino you can run trains in more than just those three places you know

[jokrAzrael]

[brains] as it is a great post and thought. I've wondered along similar lines. I'd say in the best examples that Tom is right. Often running a train alone takes a lot Zombies away from the others, but they are relieved. Not so much on earlier rounds. That tends to be when someone will show up and kill your train. Later on they tend to simply be trying to stay alive.

The best games have been the ones where the teamwork overcomes the selfish need to get the most points or kills. When someone needs points you tell them to come kill your train. The problem is that this kind of communication is rare with Randoms. To simply answer your question just run the rooms. Someone has to make those trains. And deal with the possible ramifications.

We all know what we know. That trains are the building blocks of this game. You control what you can control. And the others will have to deal with it. Control your game. And then you will control them all. That is what is like to control the horde. It means you've won. :)

[iB Proto]

I personally play Der Reise 90% of the time, and with the above being said, 90% of the time it is with 4 players, at around Round 25-30 we start using the teleport strategy and loop the entire map together, but until then it's a free-for-all of people looping (kiting) in there own area.

It is separated like this:

The Thompson Room Loop

STG-44 Room Loop/Power Loop

Spawn Loop

Double Tap/Next to Double Tap Loop

The best (according to the majority) is the STG-44 Loop (due to the fact that you not only have a huge area but an easily accessed wall weapon) followed by the Thompson (cramped, but very easy wall weapon), the Spawn (huge, but no wall weapon), & last the Double Tap loop (cramped, no wall weapon). We usually come to an agreement such as whoever loops at a certain area can get so & so weapon. I personally think Zombies IS meant to be a team game & that agreements like the such need to be made. The person that ends up getting the most will usually pay for the teleporters/traps so the points usually end up evening out almost.

I personally don't really think it matters that much, the ends justifies the means, as long as you get far who cares.

Hopefully future maps have the Hacker and points are able to be transfered in bigger amounts then 500 (chump change past round 10).

[MegaAfroMan]

Thank you all for your thoughts and ideas, I do understand that there is no correct answer to my question but perhaps seeing other peoples ideas will help refine your own. As a community we need to learn from each other.

I personally believe, that running is fair as long as you are not the only one doing it. If your other three teammates are asking you to stick with them, I think perhaps you should give their plan a shot. After all this is a team game, and since records are rare with randoms, why not try to get a friend or two out of the match by being social and not running in a different corner of the map, with your mike muted unless there is ammo, monkeys, or you are downed.

@ Killallzombies- Yes I know there are more than those three places, but those three were the only ones I was comfortable with at the time. I am pretty sure I mentioned that in my writings above.

@ Tom852- Yes that is how the game is, but that does not mean that is how it has to be. It might have been enjoyable for you, but everybody has different tastes. I would have gotten bored with only a small trickle of zombies at any given time. I usually do not care about points or kills past a certain point either, but then again, neither do I care much about long (30+) term survival when I am playing with randoms. I have only gotten above 25 with randoms one time. All of my high rounds are done with my friend in private matches. It does not mean I will suicide at round 29, but I generally do not plan for the game to go that long, so I usually spend in strange ways, and often have a high chance of needing to leave the game at the higher rounds because I never plan that far. That does not mean I am right in that mindset, it just is my opinion.

@ iB Proto- Is this with randoms? With friends (or even cooperative randoms with mics) it is easy to create an agreeable plan. But when you have silent randoms or ones that disagree with the plan is it alright to force them to go with your idea? Huh, I actually prefer the spawn loop out of all of those. At 25-30 in the games I have had with friends I ran in the STG room and they sat on the catwalk or in the tunnel and sprayed at my zombies from which ever direction.

Anyways, thank you all for contributing!

Until next time,

MegaAfroMan

[iB Proto]

Thank you all for your thoughts and ideas, I do understand that there is no correct answer to my question but perhaps seeing other peoples ideas will help refine your own. As a community we need to learn from each other.

I personally believe, that running is fair as long as you are not the only one doing it. If your other three teammates are asking you to stick with them, I think perhaps you should give their plan a shot. After all this is a team game, and since records are rare with randoms, why not try to get a friend or two out of the match by being social and not running in a different corner of the map, with your mike muted unless there is ammo, monkeys, or you are downed.

@ Killallzombies- Yes I know there are more than those three places, but those three were the only ones I was comfortable with at the time. I am pretty sure I mentioned that in my writings above.

@ Tom852- Yes that is how the game is, but that does not mean that is how it has to be. It might have been enjoyable for you, but everybody has different tastes. I would have gotten bored with only a small trickle of zombies at any given time. I usually do not care about points or kills past a certain point either, but then again, neither do I care much about long (30+) term survival when I am playing with randoms. I have only gotten above 25 with randoms one time. All of my high rounds are done with my friend in private matches. It does not mean I will suicide at round 29, but I generally do not plan for the game to go that long, so I usually spend in strange ways, and often have a high chance of needing to leave the game at the higher rounds because I never plan that far. That does not mean I am right in that mindset, it just is my opinion.

@ iB Proto- Is this with randoms? With friends (or even cooperative randoms with mics) it is easy to create an agreeable plan. But when you have silent randoms or ones that disagree with the plan is it alright to force them to go with your idea? Huh, I actually prefer the spawn loop out of all of those. At 25-30 in the games I have had with friends I ran in the STG room and they sat on the catwalk or in the tunnel and sprayed at my zombies from which ever direction.

Anyways, thank you all for contributing!

Until next time,

MegaAfroMan

I only play with friends (or 'randoms' off these forums) so must people are pretty cooperative, I find myself to be a little bossy so MOST people usually do follow my idea or plan. If you find yourself to be the most experienced I think it is alright to boss around the people you are playing with; afterall your doing it for there own good.

P.S: I prefer the Thompson.

P.S.2: [brains] To You!