Round 100+ solo, round 60+ coop - patience or skill?

[Tom852]

Just did a game on Moon with the nr. 1 ranked on pc and with someone else. We aborted at 41 cause it was getting boring at some point. I thought, basically me and the best scored guy could easily break his record - I would be as capable as him to go to 72. Anyway, we aborted. So this question came up in my mind again: What is it actually, that leads to a record?

For the discussion:

:: Does it need patience or skill to reach insanely high rounds?

:: Can someone, that owns round 50, also own round 200?

:: Does someone, that could reach 100 by running skills but aborts at 50, have the same skill as the one that doesn't abort the game until 100 and successfully reaches 100?

:: Does exactly this - playing constant and not getting bored - make the difference in high-end skills?

===

My thoughts are very simple: It's only the patience. I feel like I could easily manage round 200 on Ascension solo, or do round 100 coop on maps like moon. But I just get that much bored, that I will abort the game at some point. I heard many saying, that it doesn't automatically mean, that when you can do 50, you can also do 100. But just considering the skill, I still say it would be easily possible. 50=100. Anyone going 50+ just shows patience, but since when is patience considered as a gaming skill?

What u think?

[perfectlemonade]

I don't think 'patience' is the right word. There are at least 50 people on this site that could own world records—and I'd like to think that I'm included in that group. But, the problem is, we're human. We get tired. And thus, especially on co-op, our play deteriorates after 5-7 hours.

Like I've always said, I think there's a threshold (I'm going to start calling this the 1337 Line) where it stops being about skill, and start being about time management, attention span, amount of caffeine in your system, etc. Your mind starts to decompose. You yearn for sleep, rest. So, to an extent, yes, I think there is skill involved. But I think, once you pass the 1337 Line, the only that holds you back is human limitations.

[selectyeti89]

It does have to do with patience but alot of it is skill. Example, I got to 87 on ascension and my highest on that map before was 53, we though we were going to get 99 but there was so much framerate lag and we were just so tired and everything not even related to skill was happening thats why we died. Now I can still play good after 20+ hours though and with alot of framerate lag because my skill has increased by alot. So basicly its one thing to be good on round thirty after playing for an hour or two but round 80+ is a whole other game almost. Because your exhausted and the framerate lag and you cant kill them with anything but wonder weapon and traps.

[Superhands]

I think what people ignore when they say 'going to 50 and 100 are basically the same, you just need patience' is this:

Sure, while everything is going smoothly, the game is easy to a decent player. But what happens when things get dangerous or things go wrong? A decent player may or may not be able to take control of the situation. A highly skilled player will take control of the situation 90% of the time.

In other words, it takes a highly skilled player to recover consistantly each time something goes wrong.

I've said it before and I'll say it again - if you haven't been to round 100, you can't claim that you can do it. Due to the boredom factor that can creep in, mistakes will happen if you don't pay attention. As I just said, if you don't have the skills to recover when things do go wrong, you can't continue.

Also, you don't run out of ammo at round 50. In the 70+ rounds, you have to recycle your wonderweapon pretty frequently. That alone takes good tactics and skill to do safely - I know from personal experience that if you half-ass it, you will pay dearly.

So, as much as it's about patience, you can't do it without skill. Round 50 and round 100 aren't the same thing by any stretch.

Also another thing to prove my point from a co-op perspective:

Just did a game on Moon with the nr. 1 ranked on pc and with someone else. We aborted at 41 cause it was getting boring at some point. I thought, basically me and the best scored guy could easily reach that round together - I would be as capable as him to go to 72.

Tom, you know that yourself and I could go to round 72 if we wanted, but as you said it's a bit tedious to do the whole thing in one go, as you'd know from when we went to 60 on Ascension together before giving up. The only reason we could do this is because we're both skilled players. If one goes down, we have the skills to revive that player every time and see to it that they recover. Without those skills, we wouldn't be able to do it.

[Chopper]

I believe it takes both plus the ability to concentrate for extended periods of time.

Super really hit the nail on the head - a skilled player will recover 90% of the time, and I think this figure is a little low. But to recover after having had no problem for 4 hours, and to have been playing for 10+ is down to concentration.

I think I'm a pretty good player, but I wouldn't ever claim knowledge that I could definitely get to 100.

[Superhands]

I think I'm a pretty good player, but I wouldn't ever claim knowledge that I could definitely get to 100.

This coming from someone that I believe to be someone that knows a LOT about how to play this game. Although, I know full well that Chopper has the skills required to do it ;)

[Tom852]

But won't people get sorted out before 50, when they can't handle a tricky situation?

[piepwns]

I say it is nothing but patience and being able to go without playing any other games for as long as the run takes . Honestly, its repetition, repetition, repetition, and as long as you don't do anything stupid, round 75 is going to be just as hard as round 1,000,000,000,000,000,000.

[Superhands]

I say it is nothing but patience and being able to go without playing any other games for as long as the run takes . Honestly, its repetition, repetition, repetition, and as long as you don't do anything stupid, round 75 is going to be just as hard as round 1,000,000,000,000,000,000.

I just fail to agree with this on any level, and I find it ironic that all of the people who completely disregard the skill required are those that haven't accomplished it themselves.

If some people say 'you can go as long as you're patient enough to do so', then surely every single game would end by suiciding, right? This clearly isn't the case, for anyone. Most of the players on here will most likely tell you that their highest round ended because they generally died.

As I seem to be repeating, if you haven't experienced a round 100 run you can't comment on how easy or not it is. Some people that I consider to be great players have recently gone for 100, some of them being members here, and they have said they were surprised at how difficult it was. They wouldn't have gotten all that far if it wasn't for their skills and tactical prowess.

Of course, some players will tell you it's easy. That's because these guys know what they're doing. I too personally don't find it too difficult these days, but that's because I've played the game a lot and I've honed my skills. But the first time I made 100, I was a pretty average player, and it took me a good 5 attempts to get it right and I almost didn't make it that 5th time, in fact I'd still call it a lucky attempt.

[Ehjookayted]

     The skill never tops out, and while I, like ChopperNator, cannot claim to have been to 100, I can say that the skill required is tremendous, because you are not only battling hordes of the undead, you are battling yourself. 8-)

[BlindBusDrivr]

I think that the skill caps off at a certain point because they just get so strong that only the insta kill weapons can realistically kill them anymore. From there it's just how much time you have to keep on going.

The map is also a very important factor.

Like Kino requires much less skill than let's say Shangri La.

On Kino you have MANY traps and the best wonder weapon for those 'oh sh*t!' moments.

Whilst on Shangri La there's narrow spots, a wonder weapon that has a much smaller radius, camping prevention zombies, etc.

But I do find that it is more patience for those incredibly high rounds.

I believe some good players that already have the skill find that they only need patience to get high rounds and that's where it kind of comes from.

I agree that it might take more patience at times, but I mean just think of how many hours it takes to get that far. You'd need a crapload of patience to get to the 100's on solo of 60+ in co op.

Also in biological terms, co-op high rounds are incredibly tough because you cannot pause it and it takes A LOT of time to get that far. And as humans we still have to go to the bathroom, eat, drink, and sleep. or we will die.

[piepwns]

Honestly, I would have gotten past round 100 before if I had that much time and a mom lenient on an electric bill that high I know that is has skill in it, but as long as you know exactly what you are doing, and you have seen every which way zombies come from, and every variable for zombie spawning and behavior when running you train, and you don't get lazy and zig when you should zag, then it's nothing but patience.

[Superhands]

you have seen every which way zombies come from, and every variable for zombie spawning and behavior when running you train, and you don't get lazy and zig when you should zag

This all comes under skills, my friend Without this knowledge, you cannot go to round 100.

[piepwns]

Alright, let me put it this way, you first have to become very, very experienced at zombies and very, very familiar with it, and very, very skilled at it. After that, it is nothing put patience. There is a cap to how good you can become before high rounds is nothing but patience, and you can no longer test how good you are at zombies by seeing how many rounds you can survive, you have to set restrictions and see how long you can survive with these restrictions.

[MysteryMachineX]

Tom, I think you are going about it wrong. Of course you think gaming is just about patience because you are really good at it. Others however aren't so fortunate. I think I'm good; not as good as you from what I've seen, but I'm not terrible. Zombies requires skill. The more skill the better. However, eventually your skill will give you the maximum ease in the game, and then it comes down to patience. You need both to get to really high rounds. And what is wrong with that? If a guy uses his finely honed gaming skills patiently to get a high record, what is wrong with that? Patience is a virtue.

[Superhands]

Alright, let me put it this way, you first have to become very, very experienced at zombies and very, very familiar with it, and very, very skilled at it. After that, it is nothing put patience. There is a cap to how good you can become before high rounds is nothing but patience, and you can no longer test how good you are at zombies by seeing how many rounds you can survive, you have to set restrictions and see how long you can survive with these restrictions.

EXACTLY, so while patience obviously plays a huge part, skills are needed!

I think if there was a 'both' option in the poll it would get the most votes, or it should do at least. Saying it takes no skill at all is just ridiculous.

[Tom852]

The question I wanna ask is not "What is needed for 100". The question is: Assuming you have enough skills to reach 50, are further skills needed to go to 100, or is only patience needed? So we talk about 51-100, not about 1-100.

I deliberately skipped the both option.

[Superhands]

Well I guess the most suitable option would have been a 'yes or no' poll in that case. I'd still answer yes to that, 1-50 and 50-100 require a whole different mindset and lots of experience i.e. skill.

[Phantom]

I've been on a couple really high runs, and things do get messy every now and then, you have to have a lot of to be able to do it, but patience is a huge virtue. I can't tell you how many times I've started a long solo Moon run, only to die because I'd been trying to speed things up, and not take it slowly because of the cosmonaut.

It does have to do with patience but alot of it is skill. Example, I got to 87 on ascension and my highest on that map before was 53, we though we were going to get 99 but there was so much framerate lag and we were just so tired and everything not even related to skill was happening thats why we died. Now I can still play good after 20+ hours though and with alot of framerate lag because my skill has increased by alot. So basicly its one thing to be good on round thirty after playing for an hour or two but round 80+ is a whole other game almost. Because your exhausted and the framerate lag and you cant kill them with anything but wonder weapon and traps.

Make everyone hold a claymore, it gets rid of framerate lag instantly. I'm pretty sure it works 100% of the time. Sithbas told me that little tip, and he's hit plenty of solo world records, holding 99 on both Ascension and CotD and hit solo world records for pretty much every map if I'm right.

[way2g00d]

claymore tip is very commonly known. The only drawback with this is sometimes claymores can't help you when you are sorrounded in solo. You need a power weapon to clear things up. But it works for most part.

Sithbas has a solo world record on Five. He has Round 99 co-op world record for Moon and Five. He recently did a 4 man land WR with Relaxing end, Arham and Matomaster. Video should be out soon. I keep insisting him to join the forum . Last time I asked him his excuse was "Oh, I thought the site was down."

[xFaTaLx RaMpAgE]

I'd say it is more skill than anything else. Yes there is obviously patience involved but no matter what you say you need a ton of skill. If skill didn't matter than why has nobody hit round 200? Almost all of the high round runs end in death or g spawn errors, not suicide. It also depends on the map, take verruckt for example; there's been plenty of people who have been to 30 or 40 on co-op. but just because they get ere doesn't mean they can get to 50, 60, or 70. Look at the number of people above 60 on verruckt, it's only like 10 or so.

I think your overall skill includes your ability to focus over a long period of time and not slack off.

[Phantom]

claymore tip is very commonly known. The only drawback with this is sometimes claymores can't help you when you are sorrounded in solo. You need a power weapon to clear things up. But it works for most part.

Sithbas has a solo world record on Five. He has Round 99 co-op world record for Moon and Five. He recently did a 4 man land WR with Relaxing end, Arham and Matomaster. Video should be out soon. I keep insisting him to join the forum . Last time I asked him his excuse was "Oh, I thought the site was down."

He definitely should join, and when I watched his five video, he said "this'll be my last solo run I do" so I just assumed I guess and I didn't know the claymore trick until he told me.

[Silentcrisis]

A bit of both to be honest. I quite often get to 50 on solo maps, however I find after that it begins to get repetetive, not to mention the amount of time it takes. So in that aspect I think it takes patience, however obviously you need to have a lot of skill and knowledge of spawns and how to run the zombies. It only takes one little mistake and you're down, and if you're going for those high rounds then you're gonna need all the quick revives you can get. I'm confident I can reach round 100+ on some of the maps however I don't have the time or patience to go through with it.

[selectyeti89]

claymore tip is very commonly known. The only drawback with this is sometimes claymores can't help you when you are sorrounded in solo. You need a power weapon to clear things up. But it works for most part.

Sithbas has a solo world record on Five. He has Round 99 co-op world record for Moon and Five. He recently did a 4 man land WR with Relaxing end, Arham and Matomaster. Video should be out soon. I keep insisting him to join the forum . Last time I asked him his excuse was "Oh, I thought the site was down."

I used to always hold claymores but now I just deal with the lag. And when a teammate goes down it gets much worse because they cant hold a claymore while down. And 99 on five on co-op? I really dont believe that at all. If he did there is no way its legit. I will believe on solo though.

[way2g00d]

(offtopic sorry Tom): @select, i misquoted the stats. His high on co-op is 90+ and that was long time ago. I don't know the legitimacy of the game but I do know he is a solid player like Super and yourself.