Conquering dynamics of zombies

[Mr. Jay]

Hi, I'm changing my name to Jay Walker.

Isn't it unfair that Lemonade can easily reach 334 kills on NML when I can't PAP anymore? Isn't it unfair that 5and5 can reach round 50 with anyone within two hours goofying around when I can't even reach round 40? Isn't it unfair that Chopper can reach round 24 without opening any doors on Der Riese when I can't even do that with jug and better weapons?

I sub all their channels and analyse all their moves and quite frankly can pull them off as well, until when it really counts. What makes them far better than me when I can do similar moves? Why are they far more success and I'm just a bum?

Is it instincts? EyeCntSpel once made a great point about the instincts impact the flow of the game. You feel the hazardous situations and instinctively react to the danger, all without even having registered them in your mind.

Is it decision making? Most of my downs were attributed by poor decision makings within the chaos of the game. The "No risk no gain" motto has doomed me almost everytime.

Is it concentration? My mind seem to drift away from time to time. I blame Jessica Alba, I blame Gangnam Style, I blame leather whips among many others. Best players always refer to concentration as their biggest asset.

Is it luck? Some people have "it", some people have the anecdote for "it". I have seen Way spend the box and get ray gun on the first try thousands of times, yet I waste the 30 grand and stuck with HS10. Not implying that that he is all luck, but stating it always helps to have lady luck on your side.

Is it attitude? When I was struggling with NML Tom once told me to pretend it was round 5, approach it as if you knew you would conquer it. Confidence breeds success, if you already have the basic skills in place.

Is it strategy? Knowing the best place to be and safest place to run make things that much easier and that much faster for success.

Time to cast your vote, what do you feel is the most important aspects in the dynamics of the Nazi zombies?

[way2g00d]

Insticts.

Just

do

it

Great thread here full marks.

[MysteryMachineX]

I'd have to same primarily instincts, however, I would not call them that. Instincts suggests that it is a value they were born with. That is quite the opposite of the truth. The truth is that they've played this game or shooter games in general to such an extent that they have conditioned their mind and body to react almost instantaneously in any situation in the game. This requires decision making, but they do it nearly instantaneously without even realizing it. Concentration can help, but it is hardly a big factor. When someone is good enough on "instinct" then they will often forsake concentration, although I personally wouldn't advise it. Luck is just that luck. It influences every game, but in an unpredictable fashion, be it for good or bad, but luck, as defined by probability, typically evens out in the long run. Attitude helps, but I see it on the same plane as concentration. Strategy is a big factor however. Most of the big players can't go on without SOME type of strategy to live up to 50-100's. However, lesser players like myself much more heavily rely on strategy just to get to the 50's. I say that because some players can just goof around on Kino der Toten and still go into high Rounds.

I'm going to refrain from voting however, as I don't think instincts deserves the vote, and I can't vote for anything else.

[Mr. Jay]

I'm going to refrain from voting however, as I don't think instincts deserves the vote, and I can't vote for anything else.

No problem my friend, your opinion is always welcomed and appreciated.

I may not always agree with you, actually I find myself rarely fully agree with your thoughts, but I always sense a great deal of your apprehension to be well thought out and amicable to disagree. Although I do not always agree with your thoughts, I can certainly respect and feel immensely educated by your view.

[MysteryMachineX]

I'm going to refrain from voting however, as I don't think instincts deserves the vote, and I can't vote for anything else.

No problem my friend, your opinion is always welcomed and appreciated.

I may not always agree with you, actually I find myself rarely fully agree with your thoughts, but I always sense a great deal of your apprehension to be well thought out and amicable to disagree. Although I do not always agree with your thoughts, I can certainly respect and feel immensely educated by your view.

Thank you. That's the best way to disagree. :)

[Chopper]

Application of strategy makes decision making easier and lessens the need to rely on instincts.

Decision making is by far the most important thing as it overlays everything.

Instincts help you do the crazier stuff, but generally making good decisions can avoid a lot of that crap.

Knowledge could be considered the most important thing, but again that covers pretty much everything.

[perfectlemonade]

Yeah, definitely decision making. You gotta know when to back off and when to go for broke. One could possibly put instincts and decision making in the same category, but really decision making will make or break you. It is, in my opinion, the fundamental, defining feature of Zombies. Sure, there are strategies, and in-game situations can merit split-second, instinctive reactions, and yes, you will not be getting very far without the right state of mind, but really, the only thing Zombies is is a huge collection of decisions it forces you to make. Do I revive? Do I zig instead of zag? Do I use traps or do I spin the box for the Thundergun? I could go on forever—in fact, I started writing a thread about the decisions of Zombies that never really materialized. But, alas, you get my point.

Decision making trumps everything.

[Mr. Jay]

The more I think about it and the more I analyze it I believe its more case by case.

For solo games, going for high rounds, decision make trumps over anything else. As long as you play it safe and not make mental mistakes success is there for the taking.

For challenges and co op games instincts play a much bigger role. One needs to constantly stay alert and react fast to eliminate unnecessary downs. You may play it safe, but some unpredictable variable will get you without good instincts.

Once you reach round 30 or higher, strategy becomes the leading factor. 5and5 is constantly developing faster safer ways to reach higher rounds.

To conquer NML, one needs pure instincts, while other aspects play minimal roles.

At this point of my gaming, I improve mainly from better decisions and better strategies, with instincts somewhat plateaued.

How does one improve his instinct? Or is each person limited by his talents?

[TheDunbarian]

How does one improve his instinct? Or is each person limited by his talents?

I would never say that one is limited by his talents. If I told myself a year and a half ago that one day I'd reach round 93, I'd tell myself that I'm crazy. Practice makes perfect.

And that's exactly how one would improve his instinct. Calling it "instinct" is technically incorrect, because instincts are inborn traits common among an entire species. Humans actually have very few of these. We have reflexes, and certain ways of thinking of things, but very few instincts. (I'm taking a psychology class right now, and felt the need to correct this ) However, one would be correct to call what you're talking about a "second nature". Play zombies a lot, you'll soon develop this second nature which would grant you better reaction time to certain situations. It's just like driving, or playing an instrument. We weren't born with ingrained knowledge of how to play, but now it's hard to imagine not knowing what to do.

[MysteryMachineX]

Knowledge could be considered the most important thing, but again that covers pretty much everything.

I disagree. It's a warm thought, but it doesn't seem to work. I've studied Zombies long and hard. See my storyline and my Zombies guide. I don't mean to sound conceited, but I honestly believe I know quite a lot about Zombies. However, I am not a pro when it comes to getting high Rounds. My highest is 48, which I consider to be "advanced", but not "pro".

[Chopper]

Knowledge when applied to game mechanics is the most important thing.

It's only developed by hours and hours of playing. It's the difference between 'screen shaking' and screen shaking. One is done by many....generally people flop around like an epileptic fish, generally for no actual gain. The shaking is almost always too late and helps in no way.

Then you have a very small group of people who actually have mastered this, and realise exactly how and when to turn to avoid stupid amounts of hits. It's not even a shake, it's just a tiny movement in the relevant direction generally opposed in a somewhat opposite direction by the other analogue stick.

If you are good at this you will almost never get hit by dogs....dogs are actually good for practicing this on.

Knowledge of how big a gap needs to be, what gaps you kneed to take sideways, which path will lead to oly 2 hits as opposed to the other which is 4.

Conceited or not, I know why all this stuff is important. Until you understand all the little stuff like that, your knowledge has room for improvement.

[MysteryMachineX]

That's not exactly the same thing. That's like saying a Marine is as knowledgeable as an astrophysicist. A Marine is adept in his hardcore skills; so could you say he is knowledgeable in what he does? Yes. Same for the scientist. However, they're two different things. The scientist has a database of information that he studies, while the Marine has a database of information that goes along well with the "second nature" Dunbarian was talking about. I know a lot about Zombies, but short of playing the game every waking moment for a long time, I will never be able to gain the knowledge of exactly the most efficient way to move about in Zombies like a pro can.

[Mr. Jay]

I understand what Chopper is referring to. Knowledge of gaming situations, what works under certain conditions and what will not, often make the difference. I have learned much from watching my favorite guys on Youtube and tightened up on my execution.

Remember this when I first signed up?

viewtopic.php?f=83&t=20603

I have gotten much better since, however I still feel very limited in my abilities, no matter how much knowledge I seek. I understand practice makes perfect, but not everyone can run sub 10 seconds in 100 meters.

I love the grenade off the wall on NML, and the jumping trick on Der Riese first room. But no knowledge can change the fact that I cannot pull them off. There are more factors between Chopper the world record holder, and Jay Walker the clown. He has "it", the inexplainable unobtainable winning aura above him. I have the old woman's dirty underwear wrapped around my head to insure I never make it.

[Tom852]

I think:

[*:2eqpg8lf]First, you need a good strategy.
[*:2eqpg8lf]Second, this strategy needs a lot of practice to work. So you need to develop second nature (sounds like a parallel universe to me, whatever).
[*:2eqpg8lf]Third, those instincts will help you to make the right decisions.
[*:2eqpg8lf]Fourth, you need concentration to make the right decisions all the time.
[*:2eqpg8lf]Fifth, attitude will help to play less nervous and more concentrated.
[*:2eqpg8lf]Sixth, luck will support your easy going attitude.

So, it all starts with the strategy. But that is not Jay's problem. I'm thinking of what was my basic problem in NML. And it is *trrrrrrrrr* attitude!! Why, why would I fail 100 times, and then do TWO 300+ in a row? What else could it be than attitude?

[MysteryMachineX]

What else could it be than attitude?

... Luck...

[5and5]

First I would like to say 50 in 2 hours co op, I don't think that's possible. I've done in 2 and a half though.

Anyways back to the matter in hand. I believe that aditude is they most important in the long run. Since every thing you have listed can far improved on if looked at with the right aditude. For exmaple:

Luck: You can not rational luck to be the solo factor in why certain people can do amazing thing and you can't. You have to have the aditude in were luck isn't a factor in your play. You have to think that you can make your own luck.

Concentration: This may be the most effected by aditude. To keep concentrated for a long period of time is very hard and almost impossible in a bad state of mind. If your aditude is, no mistakes till I reach my goal. You are far more likely to succeeded than if your attitude is, hopefully I don't mess up before I get my to my goal.

Decision making: Your aditute on decision making has to be very strict. The best way and one of the only ways to improve decision making is learn from your mistakes. 99% of the time a down is caused by bad decision makin. So instead of getting furstarted that you down, calmly think back to what happend and try and pin point exactly why you downed and more importantly make sure to not make the same decision the next time. The worse thing you can do is thinking that there was nothing that you could have done, since that is never the case there is always something that you could of done!

Instinct: You must trust your instincts. If you do not then you have to improve them. How you may ask, well the same way you get better at any thing practice. The best way of improving instinct is by playing challenges such as nml.

Maybe, I change to topic from what is most important to how to improve but.. Meh. Here is my two cents.