Theory; Flamethrower/Flame Based Wonder Weapon?

[Megaton A]

I originally posted this in the TranZit forum, in my thread about the update causing zombies to die off and end the round when you get too far away from them. I had said in the first post that I found that some zombies would respawn, and some would just die and end the round, and that I couldn't figure out a pattern to it. Here's what I figured out and why I think it possibly relates to Die Rise;

Ok, so I haven't had a chance to play Zombies since the morning the patch came out and I started this thread, but in that game I did go to to round 23 or so and did a lot of running around in the fog. I was thinking about how I would have some zombies respawn a bunch of times, and some/most would just die off and end the round. I was thinking there had to be some kind of pattern or cause to make them die off and not respawn. Then I started thinking about what areas I ran where they did respawn and where they didn't. I think I figured it out;

FIRE.

Zombies that followed me from the bus depot to the diner died. The ones that followed from the diner to farm to died. Farm to power? Died. But when I ran from power to the town the last zombie respawned multiple times. When I ran from the farm to town using the shortcut the last zombie kept respawning... until I got into town and to the bank. Zombies running through areas with no fire would survive.

Again, I haven't had a chance to test this yet, but I think this is the cause. For some reason, Treyarch changed how the fire affects the zombies, and the ones that take fire damage will not respawn like they used to.

Now; theory time. Why would they just randomly change how fire affects the zombies? Why now? Well, my guess (and again, just an educated guess based on what I believe to be the facts) is that the new Wonder Weapon in Die Rise will be flame-based in some way. It makes sense... we've had lightning, wind, freeze ray, a "microwave" effect, a shrink ray... but never a flame-based Wonder Weapon. It seems kind of obvious, really. What was one of the biggest gun requests for Zombies in Black Ops? The flamethrower. I could be wrong, but I think we're getting a flame weapon in a couple days...

Any thoughts? Possibly even a return of the W@W flamethrower. Or maybe I'm way off and will be proven completely wrong. Regardless, I think it makes enough sense to be worth sharing.

[deathb4di2h0nor]

Not too sure about the flame-thrower thing, as I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion...

As for an answer to the "No Respawn" problem, I think you are spot on. You notice I said think, as I can't test this just yet either... :cry: I definitely think you are on to something though.

[Megaton A]

Not too sure about the flame-thrower thing, as I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion...

As for an answer to the "No Respawn" problem, I think you are spot on. You notice I said think, as I can't test this just yet either... :cry: I definitely think you are on to something though.

Sorry, maybe I wasn't clear enough. They changed how the zombies are affected by fire, and they made this change in the update that prepares the game for Die Rise. I don't think the intended effect was to make zombies die and end rounds in TranZit, because the result is that you don't have to kill zombies anymore... just run around in the fog and as long as they have touched fire at some point they will die. It's far too exploitable to be intended for TranZit, in my opinion. So I believe that the change to how fire affects zombies is intended for Die Rise (but the mechanics changed the entire mode instead of map-by-map). And the only reason I can think that they would do that is if we are getting a fire weapon or a fire trap.

[deathb4di2h0nor]

I see. Well that's reasonable enough. I think they knew it would affect Green Run, but I don't think they knew the extent of what they were doing. Adding the patch to add damage to the zombies is fine with me. It brings more surprises, and with a game as repetitive as this one, I kind of enjoy when something goes wrong and I have to think on the fly.

That being said, (not disproving your theory) I think the added this as something else we have to worry about. I'm with you though, I hope we see a fire wunder weapon or at least the return of the flame thrower. If in fact the next "Wannabe wunder weapon" is in fact a buildable, I see the flame thrower as being very likely.

[Megaton A]

I see. Well that's reasonable enough. I think they knew it would affect Green Run, but I don't think they knew the extent of what they were doing. Adding the patch to add damage to the zombies is fine with me. It brings more surprises, and with a game as repetitive as this one, I kind of enjoy when something goes wrong and I have to think on the fly.

That being said, (not disproving your theory) I think the added this as something else we have to worry about. I'm with you though, I hope we see a fire wunder weapon or at least the return of the flame thrower. If in fact the next "Wannabe wunder weapon" is in fact a buildable, I see the flame thrower as being very likely.

You could be right, but I just find it hard to believe Treyarch intended this patch for TranZit without ever thinking "Wait- couldn't the players just run around the map, never shooting any zombies, and fly through rounds just by having them die on their own?" Especially when the community figured out the exploit in about 5 minutes.

Either they made this change because they intended it for Die Rise and failed to look too deeply into the effect it would have in TranZit (or at least how it could be exploited), or they did realize that it could be exploited and didn't care. Since they've been clearing the leaderboards of people with high rounds and 0 kills in the past, and have always been adamant about trying to fix "glitch spots", I kinda doubt they didn't care about an exploit that could let you run through rounds without kills.

Actually, there's a third option... they realized it, they cared, but didn't have time to make proper adjustments because the patch needed to be out in time for Die Rise. Obviously, this would also mean the patch was intended for something in Die Rise, otherwise they would have just waited until the exploit was fixed to send the update out.

Also, we've been told there will be "upgradeable wonderweaponry" in Die Rise, so I'm guessing it won't actually be buildable. But you raise a good point! Maybe it's not the Wonder Weapon, but another buildable gun besides the new Wonder Weapon that works as a homemade flamethrower.

Edit; as I posted in my thread about the TranZit update, I think I have a good theory about what happened. Theory; Black Ops II determines zombie respawns based on "player damage" vs "environment damage". Meaning that if a zombie is damaged by a player and the player goes too far away, the zombie dies and will count towards the wave and end the round. If the zombie was damaged by the environment, it would instead respawn. Well, since there's no weapon in TranZit that primarily deals fire damage, all fire was lazily programmed in as "environment damage". Now they're adding a flame weapon or trap to Die Rise, and they had to change fire to "player damage", resulting in what is going on with TranZit. TranZit will probably be patched later to deal with the changes. /theory

[deathb4di2h0nor]

True that. It can't be quicker to run though can it? It seems like you would be dealing with some zombies dying and others respawning. Wouldn't it be easier for a less talented person to get in a glitch and fly through rounds getting headshots behind a shield? Why would a glitcher chance running in the fog? I'm sure there are people out there who will, but it just seems like if someone was going to glitch on Tranzit, there are much more entertaining ways than running in the fog listening to the denizens and blind.

[Riot]

I don't know what the WW will be in Die Rise but I hope you get it from the mystery box. I do not want to go through the jet gun process ever again, I'm sorry but I'd rather spend 40k on the mystery gun and get a WW then build it, it's just...normal for me.

[Flammenwerfer]

A fire based Wonder Weapon? Nah, it'd be my LEAST FAVORITE Wonder Weapon of all time.

FLAMMENWERFER WONDER WEAPON PLEASE TREYARCH

[MysteryMachineX]

A fire based Wonder Weapon? Nah, it'd be my LEAST FAVORITE Wonder Weapon of all time.

FLAMMENWERFER WONDER WEAPON PLEASE TREYARCH

LOL!

[Tasty Applesauce]

you've got me crossing my fingers for this now :P

[InfestLithium]

Y'know, it wouldn't sound like a bad idea at all. Tight spaces, vertical layout, seemingly interesting pathways with quite a lot of dead-ends. Perhaps if they made the Flame-based Wonder Weapon, it would have a very limited fuel system but produces a very high damage output. Sounds like it would be more of a path-clearer and defensive weapon than an offensive one. After all, this map seems like it screams survival.

[Megaton A]

Y'know, it would sound like a bad idea at all. Tight spaces, vertical layout, seemingly interesting pathways with quite a lot of dead-ends. Perhaps if they made the Flame-based Wonder Weapon, it would have a very limited fuel system but produces a very high damage output. Sounds like it would be more of a path-clearer and defensive weapon than an offensive one. After all, this map seems like it screams survival.

Yeah, I think it makes a lot of sense for a lot of reasons... I'm really interested to see if I'm right. It's all theory and assumption based on what I know about how patches work (which admittedly isn't a whole lot) and how I think the programming is working and has been tweaked in BOII Zombies. I'm not claiming to have uncovered something mind-blowing, and I could be completely wrong, but I do think I may be onto something.