The Real Reason Richtofen Talks To Samuel

[Taklok]

I originally posted this as a response on this thread. Have fun. viewtopic.php?f=139&t=28898&p=278617#p278617

For those of who don't click the link and want more information, here you go.

Richtofen wants your helpto complete his agenda, BUT at the same time, he is still playing his game. So the question is HOW can he expect you to help him?

Good question.

This is because he only speaks to Samuel. He has leverage over Samuel because he has eaten the flesh of a zombie, and he does not want the rest of the group to know. Therefore, Richtofen threatens Stu by telling him he will tell the group about the flesh he has eaten. This is the ONLY reason he ONLY talks to Samuel to get the EE done. It is not a matter that Samuel is special, it is a matter of Richtofen having a bit of leverage on him.

Now, because of this, Richtofen, while being the being of their destruction, is also the voice of salvation to Samuel, therefore due to this leverage and the fact that, you know, Samuel would rather not die, he listens to Richtofen's instructions.

TL;DR- There is nothing special about Samuel. Richtofen merely has leverage over him because of his choice to eat The Flesh, because Samuel doesn't want the rest of the group to find out, so he is forced to do Richtofen's bidding.

Thoughts and debate about this are welcome.

[CrimsonZombie]

Very Interesting topic but maybe this belongs in the asylum though. Also it make's sense of how his able to communicate with Richtofen. But I do have one question to ask. Why hasn't Samuel turned yet? The element should have produced through the blood system as it did with the dead corpses?

[Flammenwerfer]

Ah, so blackmail? Sounds plausible. I like it. 8-)

[Stop Mocking Me0]

Well let's look at this from richtofen's point of view...

He needs to stop maxis, who is also trying to accomplish a goal to obviously ruin richtofen's plans... So he has to balance helping the crew, and risk them helping maxis, or sending a horde in to kill them if they misbehave...

So he uses zombies as a sort of leverage to keep samule's crew from listening to maxis rather then him...

Or that's how I see things...

[CrimsonZombie]

Well let's look at this from richtofen's point of view...

He needs to stop maxis, who is also trying to accomplish a goal to obviously ruin richtofen's plans... So he has to balance helping the crew, and risk them helping maxis, or sending a horde in to kill them if they misbehave...

So he uses zombies as a sort of leverage to keep samule's crew from listening to maxis rather then him...

Or that's how I see things...

:shock: Wow.....another way to blackmail people. Man how is Maxis going to stop Richtofen blackmail. Maxis got his work cut out I guess .

[Taklok]

Very Interesting topic but maybe this belongs in the asylum though. Also it make's sense of how his able to communicate with Richtofen. But I do have one question to ask. Why hasn't Samuel turned yet? The element should have produced through the blood system as it did with the dead corpses?

Element 115 reanimates dead cells. It doesn't make you a zombie. Now, once you die and you've been EXPOSED to 115, then you become a zombie. As long as Richtofen can use the crew to achieve his agenda, he won't let them die, as seen in the Great Leap Forward cinematic.

Now, as for your theory, Mocking, that is essentially what I'm saying. This is one of those things where "Alright, Sam. You get them to do what I tell you, or I tell them that you ate the Flesh, they die, then I revive you to complete my agenda, rinse and repeat. Oh what, you'll do what I say? Oh goodie goodie! Off to the next obelisk you go!"

[CrimsonZombie]

Very Interesting topic but maybe this belongs in the asylum though. Also it make's sense of how his able to communicate with Richtofen. But I do have one question to ask. Why hasn't Samuel turned yet? The element should have produced through the blood system as it did with the dead corpses?

Element 115 reanimates dead cells. It doesn't make you a zombie. Now, once you die and you've been EXPOSED to 115, then you become a zombie. As long as Richtofen can use the crew to achieve his agenda, he won't let them die, as seen in the Great Leap Forward cinematic.

Ah, it only reanimates. I watch to many zombie movie's of people eating dead corpses then turning. Thank's for sighting my thinking.

[InfestLithium]

Good observation, friendo! You may also want to keep in mind that Stuhlinger is very paranoid much like Richtofen is/was. This makes him also a very susceptible person of interest to be manipulated.

[Taklok]

Thanks Lithium, and that is exactly my point. This just randomly hit me while I was working on my fun zombies related project, and it just all made sense all of a sudden. I KNEW there was nothing actually special about Stu!

[MNM1995]

That's quite a good idea with the blackmail, but my only problem with this is that if Richtofen so desperately needs the help of the survivors, why would he limit himself to only speaking to one of them? Surely if he just spoke to all 4 and said "Listen, help me or i'll make sure you don't survive." I'm pretty sure they'll do his tasks. Also, the Die Rise intro in my opinion kind of shows Samuel to have an inportant role, perhaps to important to pass up as just blackmail.

Regardless, a very good point to make and ome that could very easily be true!

[MNM1995]

Very Interesting topic but maybe this belongs in the asylum though. Also it make's sense of how his able to communicate with Richtofen. But I do have one question to ask. Why hasn't Samuel turned yet? The element should have produced through the blood system as it did with the dead corpses?

I know someone's already told you about needing to be dead to be reanimated, but there could be some good from this post.

As a result of Stuhlinger eating the flesh, the 115 from it that did go into his body could have some kind of linkage to the reason he hears zombie grains in his head throughout Die Rise? Just food for thought...

[Taklok]

That's quite a good idea with the blackmail, but my only problem with this is that if Richtofen so desperately needs the help of the survivors, why would he limit himself to only speaking to one of them? Surely if he just spoke to all 4 and said "Listen, help me or i'll make sure you don't survive." I'm pretty sure they'll do his tasks. Also, the Die Rise intro in my opinion kind of shows Samuel to have an inportant role, perhaps to important to pass up as just blackmail.

Regardless, a very good point to make and ome that could very easily be true!

Because he has no reason to. Why bother talking to all four, when you can convince one paranoid conspiracy theorist to do your bidding? I'm sure if he were to talk to all four, they would recognize him as the voice trying to kill them. Now, because of the fact that Stu is the only one who can hear him IN ADDITION TO the blackmail, the other three have no idea what the voice sounds like, so they can't say "Stu. Stahp. You stop listening to him." All they know is that A voice is talking to him, and even then, they pass this off as him being crazy, as also seen in the Great Leap Forward cinematic.

[MNM1995]

That's quite a good idea with the blackmail, but my only problem with this is that if Richtofen so desperately needs the help of the survivors, why would he limit himself to only speaking to one of them? Surely if he just spoke to all 4 and said "Listen, help me or i'll make sure you don't survive." I'm pretty sure they'll do his tasks. Also, the Die Rise intro in my opinion kind of shows Samuel to have an inportant role, perhaps to important to pass up as just blackmail.

Regardless, a very good point to make and ome that could very easily be true!

Because he has no reason to. Why bother talking to all four, when you can convince one paranoid conspiracy theorist to do your bidding? I'm sure if he were to talk to all four, they would recognize him as the voice trying to kill them. Now, because of the fact that Stu is the only one who can hear him IN ADDITION TO the blackmail, the other three have no idea what the voice sounds like, so they can't say "Stu. Stahp. You stop listening to him." All they know is that A voice is talking to him, and even then, they pass this off as him being crazy, as also seen in the Great Leap Forward cinematic.

Incase you haven't noticed, at least by Die Rise it seems Stu only really gets on with Russman (and even so i'm not 100% convinced he returns this liking). The others seem to see him as being completely insane, like you mentioned, however they also don't sem to value him as a team member, evidenced by quotes from Misty and Marlton regarding conversations with Stuhlinger being "useless".

He himslef is portrayed as being usless several times in the animated intro, firstly when he fails to understand what the voices are telling him. Next, when Russman dies all he can do is stand and watch in shock, despite clearly being armed with what looks like an Executioner. Next, whilst still in shock and seemingly facing an inpending doom, he requires Misty and Marlton to come and rescue him in the elevator. Then again, once he enters and regains his senses, he immediately asks Misty what the plan is. This shows us that he is unable to come up with anything, and perhaps looks up to Misty as a leader despite hating her, again portraying his uselessness to us. Again, near the end of the trailer he was unable to stop their inevitable fates of meeting their demise at the hordes of zombies waiting once the elevator doors open near the bottom. Finally, at the end of the intro, Samuel questions "Have we been here before?" This again shows him to be quite useless as he is doubting himself this time, however this could arguably be the least useful thing he does as he is merely stating what likely everyone was thinking already.

Also, the other characters do know of the voice and that it is the voice that talks to them when a power-up is picked up. This is supported by Misty's quote when running low on ammo, in which she may say "Come on crazy voice guy, throw us a Max Ammo!"

So, again I say why doesn't Richtofen just force them almost into doing his bidding? Why does he rely on Stuhlinger (who is unpopular with seemingly everyone) to ensure the survivors do Richtofen's bidding and not Maxis's?

[Taklok]

Good questions. This is gonna be a long one...

Alright. So, I'm going to start at the end and work my way up top, starting with your Misty quote. Misty is clearly refering to Richtofen, yes, but this in no way proves that the rest of the group is aware of the fact that Richtofen is the voice in Samuel's head. This demonstrates to me that they recognize that Richtofen is the one giving the power ups, and the fact that he is crazy. This we know.

The "Have we been here before" quote is an interesting point, BUT you have to keep in mind that in the cinematic they all died. They were brought back by Richtofen, and that's the purple flash at the end of the cinematic and that's WHY he asks if they'd been there before. It explains the deja vu whenever any character steps into the bank the first time. That is all that is demonstrating. Nothing more, nothing less. It shows they have the faint memory of being there, but they lost that whenever they die and are respawned.

Now, let's talk about Stu and his uselessness. I'm fairly certain that Stu asking what the plan was in the cinematic was not a question toward ONLY Misty, but a question toward BOTH Misty AND Marlton. Why? Well, let's see here, you've got the engineer who builds and develops things and has a good capacity for logic and reasoning, and you've got Misty who just likes to kick ass. I'd ask them for a plan too. It's not a matter of him NOT coming up with something, it's a matter of who NORMALLY comes up with a plan. When we had the O4, who do you think made the entire plan? It certainly wasn't Nikolai. It was Richtofen every single time. It was his role in the group. Every. Time. The same applies here. From a logical stand point, it would make sense that at least Marlton would be the one making plans, but you have to consider that he is Marlton, and Marlton does not do well with people, and he does not do well with pressure from what it appears. Misty just happened to be the one to answer while in the elevator. Now, as for REQUIRING rescue from Misty and Marlton with the elevator, I wouldn't say it was required. That seems much more like lucky timing to me.

Now, Misty calling Samuel useless? Yeah, I'd call somebody that I hate and want to be eaten by zombies useless too. BUT the fact of the matter is that they know that they need each other to survive, which is why they haven't just thrown him out.

Lastly, let's talk about Richtofen getting the other four to do his bidding. I'll do this in a convenient list type format.

Marlton- He is a man of science. Is he really going to listen to a voice in his head? No.

Misty- Misty doesn't seem like the type of girl who will told what to do by some guy, let alone some random voice in her head. Next!

Russman- He's old. He would dismiss it as hearing things due to his age. So that leaves.....

Samuel J. Stuhlinger.

He's paranoid, has a secret that he doesn't want the rest of the group to know, and the group dismisses him as crazy anyway. Why would you NOT use Samuel? I mean, I'm sure the group knows that A voice is telling Samuel what to do, I'm sure he would've told them. What they do NOT know is that it is indeed Richtofen.

[bagel_]

Marlton- He is a man of science. Is he really going to listen to a voice in his head? No.

Misty- Misty doesn't seem like the type of girl who will told what to do by some guy, let alone some random voice in her head. Next!

Russman- He's old. He would dismiss it as hearing things due to his age. So that leaves.....

Samuel J. Stuhlinger.

He's paranoid, has a secret that he doesn't want the rest of the group to know, and the group dismisses him as crazy anyway. Why would you NOT use Samuel? I mean, I'm sure the group knows that A voice is telling Samuel what to do, I'm sure he would've told them. What they do NOT know is that it is indeed Richtofen.

Ehh, I think you only have half of it down.

I think the only reason Stewie is hearing the voices is because of The Flesh. There IS something special with him.

Let's think back to the guys at Jackass Flats, right outside Nuketown. Those who were following Richtofen heard him, and were doing it for "The Flesh," where a person eats zombie flesh for either cannibalism or to get 115 in their system, making them more of a half/hybrid zombie. Everyone else had no idea what "The Flesh" was, and was following Maxis, unknowing of what this voice the others were hearing. If Richtofen could get into all their heads, he probably would've. But sense they were split, they got into a fight.

Now, keep in mind we know from the breakdown of the cutscene that Stu defiantly is part of the Flesh. We know about the Flesh from a ton of in-game radios and audio quotes.

So, the zombies, resurrected and controllable by 115, are controlled by Richtofen, and if Sammy has 115 in him too, would it not make sense for him to be the only one who can at least hear hear him, let alone be controlled? Otherwise, wouldn't it have been easier for Richtofen to just tell them all what to do or have them face death? I doubt he wouldn't have taken the risk of what happened at Jackass Flats again on the new crew if he had to, but sense Stu is the only one who ate the flesh, Richtofen has to take the risk. Sense he is already threatened by the zombies, Richtofen needs something else important with Stu to keep him going. And that would be his partners! How do you think a guy like him would function with no one but his cannibalistic self hearing clashing voices in his head, but not a single actual person to help?

So yes, he's keeping him blackmailed in, but I think that's just part of it.

[Taklok]

Please, correct me if I am mistaken, but were the O4 not experimented on with 115 to see it's effects on living subjects? Pretty sure they were indeed tested on. The 115 is NOT the issue here. What it did to them was erase their memories of what happened and messed up their minds entirely, such as Nikolai LITERALLY relying on vodka. The 115 is not the matter at hand. The flesh that contains the 115 is NOT the matter at hand. It's important, yes, but not in the fact that Stu is turning into a zombie or any other kind of nonsense. The consumption of The Flesh, or to me it seems, appears to be more of a statement of allegiance. Now, what we know about the people in Jackass Flats is that not everyone ate The Flesh. So why would they in the first place? Simple. People get scared, here things on the radio while the world is collapsing and they're trying to hold out at a fort, and they listen to the radio. This is where the radio transmission of The Flesh Organization/Whatever you want to call it comes in. The devouring of the flesh.

What we keep forgetting is that Richtofen is an omnipowerful being. He can do whatever he want, in whoever's head he wants, whenever he want. This theory might not apply to the situation in Jackass Flats, but it DOES apply here.

[bagel_]

Please, correct me if I am mistaken, but were the O4 not experimented on with 115 to see it's effects on living subjects? Pretty sure they were indeed tested on. The 115 is NOT the issue here. What it did to them was erase their memories of what happened and messed up their minds entirely, such as Nikolai LITERALLY relying on vodka. The 115 is not the matter at hand. The flesh that contains the 115 is NOT the matter at hand. It's important, yes, but not in the fact that Stu is turning into a zombie or any other kind of nonsense. The consumption of The Flesh, or to me it seems, appears to be more of a statement of allegiance. Now, what we know about the people in Jackass Flats is that not everyone ate The Flesh. So why would they in the first place? Simple. People get scared, here things on the radio while the world is collapsing and they're trying to hold out at a fort, and they listen to the radio. This is where the radio transmission of The Flesh Organization/Whatever you want to call it comes in. The devouring of the flesh.

What we keep forgetting is that Richtofen is an omnipowerful being. He can do whatever he want, in whoever's head he wants, whenever he want. This theory might not apply to the situation in Jackass Flats, but it DOES apply here.

You're right about the O4. It did erase their memories, but is Stu not having short-term memory problems as well? I'll get into the other effects later.

Richtofen is not necessarily an ultimate being. He's in control of the MPD, which as far as we know, is a device that directly puts a soul in the Aether, and from that portion of it connects to the 115 and has the ability to control it. My point with the situation at Jackass Flats is that their civil war started because Richtofen was only in some of their heads, and everyone that heard him sided with him. If only the people that heard him sided with him, why didn't he just go into everyone's heads and directly get them to do his tasks? Richtofen has power, but not all the power in the world. This happened before or while Stu was contacted by Richtofen.

Let's reference the quote we hear when we Richtofen contact Stu on Tranzit when we get the power on:

Richtofen:

...It seems that of your companions you appear to be the only one who can hear me...

Proof enough that he tried to get into the New Crew's heads, but failed, also proving he can't just do whatever he wants. He can only be in connection with one who has somehow gotten that much 115, and while you are living, it's side effects can result in being like the original 4. Keep in mind they could all hear Sam while she was in the MPD.

Also, we do not know what tests were put on the O4. I'm assuming that they were directly tested on, because it agrees with my theory. Stu and the members of The Flesh are getting their doses of 115 secondhandedly, not coming in direct contact with the element, but with the cells it has effected. And sense it doesn't go into the bloodstream, they aren't infected. They just have managed to get in close enough contact with the element to get a few effects, like the want of more Flesh and the ability to come in contact with the MPD host.

My main point is that Richtofen isn't really a god. Right now, he's just a ruler of a type of army that is currently conquering. More like a king, really. I don't mean to come across as I'm-right-you're-wrong, but I do love a good debate :)

[Taklok]

It is perfectly fine, and I figured I was starting to come off like that too. I too am enjoying this debate.

Alright, so Richtofen's powers. I believe it's safe to say that we don't know the full extent of them. That much I'm sure of. Now here's why I'm pretty sure the quote you included is just a lie meant to get Samuel to help him-

How is it that they can hear him perfectly as a group? I mean, they can OBVIOUSLY hear him, so how much different would initiating a one on one conversation with one of them being for someone who has abilities like Richtofen's? I don't think it would be, to be honest.

Lastly, as for his memory, I mentioned this before, and it's not JUST him. It's all of the new crew. This is because they repeatedly die, and Richtofen brings them back. This is how Treyarch explains respawning in the actual story. This is evident by the quotes upon entering the bank on Green Run and the opening cinematic on GLF.

[MNM1995]

Yeah Taklok, I don't want to start an argument on here too... I've got another argument already ongoing on a different topic about Richtofen not being the only voice in Samuel's head (this guy is telling me it is a fact that there is more than one voice in his head because of the Die Rise intro, and i'm saying it simply can't be because neither Samuel or Richtofen has confirmed it), but I think that's over now. Anyway, back on with this:

Alright, so Richtofen's powers. I believe it's safe to say that we don't know the full extent of them. That much I'm sure of. Now here's why I'm pretty sure the quote you included is just a lie meant to get Samuel to help him-

How is it that they can hear him perfectly as a group? I mean, they can OBVIOUSLY hear him, so how much different would initiating a one on one conversation with one of them being for someone who has abilities like Richtofen's? I don't think it would be, to be honest.

Lastly, as for his memory, I mentioned this before, and it's not JUST him. It's all of the new crew. This is because they repeatedly die, and Richtofen brings them back. This is how Treyarch explains respawning in the actual story. This is evident by the quotes upon entering the bank on Green Run and the opening cinematic on GLF.

I pretty much agree with most of this actually, although i'm not too sure on the last part. This is mainly because I believe that from TranZit onwards Richtofen is becoming weaker (especially if Maxis is being helped) and I don't think he'll have the power to continuously respawn the survivors. However, as you rightly pointed out, we don't know the extent of his powers so we can't really judge whether or not this ability consumes much/ any of his power.

[bagel_]

It is perfectly fine, and I figured I was starting to come off like that too. I too am enjoying this debate.

Alright, so Richtofen's powers. I believe it's safe to say that we don't know the full extent of them. That much I'm sure of. Now here's why I'm pretty sure the quote you included is just a lie meant to get Samuel to help him-

How is it that they can hear him perfectly as a group? I mean, they can OBVIOUSLY hear him, so how much different would initiating a one on one conversation with one of them being for someone who has abilities like Richtofen's? I don't think it would be, to be honest.

Lastly, as for his memory, I mentioned this before, and it's not JUST him. It's all of the new crew. This is because they repeatedly die, and Richtofen brings them back. This is how Treyarch explains respawning in the actual story. This is evident by the quotes upon entering the bank on Green Run and the opening cinematic on GLF.

That is a really good point. I was only thinking of the whole quote he gave on Tranzit:

Remember the time I couldn't remember that thing I kept on remembering? REMEMBER?

and the radio transmissions we hear at Die Rise, talking about how if someone close to you was experiencing symptoms like memory loss and such was a hint from Treyarch that Samuel was getting slightly infected, and the group would eventually notice it. But that appears to be for all of them with the whole let-yourself-die-then-memory-wipe from Richtofen. I thought wouldn't have a connection as a memory problem, but a just a deja-vu of being there before. Maybe it will come to them doubting themselves later, because Richtofen is making them have some of those symptoms.

I just find it so stupid that Treyarch had involved eating zombie flesh in the storyline, but it doesn't really have an effect on anything, but you've definitely proven me wrong. Thanks for getting me on the right path man!

[bagel_]

Yeah Taklok, I don't want to start an argument on here too... I've got another argument already ongoing on a different topic about Richtofen not being the only voice in Samuel's head (this guy is telling me it is a fact that there is more than one voice in his head because of the Die Rise intro, and i'm saying it simply can't be because neither Samuel or Richtofen has confirmed it), but I think that's over now. Anyway, back on with this:

Alright, so Richtofen's powers. I believe it's safe to say that we don't know the full extent of them. That much I'm sure of. Now here's why I'm pretty sure the quote you included is just a lie meant to get Samuel to help him-

How is it that they can hear him perfectly as a group? I mean, they can OBVIOUSLY hear him, so how much different would initiating a one on one conversation with one of them being for someone who has abilities like Richtofen's? I don't think it would be, to be honest.

Lastly, as for his memory, I mentioned this before, and it's not JUST him. It's all of the new crew. This is because they repeatedly die, and Richtofen brings them back. This is how Treyarch explains respawning in the actual story. This is evident by the quotes upon entering the bank on Green Run and the opening cinematic on GLF.

I pretty much agree with most of this actually, although i'm not too sure on the last part. This is mainly because I believe that from TranZit onwards Richtofen is becoming weaker (especially if Maxis is being helped) and I don't think he'll have the power to continuously respawn the survivors. However, as you rightly pointed out, we don't know the extent of his powers so we can't really judge whether or not this ability consumes much/ any of his power.

I don't mean to be jumping on everyone's backs, but Samuel is (as far as we currently know) only hearing Richtofen in his head. The demonic, beastly voice is still Richtofen. I've got a video of the cutscene for proof:

Skip to about 1:25, and listen. You'll hear the beastly, distorted voice say "Accept your fate. Begin anew!" then shortly after repeat itself, but slip into Richtofen's voice.

Now, is there a possibility that he still is hearing other voices outside of the ones he hears in GLF while you play as him and in the cutscene? Yes, but we have no way of knowing yet. It would be a cool twist to have another thing in there too, like some god of the Vril-ya.

[Taklok]

Ooh, three posts. Fun. Alright, so radio transmissions. Got to thinking about this one. ANd yes, while memory loss is one of the "symptoms", is this only because the person infected is slowly becoming a stupid hunk of meat, or is it government propoganda? (CONSPIRACY!) Although, I just think that quote is purely to show how paranoid into conspiracy theories Samuel is. I don't think it means anything. But then again, there are a good number of them like that. It might be. BUT, if Samuel was indeed becoming a zombie, couldn't Richtofen potentially have partial control over him? I feel that might be a possibility.

Now, I do believe that Richtofen is indeed getting weaker. Think about it like this. This never happened to Samantha, at least that we know of anyway. Why is that? Well, Samantha used small, local populations of zombies for the sole purpose of killing the O4. Richtofen, on the other hand, appears as if he's controlling every zombie at the same time, because that's what he wanted to do in the first place. I believe this would cause him to use up far more energy than Samantha ever did.

BUT I do remember on Moon, there is a Samantha quote after you complete the EE and are able to play has Samtofen where she says NOT to kill the zombies, because that only makes him stronger. So I don't have any idea about this subject, to be honest.

[bagel_]

Ooh, three posts. Fun. Alright, so radio transmissions. Got to thinking about this one. ANd yes, while memory loss is one of the "symptoms", is this only because the person infected is slowly becoming a stupid hunk of meat, or is it government propoganda? (CONSPIRACY!) Although, I just think that quote is purely to show how paranoid into conspiracy theories Samuel is. I don't think it means anything. But then again, there are a good number of them like that. It might be. BUT, if Samuel was indeed becoming a zombie, couldn't Richtofen potentially have partial control over him? I feel that might be a possibility.

Now, I do believe that Richtofen is indeed getting weaker. Think about it like this. This never happened to Samantha, at least that we know of anyway. Why is that? Well, Samantha used small, local populations of zombies for the sole purpose of killing the O4. Richtofen, on the other hand, appears as if he's controlling every zombie at the same time, because that's what he wanted to do in the first place. I believe this would cause him to use up far more energy than Samantha ever did.

BUT I do remember on Moon, there is a Samantha quote after you complete the EE and are able to play has Samtofen where she says NOT to kill the zombies, because that only makes him stronger. So I don't have any idea about this subject, to be honest.

Ya, though I do have one idea. Treyarch has made choosing sides an objective, and I think to make whatever automatically happens in the map has to agree with both sides at the same time, and the only way to do that was perspective.

I've been thinking that the beastly voice they gave Richtofen is both him gaining and losing power, based on perspective. If you powered Green Runs tower for Maxis, then Richtofen assumedly lost some power. So, the voice changed from that perspective to sounds almost like the Der Reise opening quote from the intercom. On the contrary, if you powered it for Richtofen, then we hear his voice become beastly, now almost inhuman, like he's become something much more powerful.

They have to appeal to both crowds somehow, but if Maxis' towers don't count until the end, then my idea is trash. So much conspiracy and so many hidden motives. The zombies storyline is better then any mystery novel you'll ever read.

[MNM1995]

This is what I argued on the other post, that Richtofen has to be the voice from the start as we know not of any other voices present in Samuel's head at the moment.

However, that's off topic- Yes Taklok, I agree with you that Richtofen may posess some control over Samuel but I think that's in the form of being able to enter his head. As has already been pointed put, Richtofen seemingly tried to enter all the other characters heads but to no prevail until he stumbled across the paranoid, flesh-eating person that is Samuel.

Also, to bagel, I also partially agree with you except that I believe Richtofen puts on the voice either because of his power gain from helping him in TranZit or to make him seem more powerful to Samuel (to ensure he doesn't decide to just ignore him because he's to weak) if Maxis is helped instead.

[bagel_]

This is what I argued on the other post, that Richtofen has to be the voice from the start as we know not of any other voices present in Samuel's head at the moment.

However, that's off topic- Yes Taklok, I agree with you that Richtofen may posess some control over Samuel but I think that's in the form of being able to enter his head. As has already been pointed put, Richtofen seemingly tried to enter all the other characters heads but to no prevail until he stumbled across the paranoid, flesh-eating person that is Samuel.

Also, to bagel, I also partially agree with you except that I believe Richtofen puts on the voice either because of his power gain from helping him in TranZit or to make him seem more powerful to Samuel (to ensure he doesn't decide to just ignore him because he's to weak) if Maxis is helped instead.

The one you put back at Taklok, refer back a few replies. He covered the "attempt" at getting into their heads in a pretty good way, and I don't think anyone would want to re-explain something as complicated as that.

And yes, either of us could be right. Right now, we don't have enough evidence to prove too much. Keep the theories coming man!