Zombies is Changing for the Worse

[Lenne]

I could actually live with all these changes. (I do not like them either but I don't hate them as much as you do.)

But the fact that this "new" zombie engine has basically destroyed my desire to play BO2 makes me sad.

Why does the game have FPS issues when I kill a group of zombies or when I just shoot some rounds into them.

Not to mention how much worse that gets when playing split screen. :?

[Edward Richtofen]

If you don't like the game then don't play it. Treyarch can make the game however they want. Calling people fanboys because they disagree with you is retarded. We're all fans of zombies here...otherwise we wouldn't be here.

So why don't you put in blops 1 and stop your whining. You seem to dislike the direction blops 2 has taken but guess what? Treyarch doesn't care, I don't care, no one cares. You don't like the game then don't play it, simple as that.

That's the perfect example of a fanboy. Just because I criticize a game that he loves, he berates me. Thank you for the excellent example Edward Richtofen!

You seem to not realize that games need to evolve over their lifespan to remain alive. If all they did was keep spitting out Nachts the game would have died. If all they did was stick to original 4 perks the game would've died. If all they did was make new blops 1 maps the game would be dying.

I've played zombies since WaW and own every cod title since cod 4. I am a fan of zombies and of cod in general. Do I blindly agree with everything they do? No. If that makes a 'fanboy' then so be it. I really don't give a shit what you label me as.

I would say what I label you as but it wouldn't be very nice so I won't.

Zombies has evolved and will continue to evolve as long as it's still alive. There will always be those who dislike the changes that are made but that won't stop the game from changing. Whether you like it or not, the game has moved on from blops 1 and it is not going back.

So you can either suck it up and adapt to the game or not.

[ETEl2NAL407]

I don't actually hate it. I've stated several times that I dislike it, but I do strongly dislike it so if you want to call that hate, be my guest. Close enough.

The reason is not just because of MotD. I was weary of Die Rise, as well. I eventually came to enjoy it, not nearly as much as TranZit and nowhere close to as much as the BO:1 maps, but that initially sparked my disdain. I gave it a chance though. Now with MotD, I'm seeing the path Zombies is heading down solidify and my fears that I experienced with Die Rise are coming to fruition.

Again, it's not Zombies that I dislike. It's not BO:2 that I dislike. It's the direction Zombies is headed in. I want to wave a giant stop sign at Treyarch.

[FatedTitan]

Hmmm...how do I address this.

I want to look at Facebook. Facebook is a social network that is always evolving. It seems as though every year there are petitions and anger that Zuckerberg is changing the layout and to keep the old layout. People want the same and hate change because it is what they're used to. But has that stopped Facebook from being the most successful social network ever created? Not at all. In fact, they are growing daily with the number of users who are active and communicating via their website.

I say all of that to say this. Studies have shown that if you give someone the same thing over and over, they'll become bored with it and quit. Facebook doesn't change for the sake of changing. They change because they know that while some people will complain, the "new" factor will keep them there exploring what's to be found and will also attract more users.

Bringing this into zombies, the same principle applies. If Treyarch had kept zombies what it originally was, meaning a Nacht Der Untoten style gameplay, then people would have left because they would have become bored with it. But they didn't. They added perk machines, new guns, Pack a Punch, teleporters, lunar landers, and so much more. They kept the game fresh and tried to make it where the players who had always been a part would still enjoy it, but new players could also come in and enjoy with them.

So by Chopper's summation, Der Riese and Kino were the best maps ever created. They offer no side quest, four perks, Pack a Punch, and ease of access for players. All of these things are fine. And if the bar hadn't been set for side quests, I don't think many people would even consider what it would be like to have them in any map. But let's say that we had kept those concepts. Every map that came out had no side quest, four perks, and Pack a Punch. Maybe not to some, but to many, that would become quite a bore after a while. One of the reasons people go back to certain maps is because of nostalgia. Why do you think people love Der Riese so much? Nostalgia and all of the NEW things it introduced. I may be seen as blasphemous for this, but Der Riese is not my favorite map. It's probably around number 4 on my list. Why is that? Because I didn't play zombies in World at War. So when I finally got the opportunity to play it, I had seen all this new stuff that had been added to the game mode and I just had an overall "meh" feeling to it. It's a good map, but far from their best work in my opinion.

New is what keeps players coming back and draws new players into the fray. In fact, if the developers hadn't incorporated "new" things, it would be extremely difficult to get high rounds on Moon or Shangri-la because we wouldn't have had a way to gain all perks forever. And Chopper, I know how much you like hitting high rounds. And while I know you prefer solo when doing it, you can't argue that difficulty that exists for a co-op team to attempt high rounds on Moon without doing The Big Bang Theory.

Companies must continually push the limits on what is new. Games are no different. In Black Ops 2, Treyarch wanted to make something fresh and innovative, but keeping the core of what zombies is. They introduced new game modes that would draw even more fans in and could be fun things to do outside of the norm of zombies. Grief brought PvP into zombies. Turned brought a classic 3v1 mode into zombies. Survival was a bland version of TranZit that incorporated the miniature sections of the large map for players to play on.

But one argument I saw you using ETERNAL was that you felt the need to choose between side quest(TranZit) or regular zombie slaying(Survival). That's your own choice. These zombie maps are made to have fun on. They aren't made for the side quests. Maps aren't formed around a side quest. They're formed to have fun. In TranZit, a bus was added that made getting to the different locations a safer journey and provided for some clutch escapes from awful situations. Buildables were added to give zombie players something new that they could do on the map. Your fault in thinking is believing that if I choose Mode A, I have to do B. If I choose Mode B, I have to do C. That's not the case. You can play TranZit without doing the side quest. You can play Die Rise without doing the side quest. In no way, shape, or form does Treyarch force you to build anything. Play and have fun.

In Die Rise, we were given elevators to deliver perks and bring us to new areas of the map. And while I know the frustration that happens when you're running to a perk machine only to find it not there, there are very few times when you can't just go down a floor and it's waiting for you. When I saw preview of Die Rise, I was afraid getting perks was going to be extremely difficult. That's not the case at all. There are plenty of spots to train and just slay zombies and then in one quick crawler, you can get all the perks you need and Pack a Punch. Heck, most of the time I'll go grab perks during the round because it's not that difficult to get them. It's an added element that brings more anxiety and fun into zombies.

In Mob of the Dead, new ways to power the map were added with Afterlife Mode. They gave us a Gondola that provides quick escapes and added an airplane to that gets us to Pack a Punch. Once again, none of this is a requirement to do. You say they are making it easier for new players by adding menus that tell what parts are needed and what parts you are lacking. This isn't so new players won't get lost. It's a helpful tool for even the oldest zombie veterans. It's something that probably should have been added in TranZit. And none of them are required. They're all fun side things you can do. The Golden Spork, while definitely helpful in getting to high rounds quicker, is not a requirement. They didn't have to add it in if we're just going to complain about it. I would think that obtaining a one shot melee weapon into the 30s should be difficult to obtain. It shouldn't be a matter of typing in 115 and a door opening to it. A weapon of that power should be difficult to obtain.

So I guess what I'm saying is that you can't limit things to certain mode. Just because you're playing TranZit, Die Rise, or Mob of the Dead doesn't mean that you are required to do the side quests. In fact, the modes are just names. At the end of the day, it's still our classic Survival just on larger maps. Yes, on Mob of the Dead it can be expensive to get around. But solo is going to be harder to get through doors. There are less zombies and the same amount of doors at the same price. I have no problem getting all the doors open when I'm playing with friends.

Stop assuming that things are a requirement for a map. Just play and have fun. That's what zombies is made for. Do that, and you'll find enjoyment. Zombies isn't changing for the worse. Statistics say that it's changing to keep the pace. If it didn't change at all, the things you love wouldn't be there. There would be no perks, no Pack a Punch, and Wonder Weapons, no dogs, nothing. Black Ops 2 Zombies just makes it more of a challenge and introduced more fun things for the players. Have they struck out in some areas? Of course. That's what taking risks will get you. Some things will be home runs and some will be strike outs. But did they hit home runs? Absolutely. Fun wonder weapons, more players than ever, and fresh, new environments have made Black Ops 2 a fun experience for a majority of players.

I'm sorry that you aren't enjoying your experience so far. Perhaps stop trying to be so competitive and relax with some friends and slay zombies. Forget about side quests. Forget about accomplishing Goal A or Goal B. Just sit back, relax, and slay zombies. If you want Jug, it's not hard to get. If you want to go to PaP on MotD, it's not hard at all. I normally grab those parts in the middle of rounds they're so easy to obtain.

Is zombies changing? Yes. But that's not something we should be worried about because at the end of the day, the core aspect is there. If you want to go back to the core aspect of zombies that you loved about _____ map, it's there. Just kill zombies and have fun.

[ETEl2NAL407]

I understand the need for evolution, Ed. I can see the big picture, probably clearer than most, thus I see the direction Zombies is headed in: More quests, less good old-fashioned slaying.

My point here is not to say that BO:2 sucks or that Treyach sucks. My point is that this direction Zombies is going, I dislike. The game can evolve without elaborate quests. New perks, new guns, new maps. Those will all keep the game interesting. I don't even mind the quests as long as they don't hinder the functionality of the map. When I say functionality I mean, "Getting a decent gun, getting your perks, settling in and slaying some undead." MotD has sacrificed functionality for the quest.

What we really need is a balance that appeases everyone. Sure, that's difficut to do, but anything worth doing is difficult, especially if you intend on making money from your efforts. Treyarch may not care about fans like me, they may only be interested in pleasing the fanboys that don't care about slaying and just want to finish that quest, but if the maps are all catered to questing and continue to sacrifice functionality, what is everyone going to do after they've completed the quest?

So, really, the big picture here is that Treyarch needs to find that balance so their future maps are replayable even after the quests are done. MotD is not that kind of map. At least it's not for me. I'm sorry, if it works perfectly for you, we can't all be as elite as you.

[MNM1995]

I don't do zombies wrong, I wouldn't have posted if I didn't know the map. I know it inside out, where every part is and how to collect them in a specific order to not waste time. I actually had all 3 dogs fed and Jugg on round 4. Doing the spork as well is what takes all the time.

I'm sorry but I find this very hard to believe. This means you had fed the beast at each three locations, remember that just to reach each of the three locations in the fastest way it's going to cost you 4750 points, killed around 6-8 zombies at each location to feed the beast, plus then spending 2500 points on Juggernog bringing your total cost up to 7250 points on round 4, assuming of course that you didn't buy the B23R (another 900 points, 8150 total) or the Uzi (1500 points, 8750 total) and you were able to do all that by round 4. I find that difficult to believe.

On topic however, I like the way these new maps are going. True, they may be over-complicating them slightly but they aren't going in an entirely bad direction, Treyarch just need to try and make them simpler.

[FatedTitan]

I understand the need for evolution, Ed. I can see the big picture, probably clearer than most, thus I see the direction Zombies is headed in: More quests, less good old-fashioned slaying.

I don't even mind the quests as long as they don't hinder the functionality of the map. When I say functionality I mean, "Getting a decent gun, getting your perks, settling in and slaying some undead." MotD has sacrificed functionality for the quest.

Quests are going to be a part of it, but they aren't required. Your feeling that they are a requirement is misguided and is a consequence of your own personal desire to do a quest then you feel unsatisfied with the map because you feel you've beaten. Zombies hasn't changed to the extent that you can't just go in and slay. That's almost all I've done on MotD and I'm having a great time with it. It's your own personal choice how you play a map. If you want more "good old-fashioned slaying," then do it. No one is stopping you. Go have fun on the map how you want to.

Tell me how the side quest on MotD hindered functionality? If you're going to say Afterlife Mode, then I just don't know what to tell you. The only weapon achieved with Afterlife mode is a box in the Warden's Office and the Golden Spork. Unlocking the Warden's office is extremely easy and the Golden Spork, with the power it has, should be difficult to obtain. Powering perks is just another aspect of the map. It gives a new thing to do to turn on perks, and they aren't hard at all to turn on since an Afterlife switch is next to every one. And, especially in Solo play, Afterlife mode is better than Quick Revive because you get more opportunities to get up.

The maps aren't changing. Let's complain about Shi No Numa because its perks are randomized and I can't be assured of receiving Jug at the same spot every time.

[xiRoNiCzZ]

I could actually live with all these changes. (I do not like them either but I don't hate them as much as you do.)

But the fact that this "new" zombie engine has basically destroyed my desire to play BO2 makes me sad.

Why does the game have FPS issues when I kill a group of zombies or when I just shoot some rounds into them.

Not to mention how much worse that gets when playing split screen.

i can libe these changes to i jst worry were zombies is gonna end up :/ its getin less about the killing and more bout stratergy den skill

i remember playin black ops 1 every night jst trying to beat high scores with my mates, but now we dont do that on black ops 2 hardly :/

think black ops 2 is more about finding new things and stratergys and stuff like that, instead of jst trying to beat your last high round :/

also takes about 10-20 rounds maybe longer to get everyfing u want set up :/

also is u go dwn dwn and ders no 1 der to revive u, cus there that far away they got no chance of geting to u, den ur basicaly screwed :/ on black ops 1 it cud be tricky to revive sum 1 but not impossible, maps like die rise/tranzit if your other side of the map n ur friend goes dwn his screwed :/ and if your on a high round and this happens it can be qwite hard to get bk set up once uve lost everyfing :/

i remember on black ops 1 if this happend u cud jst run get jug den quikly hit the box once, but with lifts/bus's and all that this stuff can get annoying

but saying all that i actualy do like die rise lol its a sik map and presents a new challenege, but i see were people coming from about zombies changing :/ i jst hope it doesent change to much and they go bk to der routes a bit

like i said previousoly they jst need to find a nice balance between the 2, and something for all diffrent zombie fans to enjoy :)

[xiRoNiCzZ]

The maps aren't changing. Let's complain about Shi No Numa because its perks are randomized and I can't be assured of receiving Jug at the same spot every time.

so is nuketown but thats a ok survival map i spose, best survival map on black ops 1 so far, but kinda small lol im not complaining doe xD ad sum gd games on that map

[Electric Jesus]

This thread is blasphemous. Zombies has only continued to improve, these new maps are amazing, MoTD in particular which could possibly be the greatest map in creation. 

Simple maps with not much to do or places to go are boring. Der Reise was cool but now all anybody does is camp out in the building with the teleporter and the BAR, kino you just ran around in circles, these new maps keep you moving, its always exciting and tonnes more challenging with much more to do.  

just play survival or grief if you want that small map feel.

Absolutely correct.

(before I start bear in mind I've never played MotD)

While I do think maps like Der Riese and Kino are amazing, (probably the best) I think the new maps are improving from what we started with. In ways they are better, but very different.  

We still do have to buy doors and all that stuff to get our perks. We still need to find the box and buy from walls to get 99% of our weapons. We still have lots of little secrets to uncover. We have the same basic gameplay mechanics and objectives: SURVIVE. 

You say adding stuff unnecessarily like having to use buildables to get more powerful weapons is horrible. But you can still get the Bowie knife in both tranzit and Die Rise without them. The galva knuckles are better than the knife, so in effect you put forth more effort to get a more powerful weapon. Seems fair to me. you're no longer being served the means to survive indefinitely on a silver platter. You have to FIGHT to survive.

As for building more powerful weapons, like I said, it really isn't as much fun when the best weapons are available to you with little to no effort involved. (sure, you need points to use the box, but you need BRAINS and PATIENCE to build your means of survival, not have it gift-wrapped for you.) 

You also say that the side quests make it more like a campaign, which is bad. Simple solution: don't do them. Like I said there are still plenty of classic Easter eggs like notes and radios, but with an additional structures series of Easter eggs. If you choose not to do them, you're left  with the Classic scavenger hunt feel. 

now actual gameplay-wise, these things all give you more (optional) features to break the monotony of running in a circle for 5 hours. Make no mistake; I enjoy playing zombies and running trains. But I LOVE actually SURVIVING. :twisted: I can understand how someone like Chopper could get bored of being amazing and tearing through rounds, but for average players it just mixes stuff up a bit.

If you look for it, the classic zombies feel exists in BOII almost completely intact. A few additions to make it more challenging IMO adds to the fun! You can choose to forsaken buildables and Easter eggs if you wish. Apart from elevators, the bus, and purgatory, you can just go ahead and play some good ol' zombies if you want. There are a few differences that (like I've said) just mix up the same old formula a little, as well as add some challenge and variety to your monotonous strategies.

No offense meant whatsoever, but people who get all butthurt and despondent about the fact that Zombies isn't EXACTLY what it used to be really tick me off. You all need to accept that change is normal, and GOOD!

Don't you remember our good friend JFK? Those who look only to the past or the present are certain to miss the future! If you spend all your time focusing on how zombies isn't exactly what it used to be, you'll never be able to embrace what it is now, or what it will be! 

Damnit. I always break off on rants. Blegh. I'm done.

Also this thread isn't "blasphemous." it's not a sin to have an opinion. I just disagree with the opinion PRETTY DARN STRONGLY.

[ETEl2NAL407]

Trying to get my point across to a bunch of zombie fanboys is like trying to get a herd of cows to fly...

I see why so many people left these forums.

As soon as you criticize Zombies in the slightest bit you're labeled blasphemous, butt-hurt, stupid, etc..

Thanks for your opinions, I didn't get as much discussion out of this thread as I'd hoped, but at least I learned a lot.

[GRILL]

*I am trying to continue discussion, but I feel the need to address this whole "fanboy" term being thrown around. I respect Eternal's opinion, and I am simply responding*

lol at the "fanboys" comment.

dude, this is like the most fanboy forum for zombies. you've donated to it. how can you go and call other people fanboys, like you aren't one yourself, and like everyone here isn't a fanboy to some extent?

also, that link you posted, with the definition of fanboys? yeah, you probably should have read through the whole thing:

Fanboys are often experts on minor details regarding their hobbies, such as continuity in fictional universes, and they take these details extremely seriously. ...The term itself is often used in a derogatory manner by less serious fans of the same material.

see that last part that I bolded? guess who that seemingly is in this situation?

Opinions are all fun and game, but surely you must have considered that posting a thread like this on a fanboy forum (by nature) was going to garner some negative responses. The word "fanboy" that you first used to generally describe the community is pretty much the only reason I'm posting this, as I disagree with your slanderous use of the word - and find it somewhat hypocritical (as I pointed out above).

You want Kino 2.0? You want Der Reise 2? Not going to happen - know why? BECAUSE THOSE MAPS ARE MASTERPIECES. No self-respecting artist would want to churn out a bunch of copies of their most famous work, they use their newfound power or abilities to push the envelope, think outside the box, and strive to create a fresh EXPERIENCE.

MotD is by far the best map to come out for BO2. Yes it's huge, yes it has multiple steps, yes it has a boss zombie - but look "big maps" "insane easter eggs" and "moar boss rounds" is what the majority of the community has been asking for for a long time. People wanted a cosmic silverback on ascension. People wanted a giant monster to break through the roof in Kino. Well, now they are attempting to integrate things that are more challenging but at the same time rewarding in the context of it's challenging nature.

The only point that I really agree with you on is regarding making the EE necessary for slaughtering. I think it's a bit over the top to make players save a zombie and collect plane parts just to PaP, all the while not being able to keep a crawler anymore.

I'm l GRILL l, and I'm a zombies fanboy - but that doesn't mean I'll follow 3arc everywhere. I personally quite disliked TranZit (and still do for that matter), Die Rise was great because you could actually see what you were doing... but that's only because we came off of TranZit. MotD saved BO2 zombies for me, and I'm proud to admit that I enjoy the challenging nature of the map - but not stubborn enough to admit that it was a bitch to learn.

Sorry for the rant, but like I said - it was the "fanboys" comment that really set me off. If you ever want to play, Eternal, hit me up. I'd love to show you how to love this map.

EDIT: also I just want to say that CHOPPER indeed knows what he is talking about. He's one of the members of this site who are profound in their strategic gameplay abilities, and I will hear nothing ill said regarding his findings. :mrgreen:

[ETEl2NAL407]

*I am trying to continue discussion, but I feel the need to address this whole "fanboy" term being thrown around. I respect Eternal's opinion, and I am simply responding*

lol at the "fanboys" comment.

dude, this is like the most fanboy forum for zombies. you've donated to it. how can you go and call other people fanboys, like you aren't one yourself, and like everyone here isn't a fanboy to some extent?

also, that link you posted, with the definition of fanboys? yeah, you probably should have read through the whole thing:

Fanboys are often experts on minor details regarding their hobbies, such as continuity in fictional universes, and they take these details extremely seriously. ...The term itself is often used in a derogatory manner by less serious fans of the same material.

see that last part that I bolded? guess who that seemingly is in this situation?

Opinions are all fun and game, but surely you must have considered that posting a thread like this on a fanboy forum (by nature) was going to garner some negative responses. The word "fanboy" that you first used to generally describe the community is pretty much the only reason I'm posting this, as I disagree with your slanderous use of the word - and find it somewhat hypocritical (as I pointed out above).

You want Kino 2.0? You want Der Reise 2? Not going to happen - know why? BECAUSE THOSE MAPS ARE MASTERPIECES. No self-respecting artist would want to churn out a bunch of copies of their most famous work, they use their newfound power or abilities to push the envelope, think outside the box, and strive to create a fresh EXPERIENCE.

MotD is by far the best map to come out for BO2. Yes it's huge, yes it has multiple steps, yes it has a boss zombie - but look "big maps" "insane easter eggs" and "moar boss rounds" is what the majority of the community has been asking for for a long time. People wanted a cosmic silverback on ascension. People wanted a giant monster to break through the roof in Kino. Well, now they are attempting to integrate things that are more challenging but at the same time rewarding in the context of it's challenging nature.

The only point that I really agree with you on is regarding making the EE necessary for slaughtering. I think it's a bit over the top to make players save a zombie and collect plane parts just to PaP, all the while not being able to keep a crawler anymore.

I'm l GRILL l, and I'm a zombies fanboy - but that doesn't mean I'll follow 3arc everywhere. I personally quite disliked TranZit (and still do for that matter), Die Rise was great because you could actually see what you were doing... but that's only because we came off of TranZit. MotD saved BO2 zombies for me, and I'm proud to admit that I enjoy the challenging nature of the map - but not stubborn enough to admit that it was a bitch to learn.

Sorry for the rant, but like I said - it was the "fanboys" comment that really set me off. If you ever want to play, Eternal, hit me up. I'd love to show you how to love this map.

Not sure how you did that, but this, friendos, is how you disagree and keep it tactful. Even though you semi bashed me for the fanboy comment, | Grill |, you actually made me chuckle a little bit and you know...I will take you up on the offer.

[FatedTitan]

Trying to get my point across to a bunch of zombie fanboys is like trying to get a herd of cows to fly...

I see why so many people left these forums.

As soon as you criticize Zombies in the slightest bit you're labeled blasphemous, butt-hurt, stupid, etc..

Thanks for your opinions, I didn't get as much discussion out of this thread as I'd hoped, but at least I learned a lot.

We aren't calling you blasphemous or stupid or butt hurt. We enjoy the maps. You don't. Outside of one guy, we've all given our reasons for why you can get that same feeling you had on previous maps in the maps they have released on Black Ops 2. You are the one who is labeling us all as fanboys, which is hardly the case. If you even somewhat knew me you'd know I'm anything but. I've criticized a lot of what they've done in Black Ops 2. All I'm saying is that the issues you are pointing out as problems have very simple solutions. Just don't do the things that you don't like and do the things you do.

You're problem ETER12NAL isn't that discussion didn't come out of this, but that it's not the discussion you wanted. You claim that we're just fanboys hyping up a bad product, but at the end of the day you're the one looking for fanboys to hype up your opinions. You didn't want discussion. You wanted people who agreed with your opinions so you could continue bashing the game.

And never bring up why people leave the forums. People leave the forums for many reasons, but getting attacked for an opinion on zombies isn't one of them. I rarely see people attack others for their opinions on zombies, whether positive or negative. You're the one attacking people who don't agree with you, leading us to respond with our own "attacks" if they can even be called that.

But no, you're right. I'm just a cow you're trying to make fly. You'll never convince me because I'll never take my Treyarch shades off. Apparently I'm a fanboy who can't help but get off to the idea of Treyarch making a new zombies map that everyone thinks is awful just so I can defend it and let them know they like me. Yea...that's who I am alright. :roll:

[Electric Jesus]

Well, now they are attempting to integrate things that a more challenging but at the same time rewarding in the context of it's challenging nature.

THIS!

This is pretty much exactly what I was saying I'm my last post. Thanks!

I respect the fact that people want maps like Der Riese and Kino, as I agree that they are possibly the best maps. But people complaining that every map isn't exactly like them is just so counter-productive. I do regret that I went as far as to use the word "butthurt," so for that i apologize. However my opinion still stands.

And yes, I post ten freaking novel-length posts per day on an Internet forum devoted to a game mode on a video game. I'm a fanboy. So where's the harm in that? :D

[Chopper]

I'm sorry but I find this very hard to believe. This means you had fed the beast at each three locations, remember that just to reach each of the three locations in the fastest way it's going to cost you 4750 points, killed around 6-8 zombies at each location to feed the beast, plus then spending 2500 points on Juggernog bringing your total cost up to 7250 points on round 4, assuming of course that you didn't buy the B23R (another 900 points, 8150 total) or the Uzi (1500 points, 8750 total) and you were able to do all that by round 4. I find that difficult to believe.

Proof is in the pudding and all that.

nZjBBc4B3CM

I want to make a response later to this thread, but I don't have time to do it justice now. This can be a discussion, rather than an argument.

[GRILL]

nZjBBc4B3CM

awesome video, chopper, i love learning!

[xiRoNiCzZ]

i aint got motd yet as im on ps3, but the vidz i been watchin on utube lukin crazy man! was excited bout this map soon as i saw it

die rise.. tbh i dident think i wud like this map but ended up loving it lol

im still playing about with new stratergys now,

thats 1 of the gd fings to come outta all these new crazys maps keeps it diffrent

on black ops 1, once u learned the map, u wud usualy stik to 1 stratergy and 1 place wich can get kinda boring after a while

so i agree change is gd, i jst hope they dnt change it to much :D

[Edward Richtofen]

Trying to get my point across to a bunch of zombie fanboys is like trying to get a herd of cows to fly...

That's because your point doesn't really make sense. The perks aren't hard to get, the quests do not need to be completed, and the new features do not hinder traditional slaying.

But what do I know I'm just a zombies fanboy. Oh wait I forgot you were kind enough to provide us with an definition:

I use the term loosely. To me, it means someone that has jumped onto a bandwagon and becomes loyal immediately. I've been a fan of Zombies since BO:1, but I don't think Zombies was half as popular then as it is now and that's because of the fanboys. Based on that definition we could say the fanboy line is drawn between the questers (the fanboys) and the slayers (the OG fans). Whereas I want a zombie game with less questing and more slaying, a fanboy would tell me my thread is blasphemous because I don't like the quests. I don't dislike the quests, I just think they're overtaking and hurting the slaying.

You a blops 1 fanboy, I've been slaying zombies since WaW beotch. :lol:

[itsallagame]

:0 I can see where it can get frustrating at times but when you get a good run on these maps its amazing. I think these new.eggs are great. Theyre easy and reward you immediately and on top of that it seems like they're testing the waters for a zombies only game. I love afterlife and seriously hope I don't see quick revive for a while lol or even better, make afterlife ability attainable through an egg! That would be the best perk slot ever

[minator177]

BO:1 was Kino Der Toten, one zombie mode: survival. Here we had doors to open, perks to acquire, the mystery box to gamble with, a teleporter to access PaP with, and some secrets scattered throughout like the meteors and the song, the movie reels, etc..

BO:2 was Green Run, game modes: TranZit, survival, and Grief. Survival mode gives us easy access to our toys, but doesn't give us the secrets and chops our map into little pieces, TranZit allows us to get the secrets and our toys and keeps our map full, Grief is just Grief.

Why am I comparing? To illustrate the main difference: this game mode design. We see the trend continue in BO:2 with the game modes. The secrets are now turning into campaign quests and, though this makes the game a bit more interesting, it's not needed. Look at the success of BO:1's DLC. Treyarch didn't need to single out the secrets into a game mode, just leave it be and let the players decide if they do or don't want to go after the secret. Instead, we're almost being forced to choose...Choose the game mode and go for the secrets/campaign quests or don't. Really, if we compare the survival maps of BO:2 against the survival maps of BO:1, BO:1 wins easily.

This is not at all the zombies I have come to love and enjoy. This direction vexes me.

The problem is, BO1 maps were not survival, they were the story maps. Survival is actually the new mode, as it's just for a quick game, with no easter eggs or anything to do with the actual story. If BO1 maps were just survival, then we would have had generic characters (like CIA and CDC), and no easter eggs.

BO2 wasn't what brought zombies in a NEW direction. It kept it going in the SAME direction, just adding new things to make it more interesting and fun.

[BladeFire]

Agreed. Fucking hate how its almost impossible to pack-a-punch on MotD.

[TheBSZombie]

I don't do zombies wrong, I wouldn't have posted if I didn't know the map. I know it inside out, where every part is and how to collect them in a specific order to not waste time. I actually had all 3 dogs fed and Jugg on round 4. Doing the spork as well is what takes all the time.

I'm sorry but I find this very hard to believe. This means you had fed the beast at each three locations, remember that just to reach each of the three locations in the fastest way it's going to cost you 4750 points, killed around 6-8 zombies at each location to feed the beast, plus then spending 2500 points on Juggernog bringing your total cost up to 7250 points on round 4, assuming of course that you didn't buy the B23R (another 900 points, 8150 total) or the Uzi (1500 points, 8750 total) and you were able to do all that by round 4. I find that difficult to believe.

On topic however, I like the way these new maps are going. True, they may be over-complicating them slightly but they aren't going in an entirely bad direction, Treyarch just need to try and make them simpler.

Chopper knew what to do. its pretty easy. il give you a full tutorial here if you want to see how chopper did it. http://www.callofdutyzombies.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=149&t=31240

Thank you Fated and Grill.

And I can't wait to hear your side to chopper. im pretty sure its going to a great addition to this argument :D

[MysteryBox]

Same here. I was a HUGE zombie fan, then came Tranzit..... I cannot stand to play it. Even thought the love for zombies is still in me, it was hard to show after they made the map whose name I shall not speak of. Then came Die Rise, meh, better, not as good though. Finally, Mob of of the Dead, the best one of Black Ops 2 yet, I can play it and enjoy it, thats a plus. I sincerely hope that the next maps are amazing, maybe restore my love for zombies altogether.

[bobane]

Go ahead slay, I'll get myself a free blundergat in the meanwhile.

This is something I enjoy but I dislike the quests in general because you need to be 4 almost all the time and the others need to be good and know what to do and you need mics too. Well I play zombies with friends who don't have mics and don't care about quests at all and when I play with randoms it takes me half an hour to find a lobby with 4 mics and there is ALWAYS and I mean ALWAYS at least 1 person leaving because, booo you got downed while trying to get all the kills alone in a corner.