Zombies its own disk?

[RiftRunner001]

Hey all, its your friendly neighborhood Rift Runner, with a question I assume that some of you may have had: What if zombies became its own CD?

The reason I believe that this should happen is because a good number of people in my local community will purchase Treyarch's games for zombies alone, which is a positive and a negative. Positive, because that means Activision and Treyarch are getting more money for a single aspect of the game. Negative, because that means that there are wasted parts of the CD that hardly become used, and the people have to pay more for that one aspect.

Another reason I believe this is a grand idea, is because how quickly it exploded. When zombies first came out on WaW, do you think that they truly believed that it would explode at such a fast rate? To a rate, in fact, that made them expand to need its own group of developers? A way to help them, both with story and in map development, would be to expand this group, making zombies their full purpose for a game.

I read somewhere that someone would not purchase Treyarch Zombies itself for a full 60 dollars. These same people said that they would only pay 20, and I do believe that is not enough money for this. 30 seems reasonable, and it shall be explained later.

Another negative I had read about had said that it would burn out the producers of the zombies, creating quickly thought of things like "Hopper" (beer reference), which would a perk that would make you jump higher, but make you sway left or right as you go upwards. Basically stating that there will be ideas that will be rushed and not thought through before releasing. There is a fix for this as well.

As i chatted with my amigos about this, they said that a good portion of a "story" would have to be developed, and scattered through out several maps. 10 became the number we settled on, even though that seems a bit high. But, that also gives the creators a good amount to work with in order to create a deeper story, possibly more characters, etc.

The reason we settled on 30 dollars for a "self serve" zombies game, is because there are more possibilities with this. First of all, release time would be set 6 months apart from the multiplayer game. "BO1, then the zombies maps, BO2, zombies, etc" This would roughly give the much enlarged team of zombie creators ample time to create new perks, set a time frame, story line, and more. There is always the possibilities for DLCs, which could have a flash back moment from a set in the story, or an "alternative" to where the story takes place.

Also, the return of Dead Ops will happen. Giving you not only your FPS zombies, but your overhead TPS as well. Plus, there are many people on forum community that do miss zombies.

What do you all think? Should this happen? Does this seem like a likely idea to come in our lifetime? And what other "New" ideas do you think should happen? Basic Loadouts maybe? (Primary, secondary, and maybe a grenade?) Maybe a slot machine gun release, which would be much like the Mystery Box, but would have less useful weapons, could stay in place, and cost less?

What are your thoughts?

[Shooter]

Honestly, it's hard to say what the future of Zombies is at this point. Either it will grow, thrive, and become bigger and better than before. Or it will continue as is and be phased out over time for something new. I think it all depends on how successful Activision and Treyarch view Zombies at the end of BO2, as well their capabilities with the next gen systems.

Of course us Zombies fanatics will be begging for it to grow, but the questions is are they still bringing in new fans to the Zombies side of things? While the Zombies feature in the Black Ops series is popular, it fails in comparison to the popularity of the Multiplayer feature. Activision execs are going to ask themselves "Is Zombies still profitable in this series? Or is there something new that will satisfy our customers and potentially bring in more profit?"

If they do continue do grow Zombies as they move to the next gen platforms, I can see it as a total possibility that a separate zombies disk would be available over time. But if they do bring zombies to the next gen platforms without upgrading it all around, I fear it may be the last game we see with the Zombies feature. The future is black, that's for sure.

What they need to do is make an optional zombies disk that you can buy separately with the next Black Ops release. But this, like you stated, would require a lot more manpower. Which brings us right back to "Does Activision see it as profitable?"

[RiftRunner001]

In the eyes of the community, I feel like it would be. As I said, there are people that will buy Treyarch's games soley for the zombies. If they put forth a little more time with a larger group of people to design maps and weapons and story lines and what have you (sorry for the run on, used for a point), then keep or even update the quality for zombies, it would be very much worth it to them. I say this because zombies is... about 1/3 of the games worth of the 60. So I figure the campaign, multiplayer, and maybe something in a survival mode on the real disk for 40-50, then the zombies disk would be 30. That alone is a profit of 10-20 dollars. multiply that by how many people bought black ops 2, and you get anywhere between 110,000,000 and 220,000,000 dollars. (using a researched number on first week sales of BO2)

[Shooter]

I don't think anyone here can say the overall cost of the business expenses that Activision goes through when creating a game.

Production costs, hiring a development team, designers, concept artists, writers, producers (big name movie producers BTW), voice actors (celebrity voice actors BTW), music composers (famous music composer BTW), overhead costs, marketing costs. All these things go into the making of a game, and they're costs are astronomical nowadays. It's the reason it costs you $60 to buy a game these days.

Unless you know the total costs of all these expenses, it's impossible to say how profitable a separate zombies disk would actually be. And again, it's not "will it make us money?", it's "will it make us ALOT of money?". It's not about profit, it's about NET PROFIT. If the extra zombies disk flops and doesn't sell well, Activision will take a major hit. It's all a matter of Risk vs. Reward.

That's just business unfortunately.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

Exactly, if you look in my sig., you can see a version of what I think the zombies campagin would be like... I warn you though... It is a LONG read....

[RiftRunner001]

Exactly, if you look in my sig., you can see a version of what I think the zombies campaign would be like... I warn you though... It is a LONG read....

I shall definitely read it sometime.

I was talking about gross income increase. No I do not know the expenses of zombies, but you can do research on the average cost of creating a game dating back to early 1990's compared to now, and how they increase. There will be corners cut, such as hiring "unknown" voice actors, "new" artists with the vision of a zombies game, etc. Of course development will be increased, and the jobs of the artists are not much different when you look at it. DLCs are only an option, if you can release over 6 maps at a time, you are then eliminating some of the necessity for DLCs, and you are shrinking down the stretched amount of time needed to create. There are ways around it, you just have to be willing to try something new.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

Hmm...

I don't know why people even buy black ops two for the multiplayer... The camp. Is AMAZING and the Zombies is AMAZING but then the multiplayer I've been told Is not liked...

That's why I buy trayarch games not infinity ward...

IFW:

Camp.: Ok... Mw and MW2 were good, MW3 SUCKED... A-

Multiplayer: Suppsedly fantastic. A+

Side mode: Horrible, from what I've heard C

Trayarch:

Camp: Usually pleasing, can't say anything bad... A

Multiplayer: Not as good as IFW, but still OK. A-

Side mode: Wonderfull fantastic, does-not-get-any better then zombies... A+

[RiftRunner001]

IW

Camp: Decent, but felt short in the last 2: B-

Multi: Better, but it became repetative after 3 games: C-

Side: This is a two sider, i gotta hand it to survival, i do like, but missions seem either overused or underexamined: B+, C-

3Arc

Camp: Many twists and turns, but can get side tracked: B+

Multi: Better then MW3, but is dominated by game time alone: A-

Side: Amazing, there are twists, and different ways to complete your mission: A+x3

Wording it the way you have, this is how i feel

[The Clay Bird]

In the eyes of the community, I feel like it would be. As I said, there are people that will buy Treyarch's games soley for the zombies. If they put forth a little more time with a larger group of people to design maps and weapons and story lines and what have you (sorry for the run on, used for a point), then keep or even update the quality for zombies, it would be very much worth it to them. I say this because zombies is... about 1/3 of the games worth of the 60. So I figure the campaign, multiplayer, and maybe something in a survival mode on the real disk for 40-50, then the zombies disk would be 30. That alone is a profit of 10-20 dollars. multiply that by how many people bought black ops 2, and you get anywhere between 110,000,000 and 220,000,000 dollars. (using a researched number on first week sales of BO2)

maybe in the eyes of the zombies community, but there are far more people who buy the game solely for multiplayer as well. and your figures of profit are waaaaay off. figuring fixed costs, yeah, but with releasing an extra disk, employing a lager group of people to work on maps, etc, the cost goes up and proift goes down.

What shooter was explaining is the future of zombies lies in whether or not it continues to increase profitability of the brand. Then decide if the resources spent on zombies mode are worth pursuing again or if the game overall will profit more from eliminating the mode and allocating the funds used on it elsewhere.

The biggest pet peave of mine when the community complains about "Treyarch trying to suck every last penny out of us" Of course they are! Any successful company will. Activision is a publically traded company. How do you think their shareholders would react if their company's profits are not growing? Theyll sell, and the company eventually goes under.

Community needs to quit acting like gaming companies owe us something. They don't. Yes they need to make great content to sell because nobody will buy a shitty game, but they also have to make sound financial decisions, or else the games you and I enjoy so much will cease to be

NOW to the point, yes zombies has grown in popularity. if i remember correctly, on black ops 1 zombies would normally have between 20,000 and 30,000 players online during normal use times (i.e. not right after a map pack releases) adn on black ops 2 its more around 40-50 thousand. thats a bit of increase, but not all that significant. 50 thousand users is not enough to support a standalone game and have it be a wise investment for the company. Now if they totally revamped zombeis and INCREASED its presence and included it in a 2 disc set for $70-$80 id totally buy that. Kinda like how MP and campaign on halo 3 i believe were on separate discs. I don't believe unless something crazy happens and zombies just explodes after this map pack upcoming that we will ever see a standalone zombies release

[RiftRunner001]

If it were to keep expanding at the rate it is, both in content and popularity, it will most likely be a separate disk. But, if they were to do such a thing, why do they not just add all of the maps together on one disk?

WaW: 4

BO1: 7 (including DOA)

BO2: 8-9 (including individual parts of Green Run AND the possibility of a new map on the last DLC)

So, that about 20, and they'd have to add 4-5 and a "new" version of DOA for new content, then people could be content though, yes?

[Stop Mocking Me0]

One more game's worth of zombies and they could make:

: Call of duty: zombies of course still keeping the MP mode... Maybe we could get multiplayer maps ON zombies maps! Cool!

[RiftRunner001]

When you say Multiplayer maps, do you mean like, playing TD on Assencion? or maybe darkening the currently used once. In my own opinion, playing on a destroyed Firing range would be sweet! That or Cracked, because it is already semi destroyed.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

When you say Multiplayer maps, do you mean like, playing TD on Assencion? or maybe darkening the currently used once. In my own opinion, playing on a destroyed Firing range would be sweet! That or Cracked, because it is already semi destroyed.

Zombies on old multiplayer maps or multiplayer in old zombies maps?

Why not both? :twisted:

[ThrowAmonkeyBomb]

When you say Multiplayer maps, do you mean like, playing TD on Assencion? or maybe darkening the currently used once. In my own opinion, playing on a destroyed Firing range would be sweet! That or Cracked, because it is already semi destroyed.

Zombies on old multiplayer maps or multiplayer in old zombies maps?

Why not both? :twisted:

Map prediction.NOW. :lol:

[RiftRunner001]

Because dear Watson, you think it's a massive game now, it could be hellish to make all of that. We'd need a sub-disk for the sub-disk that is unknown to happen. Of course, with the switch to the Blu-ray, They could take some of the maps that could be revamped either way to become a zombie or MP map. I think it'd be a good idea, and if I had the talent and know how to create my own game similar to CoDZ, I would. BUT since this idea is already taken to the extent that this is a basic trademark, with the box, Wall weapons, perks, etc., this game is so specific to create one like it would be plagerism and copyright infringment.

[RiftRunner001]

Apologize for the double post.

If I could choose which multiplayer maps from BO 1 that became zombies they would be:

Cracked

Firing range

Hanoi

Jungle

These are wide enough, and have enough places to put thing that would make the game interesting. Plus, i feel Nuketown Z went over pretty well, so FR would be a good sort of CQ zombies.

[Ourobos]

How about the Prestige Edition of black ops 3 contains a Zombie disc.. I'd pay extra for that.. Even though I don't even play the multiplayer since BO1.. Seems unfair to the Zombie players, but that's how much more dedicated some of us are vs. mulplayer fans.

[RiftRunner001]

See, but that means, if Prestiged purchasers get the disk, I would not. I see no point in spending an extra 20+$ for something that is unnecessary. Interesting maps and a few new guns does not make 20$. A season pass sort of deal, I'd buy. It has a link to the Treyarch game, but is almost its own entity by itself.

There's a lot up in the air about this, but with the way zombies is growing and changing, I feel like this is a real possible thing. A post mentioned that things like the Thundergun and Gersch Device would crash the new server. Why not make parallel servers? A back up server for the WaW/BO1 maps, and the main server for BO2 and beyond?

[Ourobos]

$20 is a few meals for me, I'll skip em if it means getting a new zombie disc.

[RiftRunner001]

$20 is a few meals for me, I'll skip em if it means getting a new zombie disc.

are you kidding or serious?

[yoyobobguy]

for those of you saying maybe they would release it as a $30 disc, i think this is a VERY unlikely scenario. in case you haven't bought any AAA video game titles since the 90s, they all cost $60. so as mentioned above, either its gonna be a full priced game by 3arc "COD:Zombies", a part of the next 3arc game. or nothing at all

also, it is important to note that at any given time in COD:BO2, roughly 1/4-1/3 of the players are playing zombies. if you don't think they can support their own game, i think you are wrong. especially when you could make a zombie game with the SAME fucking multiplayer as already exist, just with the zombies as the campaign mode (and general design aesthetic). i think they will kill the BO story line and start the Z. instead of an army load out (m4, body armor, rocket launchers), its more like an apocalypse load out (remington870, football pads, moltov cocktail). it would be bad ass.

i also think they should make zombies multiplayer (separate from single-player campaign mode) with a character you make. similar to loadouts, but you only get to choose starting pistol, and one "trait" that is analogous to perks (extra health, faster sprint, more damage) and character customization (think TF2 hats... for zombies)

[Rissole25]

There are other factors that haven't been spoken about.

Would there be an increased or decreased team working on Zombies? The average time it takes to make a map (3 months), would that work for a stand alone game? Would that translate well?

It's all the little things like these that can make or break a game.

[Slade]

There are other factors that haven't been spoken about.

Would there be an increased or decreased team working on Zombies? The average time it takes to make a map (3 months), would that work for a stand alone game? Would that translate well?

It's all the little things like these that can make or break a game.

They'll need a whole bigger team if they're gonna bring out a full-priced Zombies standalone game.

Another thing that hasn't been discussed is profit margin.

Why would Treyarch put 2 years of development time into a game that only a portion of the CoD community plays? Instead of making another CoD game altogether and including Zombies.

Making CoD: Zombies seems like commercial suicide to me. It'll decrease CoD's sales (probably not by a lot but still) and CoD: Zombies will never sell as well as CoD so is the risk of losing money on both ends not far too high?

[RiftRunner001]

For sure the team would have to grow. That way you can have 2-3 maps being worked on at one time, but that also involves having a planner and knowing where the story is going.

And to he who had said that it could decrease sales, I think you are wrong. I have friends here and there that will come to my place and we will play nothing but zombies, because the MP isn't fun to them.

To he that said it would have to be full priced, What would be the ranking of zombies in and of itself? I dont think it'd be AAA, because of what it has become. I dont think full price for the game would ever happen, because much of the game is now zombies.

I think 40$ for the MP/campaign, and 30$ for the zombies disk would be fair. They are still making money, and for those who think it is very necessary to have both, they now have made a 10$ profit on a game that was originally 60. In the initial sales of BO2, there were 12-20 Million sold. That is a net profit of 120-200 Million$. Some people would make it out to be unfair, and there could be a deal made where you buy both and its 60, but I dont think Activision would do it.