Interesting question

[Fallen Hero4823]

Is Eddie, from the Origins ending cutscene, Dr. Edward Richtofen?

[MysteryMachineX]

I believe that he is as much Richtofen as is the Doctor in Origins is The Butcher a.k.a. Our Zombie Overlord, as in...

 

kinda.

[FatedTitan]

Depends how much you take of Origins as canon.  Looking at the beginning and ending, kind of seems as though the entire thing is a story made up by Samantha.  Now that's only for Origins.  It's not an indicator of the rest of the maps.

[Tac]

That's a very tough question, and it depends entirely how you view Origins. I'm inclined, right now, to say yes, sort of, but we'll have to wait I think.

[Hells Warrrior]

I'm with TAC, I'm not a believer in this being a story in Samantha's head. I think a huge clue is in the name of the MAP "Origins" - as in where things originated from. I believe Eddie is not Richtofen but possibly a new addition (Richtofens son maybe?), if we look at the time lines for the ending cut scene we can presume a date in time.

Origins was set during the first world war period and I believe Samantha and Eddie, reenacted a story relayed to them of the beginning of the outbreak.

[The Clay Bird]

I'm with TAC, I'm not a believer in this being a story in Samantha's head. I think a huge clue is in the name of the MAP "Origins" - as in where things originated from. I believe Eddie is not Richtofen but possibly a new addition (Richtofens son maybe?), if we look at the time lines for the ending cut scene we can presume a date in time.

Origins was set during the first world war period and I believe Samantha and Eddie, reenacted a story relayed to them of the beginning of the outbreak.

 

 

I know less about the story line than a lot of you guys, but one of the really strange things to me is the fact that we know by the cutscenes that this is 1918, yet Samantha still knows the name of Dempsey, Nikolai, Takeo, and Edward. All of which were presumably somewhere in their 40s - 50s in WaW timeline (1943-1945 ish)    I suppose it's possible, but what I feel is more likely is something akin to Mob of the Dead, where it is kind of its own story, and not totally canon, yet has some pieces and clues that further heighten our understanding of the overall story line.

 

I'm certainly not counting out the alternative, so it will be pretty interesting to see where the next game takes it

 

If it does end up being kind of a stand alone story, I love the possibilities, because eventually there will only be so much they can add to the original story line, that the ability to make really good stand alone story maps is a real strength for the franchise

[MysteryMachineX]

I'm not going to argue with you guys except I wanted to mention one thing: Richtofen doesn't have a son. He is a complete homosexual with a disgust towards women.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

To me, origins is not cannon, but rather a separate "possibility" world. Everything that happened there never happened in the cannon storyline. 

[BrayJayTheZombSlaya]

I'm not going to argue with you guys except I wanted to mention one thing: Richtofen doesn't have a son. He is a complete homosexual with a disgust towards women.

 

I've heard him say some things in BO1 that suggest this, but is there one specific quote that confirms it? I always thought he was joking. 

[MysteryMachineX]

One specific? No. There's a whole bunch that allude to it.

 

"Ah, [the Spectre.] I like it because it has a looong barrel, like my college roommate."

[Cadbane13]

Teddy could be the bus driver from tranzit.

[Cheesegrater28]

As others stated, there is no way to know for sure yet. But if I had to guess, I would say its is supposed to be Richtofen. Main reason is because of one of the hidden messages on the map from Maxis.

 

"From his very first day studying at Heidelberg, edward displayed an intellect and maturity well beyond his years. However, the impact of his parents' death has affected him deeply. Though I have tried to provide him with some sort of father figure, I fear his choices may be increasingly influenced by his new found friends within group nine three five. "

 

The cutscene shows Sam and young Eddie either living together or having a sleep over, and they both do what Maxis says, with Eddie saying "your dad". So it seems to point to a situation where Maxis isn't his dad, but a father figure. But we also know Sam and Richtofen weren't the same age and neither one was American. The whole American part is still what messes me up and makes me think its just all been two kids playing, cause I haven't seen or come up with a good explanation for the sudden change in Sam's voice. 

 

I still view Origins as most likely Maxis' nightmare the others are trapped in, like how the MotD crew are stuck in their own. Origins has "Giant" robots with iron crosses, named after Germanic gods, crushing everything. Der Riese was a project called "The Giant", by scientists working for the Germans. And just how Maxis real world experiments got everyone killed including himself, the Origins dig outbreak kills all his men and leads to Richtofen killing him again. And once again his daughter is trapped somewhere and needs help. And Maxis is clearly old enough to have fought or at least helped the Germans in WW1. So the map really seems like it would be his version of hell, and the old 4 are unknowingly trapped there as was the MotD crew. At the same time, the cutscene seems like his version of heaven. He is home and taking care of Sam and Richtofen, the son he never had. 

[Hells Warrrior]

I'm not going to argue with you guys except I wanted to mention one thing: Richtofen doesn't have a son. He is a complete homosexual with a disgust towards women.

 

Why would that stop him from having a son?

[DeathBringerZen]

Why would that stop him from having a son?

 

I think it video game land, when you see a character being portrayed as a homosexual, then you should rule out real life scenarios of gay men actually still baring children. There is more than enough quotes in-game that confirm 100% that Richtofen was definitely a homosexual male.

 

There is 0% chance that Eddie in the cutscene is Richtofen's son. It's just a complete non-starter. He would have definitely have mentioned him at least once during all of his quotes across some 10+ maps.

[Boom115]

There is 0% chance that Eddie in the cutscene is Richtofen's son. It's just a complete non-starter. He would have definitely have mentioned him at least once during all of his quotes across some 10+ maps.

Artificial insemination has been around since the late 1800's. It's more than possible that he wanted his legacy to be carried on (prior to losing his mind and becoming immortal of course). I don't think this is the case, but I will not completely rule out anything until the next game.

[MysteryMachineX]

I wouldn't say zero percent. Yes, Richtofen would've mentioned him. Yes, we would've heard from him. Richtofen is/was gay. Therefore he could not procreate under normal circumstances. Could he have done science or adoption or anything else in the realm of probability to get a son? Yes. However, it is so incredibly unlikely, what we called negligible.

 

0%? No. 1%? Maybe.

 

And I don't want to argue on this matter too much, as it is a bit of a mystery, but in my interpretation of the story of Origins, Eddie's role falls into place like this:

 

Tank II, Nikolai II, Takeo II, and Edward II are the characters that are copies that we play as in Black Ops. They weren't just brainwashed to forget their pasts. They made up new pasts.

 

Tank I, Nikolai I, Takeo I, and Edward I are the original versions of the characters that we play as in Origins. (They have different facial structures, attitudes, birth dates, ages, beliefs, etc.) These characters help Samantha gain the power of an "Archangel" to ascend from Agartha. She promised she would go home and she does, cue the ending cutscene.

 

In the new timeline that Samantha wrote for herself, she gives herself a new reality, a new world, where she can live happily with her dad. In that reality she has a friend based on her (former) friend from the previous timeline, Edward III, or "Eddie".

[DeathBringerZen]

@Boom - If they actually went with artificial insemination of Eddies character in the next game, I would officially give up on that games storyline straight away and just go back to playing the game to kill zombies and nothing more.

 

I would like to think that it would guaranteed be NOT the case, but the way Black Ops 2's storyline turned out, I am not ruling out anything, but I am willing to bet that there is little (1%), to no chance (0%) of Eddie being the gay protagonist Edward Richtofen's son, biological or not.

 

It seems pretty obvious he is actually Richtofen, or the inspiration for his character.

[MysteryMachineX]

Richtofen? Protagonist? If anything Richtofen is one of the main antagonists of the game. Sure he may have had a stint as a protagonist, but for the majority of the game...

[Hells Warrrior]

I'm not saying that he is, just that it's a possibility and it's something new that they may introduced and "may" continue the story with "the children of Richtofen & Maxis" - it's a very long shot but still a possibility.

[DeathBringerZen]

@MMX - I would consider Richtofen to be the protagonist, yes. He was percieved as an evil genius trying to gain ultimate power, but he wanted a world to rule over. Maxis however could easily be seen as the antagonist. He destoyed the world for his own gain without care. He is the villian in my eyes.

 

I have always felt that Maxis was the greater of two evils in this tale. Maybe he was not the bad guy originally throught the story we were fed in the radio messages, but he turned out to be the greater of two evils in the end. Richtofen was definitely out protagonist throughout the early part of the games storyline.

[MysteryMachineX]

I don't understand how anything you just said proved opposite of an antagonist. Richtofen and Maxis are the antagonists of the game. Sure sure they are their reasons and motives, but all that changes is what kind of antagonist they are. Richtofen was softened evil. Maxis was corrupted good. Gray areas. But still, the term antagonist must be used on either both or neither.

[DeathBringerZen]

I don't understand how anything you just said proved opposite of an antagonist. Richtofen and Maxis are the antagonists of the game. Sure sure they are their reasons and motives, but all that changes is what kind of antagonist they are. Richtofen was softened evil. Maxis was corrupted good. Gray areas. But still, the term antagonist must be used on either both or neither.

 

protagonist

prəˈtag(ə)nɪst/

noun

noun: protagonist; plural noun: protagonists

 

1.

the leading character or one of the major characters in a play, film, novel, etc.

 

I think Richtofen is covered under this description. He was thee leading man throughout Black Ops 1, as was proved at the end of BO1 and when BO2 came in to play and Dempsey, Takeo & Nikolai where all but abandoned.

 

He was also a major part of the BO2 storyline, though I agree he became more of an antagonist in that game. Still... 2 games out of 3 sways him over to being an protagonist as opposed to an antagonist, does it not?

[MysteryMachineX]

Leading three guys to kill thousands of zombies versus torturing huge masses of living humans with his zombies. Not to mention his experiments. Antagonist is far more prominent.

 

And he was an antagonist in Black Ops even WHILE we played as him, so that is 1 out of 3, not 2 out of 3.

[Rissole25]

 

Why can't Richtofen be a protagonist and antagonist?

Anyway, me personally I wouldn't say Eddie is Richtofen, but based off him/connected. Or it's like Cheesegrater28 noted, it's Edward while he was in Maxis care.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

Richtofen? Protagonist? If anything Richtofen is one of the main antagonists of the game. Sure he may have had a stint as a protagonist, but for the majority of the game...

… He's been betrayed by his friend, who stole his idea. From there he's kicked the girl who wants him dead out of the MPD, and tried to prevent maxis from doing whatever world-ending-catastrophe he was going through with… I'd say he's the antihero.