Pack a Punch needs an upgrade (New PaP function ideas)

[Electric Jesus]

When the pack a punch machine was first introduced it was such a revolutionary concept, and even the way it was stylized made it appealing. Put your gun in a machine and it gets laser-y bullets and sick engravings! It was a pretty basic Idea, (make guns stronger) but the way they did it was clever. In black ops it appeared on every map, and now did a few new nifty things to a handful of weapons. Incendiary rounds, Underbarrel attachments, goofy reticles, turning a single weapon dual-wield, you name it. This was the PaP machine's intro into being a feature that is expected to return on every map.

In Black ops 2, people had already started taking the PaP machine for granted. They just kinda expected it to be there at that point. It didn't really do anything very different to the black ops one. Sure you can get new attachments for a handful of weapons by double-PaPing, but how useful is an ACOG scope honestly? Sure it got some use, like getting iron sights on an upgraded ballista, but it kind of left the community saying "that's it?"

Additionally, I'm of the opinion that there shouldn't be any useless weapons. You should never get a gun from the box and have no reason to keep it. I touched on that in another thread, and I'll quote it in a sec. I think there are a few ways that PaP could be changed that would give us incentives to keep even and RPG or a DSR for example.

One thing that always bothers me is that basically every gun is used the same way. Everybody who has ever goofed off in high rounds has continuously hit the box, taken whatever gun you got, emptied it into a horde, rinsed and repeated. FAL? Five Seven? M1216? all very different weapons with very different stats, yet they always devolve to the point where we just spray into a train with them. If you've ever read my wonder weapon Ideas, you'll know that I go out of my way to avoid this. If I make a sniper wonder weapon, you can bet it will be more effective at long range. (just a random example.) I think that needs to be a thing.

Anyway on to my actual Ideas of how we should change PaP mechanics. 2 of them I have posted elsewhere, and I might just quote those old posts if I can find them.

[spoiler=1. Advanced Warfare style weapon uniqueness.]

For those who don't know, most of the weapons in AW have a special feature, like "first 3 bullets in a burst fire faster," or "first 5 bullets in a clip deal more damage," or "accuracy increases with sustained fire." these kinds of things have been seen before AW, but I think that pretty much every upgraded gun in zombies should get something like this. It makes each weapon have more of a specialized use. If you can describe the difference between a weapon's upgraded and un-upgraded forms just by saying "more damage, more ammo, and a cute reticle" then that upgraded weapon is a serious waste of potential.

[spoiler=2. Advanced Warfare style weapon variations. ]

Again if you don't know, you can unlock weapon variations in AW. For example you can have an assault rifle, or you can unlock the marksman version of the same thing, which will have built in ACOG and extra range and accuracy but a lower fire rate. Think of the difference between an AUG and an AUG-HBAR. This could work for Double-PaPing. Instead of cycling through attachments, cycle through a few preset combinations of attachments and modifications. An original example could be if you pack a punch a DSR. If you then pack a punch the Dead Specimen Reactor 5000, you could get the "Scout Dead Specimen Reactor 5000" which has iron sights, faster ADS, and higher mobility. basically a lightweight, mobile variation. Or alternately you could get the "Heavy D.S.R. 50" with ACOG, slower ADS, FMJ, and increased damage compared to the normal upgraded version. The opposite end of the spectrum. Another random idea: upgrade the MP40 and get the afterburner. Upgrade the Afterburner and you could get the CQB Afterburner, which has rapid fire, lower recoil, higher mobility, but lower range (short barrel?). Or you could get the Assault Afterburner, with long barrel, FMJ, Increased damage but decreased rate of fire. There could be a few preset combinations for each gun.

[spoiler=3. Ammo Variations ]

I'll just quote my old post on this one.

I would like to see ammo type variations included in the attachment cycle for Double-PaP. Some examples could be:

Assault rifles could get Full metal jacket which gives more damage through penetration and increases the number of zombies through which a single bullet can travel.

Shotguns could get Birdshot, which slightly decreases damage per pellet and increases spread, but doubles the number of pellets. Or slugs, which are self-explanatory. Dragon's breath could be an option on more than just the Olympia. Flechette or dart rounds could do something as well.

SMGs could have tracers, which I guess would only be helpful in an atmospheric sense (improving visibility on a dark map rather than altering the gun's function) They could also have Hollowpoint (pistols too) which deal more damage but have no penetration.

Also it should clearly indicate which one it gives you. Sometimes I can't even tell which attachment I have when Double-PaPing.

A few more ammo type Ideas:

DRT Ammo: For pretty much any weapon type, acts like my Hollow point idea. The round is made of a compressed powder and explodes like a mini frag grenade on impact. It is made to prevent ricochet or penetration. If you are shooting at something you don't want it to bounce back and hit you or to keep going through the target and hit someone behind it. Anyway it could have increased damage but decreased penetration.

Can't remember the name, but there is a type of shotgun ammo that has a slug with buckshot behind it. Self-explanatory. Flechettes could deal more damage but less penetration, or shoot faster with lower recoil but lower damage.

Stun rounds, like in extinction. I think there are others in extinction but I don't really remember. I don't play that. But stun rounds seem useful in zombies. This could work like my next idea on the list.

Launcher ammo variations: White phosphorus could deal slightly less damage on impact but leaves behind a corrosive gas cloud. Or magnesium-based explosives, which deal even less damage on impact but set targets on fire dealing devastatingly powerful residual damage. Or some variation that increases damage on impact but decreases blast radius.

[spoiler=4. Stopping Power.]

I don't mean increased damage. I mean literally the ability to make a zombie stop, stagger, or even fall over with the force of a shot. Realistically a zombie shouldn't keep running at full speed when hit with a 50 cal bullet or an RPG. Look at the war machine. The upgraded version is actually pretty good because it detonates on impact (which it honestly should do un upgraded as well) but still explosives are unpopular in general. The ability to make a train scatter by blasting them with an RPG would make explosives viable support or medic weapons. And other under-represented weapons like snipers and shotguns too. Realistically a wall of buckshot should send a zombie sprawling. Imagine if it actually did though! It would add new incentives to keep and upgrade otherwise undesirable weapons. Certain weapons should receive stopping power when upgraded. Maybe give them "percussive ammunition" or something. I don't know. Science.

Although stopping power is specific to a few weapon classes, you could potentially cycle through combinations of ammo types as well as weapon variations. With all this stuff double-PaPing could actually cost 5000. I would suggest that it so increase base stats and refill ammo, but then you could get a max ammo an indefinite number of times by cycling through.

If you like this Idea, or have any other weapon variation Ideas, or ammo type Ideas, feel free to share.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

- I like stopping power but it would be a BIG thing to incorporate into the next game, but hey, it's the first full-next-gen cod so anything is possible. 

 

- You should add in some better attachments too: 

 

-Porter gun: A ray gun that comes built into a normal gun, but only has 20 shots. Also comes in M2 version with 21 shots. 

 

-Frost's whistle: Adds a freezing attachment to the gun. Like a mini winter's howl. 

 

-Trap shot: A single use attachment, when launched at a zombie it takes it and slams it to the floor or wall, or even ceiling with some skill. The zombie can not despawn or die until shot. Useful for holding a zombie. 

 

-Nano-Canister: Launches a single canister of nano bots from the weapon, this works like a selquifier shot, destroying everything in it's range. 

 

- Vortex manipulator: A portable jet-gun, unlimited amo, but one can't run with it in use. 

 

-Subsurface beets: A portable subsurface resonator, 10 shots.

 

-Duel entanglement device: a special device, launched like a launcher, but sticks to zombies like a semtex. Once attached to a zombie, the points collected from that zombie are doubled, so it earns the same during double points normally, during double points it can quadruple the points for that one zombie. 

 

 

 

 

 

And some new amp-types: 

 

Frigid, can sometimes freeze zombies 

Glass: bullets not only shatter on impact for slight splash damage, but the weapon it's self will start spewing glass shards like a wood chipper. 

Essence of Aether: Super rare, makes it so after the weapon has run out of amo, the last shot will produce a drop. 

[Electric Jesus]

How about some weapon variations:

Lamentation RIOT - Stun Ammo, Higher mobility, Underbarrel teargas canister.

AUG 50M3 PYRO - Underbarrel flamethrower + Incendiary ammo.

Death Stalker FROSTBITE - Frost Whistle + frigid ammo

there could be a lot of combinations of wonder-weapon-y modifications.

[The Clay Bird]

Awesome concept EJ.  I agree that it is frustrating to hit the box on round 5 and get a literally almost unusable weapon. I think they all should have some utility.  much like the M1911 turns into mustang and sally, i think some of the other less useful un PaP guns should PaP into proportionately MORE useful guns.you know some reward for carrying the crap weapon long enough to actually upgrade it.

 

And the idea about some of the AW weapon advancement things like the accuracy increases with firing? sounds really cool and somewhat like some of Borderlands 2's mechanics with some weapons.  Since obviously zombies in itself is unrealistic, I would see no problem with adding effects to guns that are a little far fetched.  like in Borderlands 2, you may have an ability that your missed bullets have a 30% chance of ricocheting back and hitting an enemy.  or like the conference call you shoot one enemy and it branches out to shoot all other enemies... I think there a lot of  fantastic type abilities they could include for PaP guns to bridge the gap between regular weapons and wonder weapons

[Electric Jesus]

Thanks! I really think that every gun nedds to be useful in some way, preferably in a unique way.

Somewhat relevant: I'n against the idea of a formal create a class system in zombies. But there are still "classes," or recurring loadouts. For example playing Medic is a "class." It has a slightly different set of perks or weapons than a non-medic player. But honestly every player always wants to end up with a single loadout. In multiplayer, there are all kinds of classes based on play styles. LMGs, SMGs, and sometimes melee only! So many play styles and enough weapons / perks to allow you to express your own style.

In zombies... not so much. I mean obviously everyone wants to end up with wonder weapons. They are just a cut above the rest. But even with normal guns everyone wants to get an LMG. I mean LMGs are obviously the best for general use. Their ammo count and damage give them the best total kill potential. If every gun was useful in its own way, people with different preferred gameplay styles would favor certain weapons over others. Maybe even to the point where you would rather have a pistol or a launcher over an LMG! You could refine your gameplay style further with weapon and ammo variations, too.

Same with perks, although that's harder since there are so few. I think there should be enough basic perks to allow you to choose which you want based on your style. Jug is a given. But if you're a shotgun guy, maybe you want a quickdraw perk or stalker. I'm not saying we should turn it into multiplayer, but it would be cool to have more variety in gameplay.

If you ask the site's members what their favorite non-wonder weapons are, you will get 100 different answers. But when they play they always end up with like one of 5 select weapons which are deemed "the best." That is a problem.

[DFSnake]

Sounds like your describing the robot-zombies released in China. If we could play it here that would be pretty sweet

[BrayJayTheZombSlaya]

I like your idea on the weapon mods, but Treyarch has already touched on that (HAMR and AN-94 shoot the first 7 bullets and the first 2 bullets of a burst at a higher rate of fire, respectively). I think wonder-attachments would be a bit overpowered, but I like the idea of a cycling for the underbarrel attachments. A flamethrower attachment has so much potential. Ammo variation would be so nice. It'd be amazing if I could get explosive or incendiary ammo from Extinction mode in zombies- explosive doing damage to the player up close, incendiary causing zombie hits to make the screen all fiery. Having different variations of weapons is good indeed. I would like to see pistols or smgs we can pack a punch that become dual wield- realistic, no, but they did it with the pm63 in BO1, and that dropped the ball, so we need some improvement. Dual wield skorpion EVO? Yes please. Incendiary ammo on the AN-94 with a flamethrower? Completely necessary. DSR with reduced / increased mobility depending on playstyle? What a revolutionary idea. I want to see some Ghosts and probably will want to see some AW weaponry featured in zombies as well- tearing through zombies with the upgraded Lynx Sniper Rifle has always been a dream of mine after using it in infected. 3arch has so much potential here, lets hope they give us something awesome next year.

[Stop Mocking Me0]

While I personally don't give a crap and a half about ghosts weapons, there are some VERY interesting AW weapons that would be SUPER epic in zombies. 

 

Start with the obvious: The laser gun

This is shone to be a week weapon in AW, and that's what's to be expected. It's not designed to hit fast-moving randomized movement targets that react to stimuli, it's designed to bash through hordes of mindless targets running in a strait line. Bingo zombies. 

 

I don't even see this weapon as a wonder weapon, I see it as like the crossbow or ballistic knives: A tactical handheld. 

 

Imagine: You pull it from the box on round 10: It has infinite amo, but does crap damage.

 

Upgraded it becomes the death ray: it's damage is slightly increased, however it now also comes with a charge feature: Activating it charges up the machine, the longer the charge the more built up damage, once released it blasts one or two zombies to kingdom come! THEN when PAPed a second time it becomes the medi-canon: Now it does the same damage it did before PAP, however it's charge system stays in place, Furthermore, one can revive players from a distance by focusing the beam on them. Charging has no effect on revives. 

 

You can say this is OP but it really isn't. It still takes forever to kill, and reviving still takes the full revive time, unlike the ballistic knives which revive instantly.