On the Topic of "Bullying on CODZ"

[GRILL]

CODZ is full of different people from all over the world; young and old, active and lurker, hardcore and casual.

 

Often times along the way, communication can get misinterpreted, and inevitably misunderstandings will occur.  Sometimes it's 1 on 1, sometimes it's 10 on 10, and sometimes it's 10 on 1.

 

We, as human beings, are not perfect.  We all have faults - and it's quite easy to forget that when dealing with a personal, sensitive, or passionate topic.    It's also quite easy to get into the "pack mentality", to "gang up" on the odd man out; we are all guilty of this, including myself.  Gossiping about other members, only using destructive criticism, putting someone down - most time it's completely subconscious, just going through the motion... other times the true gravity of words are not taken into account.

 

This looks like bullying, but in reality this is us being imperfect: we're a close knit community, some folks are going to have problems with other folks.  Should we discuss them publicly?  Absolutely not.  IS discussing them publicly considered bullying?  It's hard to say.  No one is actively seeking out those to bully, and often times some members are just venting.  It's a very contextual term, but one thing for sure is that it is an incredibly malicious act to consciously bully others.

 

"Bullying is the use of force, threat, or coercion to abuse, intimidate, or aggressively dominate others."

 

CODZ is an oasis in a desert of cruel internet forums.  I'd like to think I know a fair amount of you very well, and I wouldn't be able to name ANYONE who is purposely looking to "bully" other members.  When there are bullys, you know what we do?  We ban them.  Swiftly.

 

I was in chat the other day (the first time I had been in chat for weeks), and we were talking about a member who is no longer here amidst discussing zombies.  We were sharing stories of how this member basically rubbed some folks the wrong way, and were having a nostalgia trip.  The topic changed, we started talking about a current member.  Then, a new-ish member joined the chat.  This new member basically told us all that we were lazy for resorting to gossip, and that we should get back on to the topic of zombies and stop bullying.  I have since seen that member post about "bullying" happening here in other places.  I wasn't sure if this new member had seen us talking about the member who is no longer here, and perhaps had thought it was all about the current member we were talking about when he joined in the conversation.

 

Regardless, him saying I was a "bully" killed me, I was just hanging out with my peers in the chat shooting the shit - and suddenly this new member thinks I'm some sort of gossiping bullying jerk.  I tried reaching out to him at the time, but of course the conversation was still heated - and it was left completely unresolved.  I've been thinking all week about how this new member was right, to an extent - but also about how I thought "bullying" was so harsh a term to use.

 

This happened about a week ago, and it's been stuck in my head ever since - not for his impression, but for what he was trying to say.

 

Another similar situation occurred with a different new member who was just trying to share a theory.  His post was unfortunately misconstrued, and attracted a few responses that portrayed them as someone who was trying to pass off misinformation as truth for attention.  This new user defended himself, and ended with something along the lines of "so this is how you welcome new members".

 

This, also, KILLLLLED me reading it.  Seriously kills me, breaks my heart.  We get so used to being blunt with each other, we get so used to pointing out misinformation - but we cannot let it override the basic principle that mostly everyone on CODZ means well.  It kills me to think a new member comes in, gets misinterpreted, and basically fed to the wolves.

 

New member(s), if you read this, we aren't perfect.  We know each other, we've been hanging out for the off-season, yes, we have issues from here to here - but instead of chastising us for "bullying", instead of calling us lazy, instead of "bullying" us back - try and realize that we probably don't mean it, we probably are just acting without thinking, and we are way too used to being candid with each other.

 

We are an incredibly friendly community, as I said, an oasis in a desert of terrible communities.  That doesn't mean we aren't human.  I consider myself a crusader for user rights, but even I mess up from time to time (and this thread is how I'm trying to "own" my mistake).

 

Let's just try and remember that most people mean well when they post.  You can often tell when someone is posting for the love of zombies, or posting for the love of attention - but sometimes the lines are blurred.  Before you call someone out: take a look at their post history, PM them, try and establish some sort of idea about where they are coming from before you chastise them.

We are all here to nerd out and talk about zombies, let's do our best to be friendly, helpful and all around a kick ass community.

 

Here's looking to a positive, bully-free 2015 for CODZ.  All the best.

[Hells Warrrior]

I'll also like to add to this and I haven't spoken to any other staff member about it.

 

However, if we receive any reports of bullying and I have read this as bullying, then I will suspend the persons account. I have a ZERO tolerance on bullying, and CoDz has a ZERO tolerance on bullying (it should not be happening, period).

[Undead]

I couldn't have summed that up better myself, GRILL. I'm glad you didn't sugar coat it either.

 

On that note, I would like to point out the issue we inevitably run into issues with individuals taking somethings personally. To try and avoid these confrontations publically, I'd suggest if you are really unsure what someone's intentions were, try to clarify before starting a heated argument in the thread. As GRILL mentioned, there's plenty of scenarios where threads tend to derail and it ultimately turns out to be a miscommunication of sorts. We will not always agree with one another, but we can surely be mroe civil about it publicly. 

[Chopper]

I want to add one thing. It's ok to report staff. We are subject to the same pressures that everyone else faces in life. Whilst we should strive to act above it all, it can be hard.

I sincerely promise that as a group we admit to our own faults, and are prepared to take criticism. I like to think we are all mature enough to not gang together and we will actually look at everything 'as is'.

if you have any worries that a report will lead to bias against you please believe that it won't.

Failing that, contact Covert Gunman directly. He's an amazing admin and is not afraid to ever tell us what we need to hear. My actions have changed based on advice I have gotten from him.

[PINNAZ]

Well said gents above me & well done @GRILL on confronting this topic of recent days.

I too actually said a remark in that chat about a member who is no longer active & I honestly think what I said is the truth, but that is the point. I should not have said that publicly. I know how I feel about it, I should have kept it to myself. I actually can't stand when people talk bad about someone who is not there to defend themself. And I broke my own rule.

Though I have not really been bullied IRL, I like to think that CoDz is a safe haven for people whose personal life is not so bland as the text that we read. There are numerous threads in the Deep Thought forum of members seeking help & advice from others on how to deal with a wide range of issues. There is also great advice & replies to these questions. Even though we don't know each other personally, we still have a respect & care for members of CoDz wellbeing.

If you are a newish member here & reading this, and possibly newish to the Zombies game mode, COD Zombies has so many arrogant, rude, lying, attention seeking trolls, if you say something which is a 1 line statement, other people in the Zombies community will jump on you straight away. Like in real life, If you state something, you better have something to back it up with

Unfortunately there were a few members here on CoDz that jumped the gun quite quickly when really there was no need. What was said by two of the new members where hardly big statements. We should have replied with "can you elaborate & tell me more about what you are saying"

As for the other possible cases of bullying in which GRILL mentioned, if you are questioning something that another member said to you & do not wish to PM that person for clarification, PM someone who you are comfortable with & see if they can mention your issue to that person. Mediation is always pretty good in solving issues.

Thanks for putting this topic on the public table, hopefully we can improve in the future.

[Matuzz]

Great post it's important to not drive new people away.

Also do we have topic on arguing? There should be as people should note that arguing is not same as fighting. As we discus theories there will be a lot of disagreements and trough internet it's hard to figure out the tone of the posts but if people disagree with you remember these are not personal attacks as those are not tolerated.

[PINNAZ]

@Matuzz - How to Debate & Avoid Arguments found in the members lounge.

Maybe a "Topic of the Week" or a Global Announcement.

After all, we are all here to have fun & not micromanage others.

[Slade]

CoDZ is a place where we can express our love for Zombies and beyond in a civil and respected atmosphere where anyone can join in on the conversation and express themselves, no matter their usergroup, join date, their views, background, opinions or anything else really.  Like @Tasha said, we're all here to have some fun.

 

Please don't assume the worst when someone posts something you don't like/agree with; try placing yourself in the poster's shoes before replying.

Furthermore, don't take things too serious and personally.

 

Life is a learning process, and receiving and voicing criticism is a big part of that.

Criticizing others should always be done in a reasonable, polite and constructive manner. That way you can both learn something from it. 

 

Recently, I've seen a lot of pointless arguing that could've been easily avoided in a variety of ways. That's why I encourage everyone to make greater use of our report button.

In addition to making us aware of inappropriate posts, it's the best way to let every available mod know something's up, in turn allowing us to get up to speed on the situation quickly,

and step in if necessary to avoid further escalation.

 

Like @Chopper said, we staff members are humans too. Daily life influences our decisions and attitude around these parts, both positively and negatively, whether we like it or not.

And like everyone else, we make errors.

 

We've had many trolls, attention seekers and misleaders in the past and we'll certainly have many more in the future.

But that's absolutely no excuse to treat others in a different manner than you normally would.

[Hells Warrrior]

@GRILL, this is a topic that needs to be given prominence in site news, so with that in mind I'm going to move it but I'm also going to leave a link to it where it was originally posted.

[Guest]

I was required to read this topic after I already read it twice XD it wouldnt be a problem but im trying to resolve stuff with my PC atm, so is it possible that you can change it so that if you have seen it already it doesnt do that?

 

Anyways in regards to complaining about staff. I know staff do get anoyed sometimes to and stuff, they are only human, but if someone complained about you hells for example (im not its a hypothetical) what would happen since your an admin? 

[Hells Warrrior]

@Nightmare Voyager - No.

 

Sorry for the short answer but it's the way it is, if you have read it the system doesn't know you have read it previously. It just understands that from the point it was implemented you hadn't read it and we are making sure everyone reads it.

 

I deem it that important.

[Guest]

Thats fine but can I have an answer to my other question as well as I think it could be important if people feel victimized? 

[Jolteon]

@Nightmare Voyager then we would go through the same procedures as we would with any other member. It wouldn't be the first and it most likely wouldn't be the last time. The only difference is that the staff are constantly in contact with each other and hence it happens very much behind closed doors. The thing is, the staff are all appointed as highly trusted members of the site; and hence the chances of any of us stepping so far out of line that disciplinary action has to be taken is next to zero.

 

We all make mistakes, we all get hot headed and say something we perhaps shouldn't, and that goes for staff too. A lot more goes into making a decision regarding something like this than "he's being mean, lets warn/ban them" it is often discussed by multiple staff members before any action is taken. Just be nice to everyone and you will be fine 

 

-Jolteon

[Hells Warrrior]

Anyways in regards to complaining about staff. I know staff do get anoyed sometimes to and stuff, they are only human, but if someone complained about you hells for example (im not its a hypothetical) what would happen since your an admin? 

 

Sorry I missed that, if someone had a complaint against any member of staff, then it would go through the relevant channels. Obviously we are a team and we discuss these things, however, if a member of staff has stepped over the line then we would deal with it accordingly. Like any grievance and disciplinary process, this would be between the individual concerned and those dealing with the complaint.

[Guest]

@Nightmare Voyager then we would go through the same procedures as we would with any other member. It wouldn't be the first and it most likely wouldn't be the last time. The only difference is that the staff are constantly in contact with each other and hence it happens very much behind closed doors. The thing is, the staff are all appointed as highly trusted members of the site; and hence the chances of any of us stepping so far out of line that disciplinary action has to be taken is next to zero.

 

We all make mistakes, we all get hot headed and say something we perhaps shouldn't, and that goes for staff too. A lot more goes into making a decision regarding something like this than "he's being mean, lets warn/ban them" it is often discussed by multiple staff members before any action is taken. Just be nice to everyone and you will be fine 

 

-Jolteon

 

Okay, thats good to know, it makes things a lot fairer if people do feel as if they are being treated wrong (yet again its a hypothetical im not planning to overthrow hells or something weird like that)

[Jolteon]

(yet again its a hypothetical im not planning to overthrow hells or something weird like that)

 

 

Well you might not be... 

 

-Jolteon

[Slade]

 

(yet again its a hypothetical im not planning to overthrow hells or something weird like that)

 

 

Well you might not be... 

 

-Jolteon

 

 

[Hells Warrrior]

Okay, thats good to know, it makes things a lot fairer if people do feel as if they are being treated wrong (yet again its a hypothetical im not planning to overthrow hells or something weird like that)

 

That's good to hear, the Roman Empire tried it once. They decided to build a wall right across the UK to keep us in Scotland

 

[GodOfWarrio]

Personally I haven't seen any around here but I'm sure it's going on. It always is all over. Glad it's being adressed

[Guest]

Thats why I'm gonna take a less direct route, I have my super drill to mine underground ready to go! Anyways back on topic XD

[YdaJdiMstr®]

LOL! Not at your post, but I thought someone reported me as a bully lol I was quite offended until I realized it was generic... Whew... Means I've not been caught yet ;-)

[Electric Jesus]

Remember guys and gals, CoDz is not a place. It's a collection of individuals. I care about each of you very much, as individual members of this community that I love so much. We're individuals, with ideas, and opinions. We can't all agree on an answer to some questions, I mean come on. We're a community for a game that can't be won, with a story that WE make up. We can "attack" an idea without attacking the person behind it.

You all stay classy.

[TheNathanNS]

Did I do anything specifically?

 

I just went here and got this notice.

 

 

Or is it an all member notice?

[Flammenwerfer]

This is a notice for all members, not for one in particular. If you've been a good lad, you've nothing to fear.

[ZombieOfTheDead]

I remember back in the day me and MMX used to argue with each other. Like, really argue. To the degree where he kicked me off the credits to his zombie trilogy thread/video. Looking back, I don't remember really insulting him, more like stating I didn't agree, probably in a more aggressive way than I should have, and so the feud began. I think he probably overreacted a little, but I set him off more times than once and initially left a bad impression with him. Keep in mind we were both stubborn in our opinions, which made everything worse.

 

My point is, remember to keep a level head. You never know how someone might react to what you say, so it's best to think through what you say first. If they do misinterpret what you say, don't fuel the fires like I did. Just calm down, and explain what you mean. With luck, they'll understand. If not, don't be immature about it (like I was. Man, I didn't realize how much of a douche I was back in the day).

 

As for all out insults, that should be obvious. Don't do it.