Nazi Richtofen missing his Swastika

[Guest]

Considering the Giant zombies don't have it, I think that is a pretty good indication that it won't be in the game.

[Tattoo247]

Historical accuracy? Don't make me laugh!

This game is lightly laced with history, just enough to act as a base for their story telling. Sorry I just had to throw that out there, imaging trying to reference this game in an actual conversation involving Nazis lol Good lawdamercy...

[Guest]

Historical accuracy? Don't make me laugh!

This game is lightly laced with history, just enough to act as a base for their story telling. Sorry I just had to throw that out there, imaging trying to reference this game in an actual conversation involving Nazis lol Good lawdamercy...

"Back in the Great War, we fought against soldiers, zombies, armoured zombies with jetpacks (also flamethrowers) and giant metal men! We had to ride around on a tank which would randomly make us fall through it and get crushed I will have you know! We even had to drink horrible tasting beverages to gain special powers to help us fight. Everything was powered by generators which used an element that doesn't yet exist and came from space, said element caused the zombies as well. A guy I knew had his brain removed and put in a flying robot. We used weapons that we could buy off of walls, we used a box to get weapons from different times, we even could upgrade our weapons. After all that we used magical staffs which controlled the elements. Oh and also there was a little girl who talked to us in our heads."

"Grandad did you forget to take your medicine?"

 

I am sorry Tattoo but I cannot agree with that statement, what I had described is the most historically accurate piece of text I have ever read. (Sarcasm, just helping prove his point.)

[Reaper2909]

In the steam db there are an specific german/austrian version listed. Austrian have only symbolic restriction, so i think that this will a symbolic restricted version. And international will get uncensored!?

https://steamdb.info/sub/66130/

[slash23579]

lol game devs don't even care about talking a few minutes and removing the swastikas from their games, and it's never been an issue before. And if you think the reason CoD stopped being in WW2 or Zombies moved away from Nazi Zombies is because they don't want to take the time to censor it, you're an idiot.  Why would they release a map pack in 2011 with Moon full of Nazi Zombie maps, with even a Nazi Zombie, wearing a swastika badge, as the marketing material when Treyarchs too scared to deal with Nazis anymore? I don't think they are, and no Nazi in a CoD game has ever been censored except for in a version that legally requires censorship, which they do and there's no drama, so why would they care now? Just because they censored an international trailer that they don't want to have to block in certain countries means Treyarch or Activisions so scared of backlash from Germany that a fucking bonus map with Nazi Zombies has to be censored internationally, when they've done it a thousand times before, without censorship, with, like I said, no drama? I would love to hear why some of you guys can "almost guarentee" it will be censored internationally, besides Treyarch being too lazy to censor specific versions, which isn't a valid reason at all.

[DeathBringerZen]

And if you think the reason CoD stopped being in WW2 or Zombies moved away from Nazi Zombies is because they don't want to take the time to censor it, you're an idiot. 

First things first, this^ is rude. No need to be calling anyone an idiot for having an opinion.

 

Secondly, it is easy to assume they will not add the swaztika for a number of reasons. After having to edit the Kino map so it was eligable for release in Germany and neighboring countries I can see why they would choose to leave the emblem out of this new game so it can pass through without issue. The world has gone all sensitive over the slightest of things and the bigger game developers seem to have abandoned the whole WWII scene for a modern and fictional setting where they are not necessarily offending anyone.

 

It may not be why they have chosen to do this but it sure does seem so. Even EA have taken the Medal of Honor and Battlefield series away from WWII and into modern times. Original Infinity Ward (ie: Respawn) chose a futuristic setting for their debut title under a new guise. That doesn't mean there is not WWII orientated games though. Wolfenstien and Nazi Zombie Army are 2 I can think of but I am just assuming that considering the storyline has long since shifted away from the Nazi Zombie storyline to just zombies now I can see them ditching it just to keep things clean. I am obviously jumping the gun when I say "guarantee" but I still feel pretty confident nonetheless.

[slash23579]

And if you think the reason CoD stopped being in WW2 or Zombies moved away from Nazi Zombies is because they don't want to take the time to censor it, you're an idiot. 

First things first, this^ is rude. No need to be calling anyone an idiot for having an opinion.

 

Secondly, it is easy to assume they will not add the swaztika for a number of reasons. After having to edit the Kino map so it was eligable for release in Germany and neighboring countries I can see why they would choose to leave the emblem out of this new game so it can pass through without issue. The world has gone all sensitive over the slightest of things and the bigger game developers seem to have abandoned the whole WWII scene for a modern and fictional setting where they are not necessarily offending anyone.

 

It may not be why they have chosen to do this but it sure does seem so. Even EA have taken the Medal of Honor and Battlefield series away from WWII and into modern times. Original Infinity Ward (ie: Respawn) chose a futuristic setting for their debut title under a new guise. That doesn't mean there is not WWII orientated games though. Wolfenstien and Nazi Zombie Army are 2 I can think of but I am just assuming that considering the storyline has long since shifted away from the Nazi Zombie storyline to just zombies now I can see them ditching it just to keep things clean. I am obviously jumping the gun when I say "guarantee" but I still feel pretty confident nonetheless.

You say that they stopped after Kino, which isn't the case. Rezurrection came with 4 Nazi Zombie maps, fully uncensored in the international release, and nobody complained. Also, Richtofen, while wearing a spacesuit in Ascension (presumably to fit the theme of the map, came back in his full uncensored uniform in Shangri-La.

Also, I know I was being a bit harsh when I called people idiots, but that reason to move out of WW2 just seems very unlikely to me. I think it left that era was because WW2 was the standard time period for shooters since Wolfenstein in the 80s, and pretty much every shooter game since then was a WW2 shooter, and people got so bored of the era that Infinity Ward wanted to mix it up a bit, and got extremely successful doing so. Other shooter series saw, and followed suit. I doubt it was because they got tired of censoring.

And the thing is, nobody I have ever met, including Germans, have ever gotten upset about a video game containing Nazis and/or dealing with National Socialism in any way. Most people just accept it as history and move on. In fact, every German gamer I know always imports any sort of game containing Nazis from out of country, because they don't want to deal with the censorship either. And to be honest, internationally censoring their game will probably create more drama than having a censored version, and a non censored version. No way to know until it's out though, so we'll see.

Edit: And also, thanks to Reaper2909, it's looks a version of the Digital Deluxe is restricted to Germany and Austria only. Funny how it's only the Digital Deluxe, which includes "The Gaint" and not the standard retail release. Makes me think it will be uncensored

Edited July 17, 2015 by slash23579

[PortlyLlama80]

It's just so they can market it in Germany, Austria and other countries where the symbols are banned; it will be in the non-German versions once it comes out. 

 

I don't understand why you think they would add the swaztika into any version? After WaW Activision have abandoned WWII altogether and I find it highly unlikely they would go to the effort of having to release any kind of edited version of the game for something so minor or trivial. The zombie storyline has moved on a lot since the 'Nazi Zombies' days. Now it's just 'Zombies' and we don't hear anything related to Nazi's. I guess we can only wait and see but I am pretty confident they will not add it to any version of the game.

They did it for Black Ops, no reason why they won't do it here; especially since we are going back to WWII. 

[DeathBringerZen]

You say that they stopped after Kino, which isn't the case. Rezurrection came with 4 Nazi Zombie maps, fully uncensored in the international release, and nobody complained. Also, Richtofen, while wearing a spacesuit in Ascension (presumably to fit the theme of the map, came back in his full uncensored uniform in Shangri-La.

The 4 remastered WaW maps actually originally came out before Kino as they were the bonus content that came with the special editions of Black Ops before release. They were added to the rezurrection map pack at the end of the games cycle but you are right, they did feature unedited and Richtofen did have the swaztika still in Shangri La I believe but I specifically remember reading stuff on Activision saying they were unhappy at the amount of censoring required to Black Ops 1 to allow it to just make the 18 certificate in Germany & Japan and that they would want to try and avoid that in future if possible. These reports are why the Iron Cross was used instead of the swaztika and I pressumed why they used the Iron Cross in Origins.

 

http://www.gamesradar.com/call-of-duty-black-ops-censored-for-japan/

 

http://gamerant.com/call-of-duty-black-ops-banned-germany-censored-pen-49626/

 

I know the above reports don't mean anything, just pointing out the changes required and why they would maybe want to avoid this stuff in future. There was other That being said, it was also widely reported several years back that Activision didn't want to go down the modern warfare route and wanted to stick with the WWII (and then Vietnam) route so maybe they don't care so much. I am just basing it off years of various reports I have read that Treyarch wanted to move away from the whole 'Nazi Zombies' thing, hence why Nazi's were taken out of the story since the WaW days and were only really subtably referrenced since then. If we do go back to Der Riese and it has swaztika's and obvious Nazi memorabila then fair enough, I will stand corrected.

 

Again, I could be wrong but like me, you and PortlyLlama80 are just assuming and neither of us will know for sure until nearer the time. The German version of WaW did not even include zombies so it easy to assume they would not bother adding in something that would require censorship because it is simply trivial by this point in the games storyline. Just like how they replaced German Samantha with annoying American Samantha. They don't care about changing things we hold dear to us... a swaztika means nothing... especially when it will only be on a character we see in a sequence for several seconds before he dies.

[Lenne]

Gotta say as someone who lives in Germany. I really hope there are no swastikas.

Not because I am offended by them... that is really not the case, but only because I am kinda scared of the USK going into full blown censor rampage when they see it.

Which means they cut out the violence of the game as well. I mean they did that with BO1 and it was kinda sad, because of no crawlers etc.

Then again they released Wolfenstein the new order without any censorship apart from the swastikas and Nazi remarks.

My two cents.

[NaBrZHunter]

Gotta say as someone who lives in Germany. I really hope there are no swastikas.

Not because I am offended by them... that is really not the case, but only because I am kinda scared of the USK going into full blown censor rampage when they see it.

Which means they cut out the violence of the game as well. I mean they did that with BO1 and it was kinda sad, because of no crawlers etc.

Then again they released Wolfenstein the new order without any censorship apart from the swastikas and Nazi remarks.

My two cents.

They...removed...crawlers? D-: Holy crow...it wouldn't be the same...!

[Korima]

Knowing Treyarch, it wouldn't be something so simple. He has an Iron cross on him, and uniform is still that of German Officer attire, but with all the time travel, I have a feeling they changed the course of history, hence the lack of Dots on the moon (moon base), 935 or Z-A in the Group 935 logos, and lack of swastikas or eagles on the teleporter. Ripple effect.

[NaBrZHunter]

Knowing Treyarch, it wouldn't be something so simple. He has an Iron cross on him, and uniform is still that of German Officer attire, but with all the time travel, I have a feeling they changed the course of history, hence the lack of Dots on the moon (moon base), 935 or Z-A in the Group 935 logos, and lack of swastikas or eagles on the teleporter. Ripple effect.

True, the ripple effect can be huge, but to entirely remove Griffin Station? That would be a bit extreme, and change Richtofen's motivation to eliminate Samantha and Maxis at that time. At this point in the story, Griffin Station is already at the peak of its success. 

[Guest]

If Griffin Station was gone. Wow Sam would be dead as soon as she got to the Moon.

[Korima]

Knowing Treyarch, it wouldn't be something so simple. He has an Iron cross on him, and uniform is still that of German Officer attire, but with all the time travel, I have a feeling they changed the course of history, hence the lack of Dots on the moon (moon base), 935 or Z-A in the Group 935 logos, and lack of swastikas or eagles on the teleporter. Ripple effect.

True, the ripple effect can be huge, but to entirely remove Griffin Station? That would be a bit extreme, and change Richtofen's motivation to eliminate Samantha and Maxis at that time. At this point in the story, Griffin Station is already at the peak of its success. 

Actually, Griffin seems to be where everything fell apart. Groph  didn't apprehend Sam, Maxis was sent to the Aether with control over machines by being killed and sucked into the MPD like the zombie souls, and it's where the missiles that struck earth were stored that caused the paradox or "The Rift" to be formed. The MPD room had oxygen, judging by the radio of Richtofen accidentally teleporting to it prior, presumably without space gear due to the clarity of his voice in the recordings.

 

EDIT: correction, it was Groph, not Schuster. But realistically it was both of them who failed to apprehend her.

Edited July 19, 2015 by Korima
Misspellings

[NaBrZHunter]

Knowing Treyarch, it wouldn't be something so simple. He has an Iron cross on him, and uniform is still that of German Officer attire, but with all the time travel, I have a feeling they changed the course of history, hence the lack of Dots on the moon (moon base), 935 or Z-A in the Group 935 logos, and lack of swastikas or eagles on the teleporter. Ripple effect.

True, the ripple effect can be huge, but to entirely remove Griffin Station? That would be a bit extreme, and change Richtofen's motivation to eliminate Samantha and Maxis at that time. At this point in the story, Griffin Station is already at the peak of its success. 

Actually, Griffin seems to be where everything fell apart. Groph  didn't apprehend Sam, Maxis was sent to the Aether with control over machines by being killed and sucked into the MPD like the zombie souls, and it's where the missiles that struck earth were stored that caused the paradox or "The Rift" to be formed. The MPD room had oxygen, judging by the radio of Richtofen accidentally teleporting to it prior, presumably without space gear due to the clarity of his voice in the recordings.

 

EDIT: correction, it was Groph, not Schuster. But realistically it was both of them who failed to apprehend her.

Griffin Station is where it all came to a head, one might say, but the catalyst fallout was at Der Riese. It is the last place the big three were physically together. Otherwise, Der Riese existed peacefully for 5, almost 6 years following the initial discovery of the MPD. (Note the correction, based on the discovery of the MPD, January 1940, while the fallout at Der Riese occurred in September 1945

[Tattoo247]

If Griffin Station was gone. Wow Sam would be dead as soon as she got to the Moon.

Haha did you ever see the Southpark episode where they think there is a talking whale from the Moon at seaworld?

The last scene of that episode, the credits roll as a dead whale lies on the Moon in silence, insert Samantha lol

 

I do like the ripple effect theory. Remember Maxis/Richtofen only agreed to represent the Nazi regime because of funding. What if instead either Maxis or Richtofen has went back in time with perfected technology that was finished in a timeframe that didn't need additional funding?

I'm pretty sure military attire didn't change just because Hitler became their leader. The symbols were added to an already existing outfit, which could explain why Richtofen LOOKS like a Nazi, but doesn't display the swastika.

Obviously, they were taken out to prevent offending anyone, and more importantly, to increase world wide sales. Can't sell a game if it's banned in a certain area.

But it's safe to say, anything can be explained WITHIN the game, so why not say the Nazi party wasn't needed in G935's goals.

The only problem with this theory of mine is, if there was no Nazi funding, there was no need to make the Wunderwaffe.

It was in the back of my mind the first time I watched the trailer if we were going to see the DG2, and as of now I can't say we have. "To improve the human condition" was their mission until they had to depend on the Nazis.  

[NaBrZHunter]

If Griffin Station was gone. Wow Sam would be dead as soon as she got to the Moon.

Haha did you ever see the Southpark episode where they think there is a talking whale from the Moon at seaworld?

The last scene of that episode, the credits roll as a dead whale lies on the Moon in silence, insert Samantha lol

 

I do like the ripple effect theory. Remember Maxis/Richtofen only agreed to represent the Nazi regime because of funding. What if instead either Maxis or Richtofen has went back in time with perfected technology that was finished in a timeframe that didn't need additional funding?

I'm pretty sure military attire didn't change just because Hitler became their leader. The symbols were added to an already existing outfit, which could explain why Richtofen LOOKS like a Nazi, but doesn't display the swastika.

Obviously, they were taken out to prevent offending anyone, and more importantly, to increase world wide sales. Can't sell a game if it's banned in a certain area.

But it's safe to say, anything can be explained WITHIN the game, so why not say the Nazi party wasn't needed in G935's goals.

The only problem with this theory of mine is, if there was no Nazi funding, there was no need to make the Wunderwaffe.

It was in the back of my mind the first time I watched the trailer if we were going to see the DG2, and as of now I can't say we have. "To improve the human condition" was their mission until they had to depend on the Nazis.  

No wunderwaffe, forsooth! I appreciate this observation, but more importantly, there would be no zombies! Based on what 935 was intended to be, there will be no severance between them and the Nazi party, because as you (and I, up a ways) pointed out, they were the malicious force behind 935's work. Otherwise, we're just going to end up with some lame ATLAS style story. 

One thing perplexes me, though...

If Nazi (men who followed demonic agendas) involvement in the story is so controversial...

Then why are demonic forces so well accepted?

It's a little scary, if you think about it. Yet another reason I had hoped they'd continue in the sci-fi foundation over the preternatural. 

[Guest]

Super natural is easier to explain than actual science because in the story it would mean their is some scientific explanation but they don't have to explain it and can slap a magic sticker on it. 

[NaBrZHunter]

Super natural is easier to explain than actual science because in the story it would mean their is some scientific explanation but they don't have to explain it and can slap a magic sticker on it. 

And that is what's always made Nazi Zombies unique, is the strong, scientific background, even where Vril is concerned. 

In fact, so much so that the MPD and similarly charged devices are explained by scientists as being charged by 'energy from matter' when the braces on that energy are broken. Whether we'll see a change in that law is yet to be seen. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only one who calls this energy 'Souls' is Takeo. Richtofen (who is clearly the authority) has always referred to the process as an energy transfer. 

So we'll see. I would almost be okay with the MotD/SOE being its own story entirely as long as it didn't cross-pollinate with the original. Because yeah, like you said, no logic or explanation is required, and while it may feel mystic, eerie, or occultic, in the end, it's really just a cop-out. 

[Guest]

Super natural is easier to explain than actual science because in the story it would mean their is some scientific explanation but they don't have to explain it and can slap a magic sticker on it. 

And that is what's always made Nazi Zombies unique, is the strong, scientific background, even where Vril is concerned. 

In fact, so much so that the MPD and similarly charged devices are explained by scientists as being charged by 'energy from matter' when the braces on that energy are broken. Whether we'll see a change in that law is yet to be seen. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only one who calls this energy 'Souls' is Takeo. Richtofen (who is clearly the authority) has always referred to the process as an energy transfer. 

So we'll see. I would almost be okay with the MotD/SOE being its own story entirely as long as it didn't cross-pollinate with the original. Because yeah, like you said, no logic or explanation is required, and while it may feel mystic, eerie, or occultic, in the end, it's really just a cop-out. 

They have stated that Mob of the Dead and Shadows of Evil are in the story so yeah.

[NaBrZHunter]

@Nightmare Voyager

Naw, I know that. And it's pretty clear with the vials of blood and all, I was just saying that would have been my preference. 

[Lenne]

Bumping this because Blops3 will be uncut in Germany. 

[Guest]

Bumping this because Blops3 will be uncut in Germany. 

Really? So that means a definite lack of Nazi imagery or whatever.

[Lenne]

Bumping this because Blops3 will be uncut in Germany. 

 

Really? So that means a definite lack of Nazi imagery or whatever.

Most likely, yes.

But I certainly don't view it as a bummer. :P