The Order of Forgotten Mysteries #1: the Skulls

[anonymous]

Hey all, welcome to the first thread of the Order of Forgotten Mysteries!

 

Based on this thread, I thought it might be a nice idea of every now-and-then (like every week or something) release a thread like this, discussing a certain story aspect that is often forgotten or not solved yet. It’s not about the OP thread but more about your comments, as I hope it will spark some personal ideas for y’all, and we might come to a conclusion for every mystery. And most importantly: have fun. I hope I will post some mysteries that will give you the idea of “oh yeah, I forgot about that one”. Phew, I made this intro way too hurry. Anyway, I'm excited about the material we'll discuss this time:

 

One old, yet not so forgotten mystery that Shangri-La holds: the ‘Alien skull’. We see this object on the Richthofen altar behind the map’s Pack-a-Punch. It resembles a skull that appears definitely not human. It’s the skull on the left side of the table, as the right one is one that resembles the skull of either a primate or a prehistoric man (it is similar to the one in the Shangri La loading screen).

There are two possibilities I could think of:

 

The skull is humanoid. The natives of Shangri La might have performed artificial cranial deformation. This was something practised commonly in a variety of cultures widely separated geographically and chronologically (Scandinavian and Eurasian tribes, the Maya, the Nazca and the Australian Aboriginals to name a few), and actually still occurs today in a few Pacific islands. A head of a child is binded in, deforming the growing skull form and making it longer, often flatter.

The exact motivations behind this process differ, but reasons could be: Attractiveness, a symbol of status and the thought of believing to be more intelligent. Some archeologists, however, believe it may have something to do with honouring Ancient Austronauts. This name refers to the idea of intelligent extraterrestial (or extradimensional) creatures having roamed the Earth in Ancient times and have, as well, made contact with early human cultures, influencing the development of agriculture (think of Shangri La’s water system), technology and architecture (e.g. the Pyramids of Giza). For the humans, these highly developed race might have been a global inspiration of what we now call ‘gods’, or ‘deities’.

 

(Petroglyphs in Italy which are by some believed to resemble modern astronauts, refering to Ancient Astronauts.)

 

So there is a possibility that the elongated skull on the altar is ‘merely’ human, but still not meaning that the natives didn’t made any contact with Ancient Gods. What’s more, this hieroglyph can be found on the alter:

Look at it’s eye orbits, it facials...this is just not human. It kinda reminded me of an observation by Aetherialvoices (for real, if that guy ever finds his way back here he must have at least 50 mentions by me) about the Crazy Place zombies in Origins: “They are most definitely humanoid. Their facial features however, are not exactly human. They have a massive mouth with spiny teeth, small slits in place of a nose, they don't exactly have eyes (just small indents in their head that glow), and their fingers are claws. They are definitely closer to human than Keeper though.” This brings me to the second possible theory:

 

Basically this. The skull doesn’t look Keeper-like (eyeless), nor does it look human (short head). Could it be a hybride? According to the Thule society and certain Nazi scientists (you know, the übermensch believers), the Aryans were the lineage of the Vril Ya, mixed with ‘lesser’ Earthly humans. After the arrival of the Ancient Astronauts on Earth, they mated with early human societies, or possibly even primates, creating the hybrids: the Aryans. This skull could be of one of them, as it has both Keeper and human features. What do you think about this? Have you additions, or your own theory perhaps? Please share, and see you in the next “Order of the Forgotten Mysteries”!

[Lenne]

Hellööööö, Anon.

 

My uneducated guess would be that it may be a Keeper's skull, but the reason it still has eyes and doesn't look like the keepers we know is maybe some kind of mutation? Or maybe Shang is set in a universe in which keepers have eyes?

 

I really like your thread idea, I'll try to check into one whenever you post one and share some of my basic thoughts.

 

[anonymous]

Guten abend Lennærd! Gracias for the reply, and glad to hear you like it. 

 

10 minutes ago, Lenne said:

Or maybe Shang is set in a universe in which keepers have eyes?

Could be, but I doubt this since the Keepers are an interdimensional species. A possibility, however, is that a split of the Keepers went to Earth (known to us as the Vril Ya, or gods), got stuck there or stayed voluntary here (to create to Earthly fraction Order of the Keepers) and evolved, just like primates did. However, suddenly having eyes seems like a radical evolution to me.

14 minutes ago, Lenne said:

but the reason it still has eyes and doesn't look like the keepers we know is maybe some kind of mutation?

I know this is a theory heard many times, but a mutation could never have a sudden appearance of eyes as an effect, though a mutation in a HOX gene could have the displacement of eyes as an effect (if there are eyes somewhere else one the body). However, Classified learned us that mixing DNA fractures of humans and pigs would result in the eyeless crawlers we first encounter in Kino, so there could be a possibility that there is a certain mutation in the zombie universe that results in the sudden appearance/removal of eyes. Good imput!

[Lenne]

16 hours ago, anonymous said:

A possibility, however, is that a split of the Keepers went to Earth (known to us as the Vril Ya, or gods),

Oh so the Vril Ya are the keepers?

[anonymous]

1 hour ago, Lenne said:

Oh so the Vril Ya are the keepers?

This is a tough one, and up to today there seems to be a lot of different opinions concerning this subject. Allow me to share my personal thoughts:

 

The Vril-Ya are, very short summarized, extraterrestial beings residing in Agartha. Powered by the Black Sun, or Schwarze Sonne, the Vril-radiating core of their realm, their society is a centre of intellectual progress and enlightenment. Their mythos have always been involved in our story, and I believe it was Tac who linked the Vril-Ya with the Gatekeepers for the first time, here: The Great Battle: The Key to Understanding Everything.

 

The Ancient Order of the Keepers is an interdimensional society maintaining order in the Multiverse. The founders and main members of this organisation, the Gatekeepers, are extradimensional beings residing in Agartha. Reference: the TImeline of Zombies and Kronorium excerpt 654371979.

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"Once the great war ended with the defeat of the Apothicons, the Keepers ascended to become the wards of all universes.

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The Keepers craft the Summoning Key, a device that allows them to manipulate the Aether. Holding power over reality itself, they use it to create Agartha.

We used to think that the Aether was not really a "habitable" plane, and more of a pass through, based on everything from the original teleportation vortex, the rift, and the cipher from Richtofen regarding the physiological consequences of traversing the Aether. That is why Doctor Monty's confirmation that Aether=Agartha first didn't made sense at first, though I have tried to find various explanations for this:

• Explanation how the Aether could be within Hollow Earth
• A different explanation concerning prior subject
• Explanation how there's a difference in the usage of the word 'Aether' between WaW-Bo2 and Bo3
• Explanation how Agartha could be a physical plane within the Aether vortex

Anyhow, you must know that the Gatekeepers live in Agartha, and they wear the Schwarze Sonne symbol on their chest as well. 'Vril Ya' is also the description mankind gave to Agarthan beings, empowered by the Schwarzse Sonne, so it seems very likely that the two are the same. The Shangri La loading screen holds a Vimaña-temple ascending from a huge Keeper-symbol and Zetsubou no Shima even showed us that the Keepers made contact with early mankind as 'Ancient Astronauts' (see: the Nan Sapwe cave). Some notable observations, however, could be made.

 

First of all, the Moon Pyramid Device, as well as the associated 'Egg' is described by Richthofen to be Vrillian. The Timeline, however, says it it Apothican. Perhaps 'Vril Ya' has a broader meaning than merely the Keepers, and refers to extradimensional creatures having an Agarthan/Ethereal origin in general (so both the Keepers and the Apothicans). Another possibility is that the Vril Ya was the name of the species before their Great War and split.

 

Another counter-argument was made by NightmareVoyager a while ago and can be read here. It basically says that the Gatekeepers are inspired by the Vril Ya, but that there is no where any hard and factional evidence that is correct. This could be true as well, as besides the presence of a book named 'Vril' in Der Eisendrache, and the word 'Vril' used in BO1 for the Egg and the Golden Rod, the entities Vril Ya have never been mentioned or confirmed to exist in our story. So it is what we make of it, I guess.

 

Interesting additional thought: Time is nonexisting in the Aether, as the chronologic dimension is manipulative there (that is why Monty and the Keepers can appear just everywhere and the Agartha 'universe' in the timeline lacks dates). Could the Keepers be an evolved mankind, assisting us to indirectly assist their existence? As time is nonexisting in the Aether, it doesn't matter when they entered it (in our past our future). Maybe life itself is one big paradox, one big loop. If we extinct, they extinct.

[Guest]

 Nan Sapwe actually refers to a Thunder God and it was clear from the intro from Zetsubou No Shima that the skies were alight from a raging thunderstorm. Just thought this didn’t get as much attention. 

 

When you pick it up you unlock a trophy/achievement “The Ultimate Sacrifice”

[anonymous]

@RequixEclipse Nan Sapwe is indeed the Thunder God of the Ancient tribe of Pohnpei island, but this could still refer to the Ancient Astronauts. Like I said in the OP,, for the humans, the highly developed alien race might have been an inspiration of what we now call ‘deities’. Nan Sapwe's thunder abilities could originate from abilities mastered in the Crazy Place (remember Maxis got his from there as well) or possibly even a Vril Rod, a transductor of Ethereal Vril energy. The mythology behind Nan Sapwe is actually interesting, as he is the father of the humanoid, semi-mythological Isokelekel. This good man might've been a hybride. 

 

I totally forget about the skull. I think it is safe to say that Nan Sapwe was a Gatekeeper, a Fallen Angel protecting Nan Madol from invading Apothicans (R'ley?). Right now I am sitting in the bright sunlight and I can barely see the dark pictures, but can anyone see if the Nan Sapwe skull correlates with the Shangri La skull? Are they similar in form, structure and colour?

 

Anyway, Nan Sapwe is an interesting story aspect and I am glad you reminded me of him. I still don't fully get the hieroglyphs in the cave, or why he was involved in human sacrifices. The thunderstorm on the island is one big mystery itself. It doesn't look like any normal Earthly thunderstorm, Peter McCain was absorbed in an Aurora Borealis there (or was that in Shi no Numa?) and Brock & Gary crashed in the Pacific due to an "atmospheric freak event" as well. Perhaps this whole thing can have a Order of Forgotten Mysteries thread on its own one day.

[Guest]

@anonymous I just find it intriguing to look at. over all im really digging this post my friend nice job! 

[anonymous]

Okay so I have looked to the facial morphology of both skulls and a living Keeper.

 

An elongated, eyeless head with a pointy chin. It features a very large mounth with a set of big long teeth protuding out of it's beak. Not pharyngael, merely protuding. The upper face appears to have two central holes, resembling a nose. Higher and more to the side, the head has two more holes as well. Whether this are eyes, ears or another (rudimentary) organ of some sort, I dont know.

The skull of Nan Sapwe is, morphologically, identical to the form of a Keeper's head. The bone appears to have symbols on it's upper face, though there is a solid chance that this was added on it after the Keeper's demise. Another interesting thing are the large holes on each of the skull's side. There is a possibility that this used to be the creature's eye socket, now being a rudimentary organ. Another chance is that it are the places where it's jaw-muscles go into the skull (temporal fenstrae, like reptiles and mammals have).

(Okay this one's quality is just so bad. From what I can see its all just darkness).

 

The BO1 skull appears to have two big frontal eyes. It's colour is dark, opposed to a human skull, just like a Kepper skull. But the location of the eyes...the fact that there even are eyes. I think this proves it is no Keeper skull. It could be a hybride.

[RadZakpak]

1 hour ago, anonymous said:

 

 

The BO1 skull appears to have two big frontal eyes. It's colour is dark, opposed to a human skull, just like a Kepper skull. But the location of the eyes...the fact that there even are eyes. I think this proves it is no Keeper skull. It could be a hybride.

Maybe I’m just being pedantic, and I don’t really know my biology, but couldn’t the holes not be necessarily eye holes? The cavity itself could be for some organ somewhat similar to human eyes that picks up and processes light, but it could be covered by skin on the outside. Similar to how many animals have ear canals but no outward ears. Also if they are an evolved form of human or have a common ancestor with humans, maybe their skulls have the cavities that are unused, because they used to have eyes? I’m sure if you dissected a nova crawler for example it would have eye holes. It is somewhat similar to the human tail-bone which seems to be a remnant leftover from our ancestors that we do not use.

[anonymous]

8 hours ago, RadZakpak said:

Maybe I’m just being pedantic, and I don’t really know my biology, but couldn’t the holes not be necessarily eye holes? The cavity itself could be for some organ somewhat similar to human eyes that picks up and processes light, but it could be covered by skin on the outside. Similar to how many animals have ear canals but no outward ears. Also if they are an evolved form of human or have a common ancestor with humans, maybe their skulls have the cavities that are unused, because they used to have eyes? I’m sure if you dissected a nova crawler for example it would have eye holes. It is somewhat similar to the human tail-bone which seems to be a remnant leftover from our ancestors that we do not use.

Yes! That is what we can all rudimentary organ: a remnant leftovef from our ancestors we do not use. You could be completely right (what's more, its even kinda likely that at one point in history, the Keepers had eyes), but the Shangri La skull still looks different than the Nan Sapwe one. However, I could see there could be a possibility of the textures just being different. Because other than that, the skulls are very similar:

 

- Dark material

-Elongated skull

-Nosehole in front

-(if the eyeholes would shift a bit to the side, they would correlate with the side-holes of Nan Sapwe)

[RadZakpak]

4 hours ago, anonymous said:

Yes! That is what we can all rudimentary organ: a remnant leftovef from our ancestors we do not use. You could be completely right (what's more, its even kinda likely that at one point in history, the Keepers had eyes), but the Shangri La skull still looks different than the Nan Sapwe one. However, I could see there could be a possibility of the textures just being different. Because other than that, the skulls are very similar:

 

- Dark material

-Elongated skull

-Nosehole in front

-(if the eyeholes would shift a bit to the side, they would correlate with the side-holes of Nan Sapwe)

You would think, though, that Treyarch would just reuse the model for Nan Sapwe if they planned on retconning that skull being a keeper skull in Zombies Chronicles. They didn’t though, and went through the effort of remaking the model. That leads me to believe it isn’t a Keeper, or at least is not the same age or variation as Nan Sapwe.

[anonymous]

Ohh, I tried to find the ZC version of the skull but from YT videos it seemed like the skull was just gone. Is it still present in BO3?

[RadZakpak]

8 hours ago, anonymous said:

Ohh, I tried to find the ZC version of the skull but from YT videos it seemed like the skull was just gone. Is it still present in BO3?

Ah, did not realize it wasn't. Just watched a vid from MrRoflWaffles doing the easter egg, it appears there are no skulls at all:

 

 

 

Though it looks like there is some kind of writing on the table. I'm uncertain if that is even a legible language or just Lorem Ipsum-type placeholder symbols.

 

Also worth noting is the front of the stone:

 

It seems to have an engraved skull face similar to the one on the rotating stones by the waterfall.

 

[Electric Jesus]

Let’s also not forget the spooky Cthulhu-esque skulls in Nero’s room in Shadows of Evil. We can assume those are the skulls of humanoid apothicons, like the shadowman’s squiddy form.

 

So here’s my theory regarding the origin of the keepers. Monty explicitly says on revelations, in reference to the keepers:

 

“...while the rest of mankind was squabbling around in the dirt, drinking their own piss, the keepers...”

 

This makes it seem like the keepers are a subset of “mankind.” But that seems to come in conflict with the Timeline, which opens with the line “In the beginning, there was only the Aether and the Keepers.” Not to mention, there are some, uh, differences between human and keeper physiology.

 

So, I’ve kinda had this thought in the back of my mind that the Keepers were originally normal humans, confined to whatever their original timeline was, but once they figured out how to ascend into keeperhood, they managed to literally “escape” their timeline into hyperspace. So like, each timeline / universe is its own film reel, with souls stuck on them like flies on fly paper, and the Keepers are just the ones who managed to detach themselves and learn to move freely in 4D hyperspace.

 

So, the keepers were there “in the beginning” in the sense that they exist outside of time, with all the timelines laid out before them, where they can just re-insert themselves to any film reel at a time and location of their choosing. Like, a fly stuck on fly paper can only walk forward in one direction, but a free fly can zoom in 3d loop-de-loops around the paper itself. The same way that currently we can only move “forward” through time, the concept of “moving sideways through time” doesnt even make sense to a human, because we ourselves are the flies stuck on the fly paper. A keeper, however, has free movement through 4+ dimensions in space time.

 

Mkay, so let’s roll with that for the time being; there was originally a group of humans that called themselves the Order of the Keepers. They messed with 115, or the Aether, to the extent that they were able to free themselves from the confines of their original timeline, transforming physically due to their exposure to the aether. Effectively, I think the keepers were “the first humans to discover / perfect teleportation.” And they did so at Shangri-La.

 

The temple of Shangri-la is, quite literally, a giant teleporter / time machine. Like the entirety of the temple is a beta-version of Richtofen’s MTD. In the same way that the computers of today were once the size of a room before we improved upon the technology.

 

We hear brock and gary talking about how the temple must contain “the gateway to agartha.” But I think they’re just under the false impression that agartha is a physical location at the center of the earth. The same way that people often conceptualize “hell” as being at the center of the earth.

 

Shang is “the gateway to agartha” in that it is where the knowledge of how to access the aether was first acquired. So Shangri-la is like the ground-zero of humanity’s contact with the aether.

 

Now specifically I’ve gotta mention Indiana Jones at this point, since it’s mingled with the history of Call of Duty. Most notably, Nuketown was explicitly inspired by Vonderhaar’s viewing of Indiana Jones 4.

 

Anyway, in that movie (which also heavily inspired shangri-la,) they do call attention to the artificially elongated skulls that the natives possess, in contrast to the even more bizarre-looking “crystal skulls.” The explanation for this in the film is that the crystal skulls were left behind by “interdimensional beings” that frequently get mistaken for “spacemen.” And subsequently, some of the natives bound their own skulls to imitate the “gods” that they witnessed. Now that’s pretty similar to the mythos of Nan Sapwe. But since we’re talking about Shang, and I’m contending that the keepers were originally human, I think it’s entirely possible we’re looking at the sort of gradual evolution from human to keeper over time, like the spectrum of skulls from homo erectus to homo sapiens, for instance. We’re seeing the elongation of the skull as humans got rapidly more intelligent, and as they gained psychic powers the eyes were phased out, etc.

 

One important point is made at the end of indiana jones 4. They go in expecting to find a physical temple of gold, but instead find that the real “treasure” was the near limitless knowledge the crystal skull beings had. “Knowledge was their treasure.” In the same way that brock and gary might have expected to find a physical “gateway” to agartha, really shang is where the information on how to teleport / interact with the aether was first acquired by man.

 

So basically, my overall “thesis” of how I think things went down is this: Somewhere in the Andes, the first ever humans figured out how to interact with the aether by just arranging astronomical temples in various ways around 115 deposits. They continued experimenting with time and space in really rudimentary ways, til they mastered interdimensional travel, mutating as they did so. So now they are effectively unshackled by time, and can sort of chill outside of time in hyperspace looking down on all the various timelines.

 

Like, lemme ask you a question for the road. Just conceptually. Imagine you’re samantha, trying to kill Ultimis at Der Riese by sending all of the zombies after them. They then hop into a teleporter and go forward in time to 1960s kino. So, from sam’s perspective back in 1945, they just.... vanish. Enter a teleporter, and don’t come out anywhere else on earth. So she waits. And waits. And waits 20 years, until they re-emerge, the same age, in kino. So like, during that whole 20 years, from sam’s perspective, where were ultimis “located?” The answer is, literally, nowhere in her universe. Hyperspace. The Aether.

[Guest]

Within the MPD Samantha warned of darker entities that we could not possibly pathom. Ive thought about the many human souls we Sacrifice into the MPD on Moon, Der Eisendrache, and many other areas. The souls power the devices yes but are bound to the Æther. Perhaps they become slaves to the darkness within and are forced into the role of being a Keeper. The skulls could be altered if embodied for years in said devices. Samanthas Body being an example of 1 being embodied for a brief period in time. Just a thought...

[anonymous]

@Electric Jesus and once again you amaze me with your comments friendo. In the positive way, of course. I think you could be very right there.

 

I gave this subject my own thoughts once as well. Also note how the Indiana Jones ascending Pyramid is very similar to Shangri La's floating Vimaña. Even the Tornado is fitting... In Indiana Jones, the flying pyramid is said to go to "the space between spaces"... Sounds very 4D-ish to me.

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@MixMasterNut: "Ancient Vimanas were powered by something called a Mercury Vortex Engine.

The Mercury Vortex Engine is creating the Tornado. It needs a special type of solar energy from the eclipse, in order to be activated.

There were text within The Vaim?nika Sh?stra that talked about Vimanas being powered by a Solar energy, and then switching to a free-form type of energy that sounded much like Anti-Gravity."

I forget about that quote about "the rest of mankind". This indeed sorta confirms that the Keepers used to be mankind (or perhaps, in a time Homo Sapiens didn't exist yet and Homo Erectus was still existing). You are also totally right about the whole time-4D aspect. Note how the first Timeline scrap of Agartha, as all Agartha Timeline scraps, doesn't have a date. Once entered the Aether, you are kinda free to roam through any timelines.

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IN THE BEGINNING

There was only the Aether and the Keepers. Among them were two beings who would later be known by many names. One would be known as Doctor Monty, the other as the Shadowman.

But man, the idea that Shangri La could be Ground Zero of Aetherial studies...that is just so interesting. I know the Ancient Maya's wanted to build their temples as high as possible, because they were of the believe that the higher, the closer to the Gods. The ancient tribe that had built Shangri La (lets call them the Vril Ya) might have had the perfect constructed complex, along with a fitting location (115 source) that could form a nexus of Ethereal energy and unlocking an unknown dimension for them. The Ancient Astronauts visiting early tribes would originate from the same planet! One tribe that had ascended from darkness and entered the dimension beyond our perception: not from the stars, from Agartha.

 

@RequixEclipse While it is a very interesting theory, I think the souls of the sacrificial lambs aren't actual souls. I personally believe the MPD tubes are filled with their life-force, instead of their actual souls (see: Debunked: Souls As a Source of Power), but I have no idea what happens with their, or any other, actual soul after killing them. The biggest mystery of death.

 

 

[Guest]

13 hours ago, anonymous said:

@Electric Jesus and once again you amaze me with your comments friendo. In the positive way, of course. I think you could be very right there.

 

I gave this subject my own thoughts once as well. Also note how the Indiana Jones ascending Pyramid is very similar to Shangri La's floating Vimaña. Even the Tornado is fitting... In Indiana Jones, the flying pyramid is said to go to "the space between spaces"... Sounds very 4D-ish to me.

I forget about that quote about "the rest of mankind". This indeed sorta confirms that the Keepers used to be mankind (or perhaps, in a time Homo Sapiens didn't exist yet and Homo Erectus was still existing). You are also totally right about the whole time-4D aspect. Note how the first Timeline scrap of Agartha, as all Agartha Timeline scraps, doesn't have a date. Once entered the Aether, you are kinda free to roam through any timelines.

But man, the idea that Shangri La could be Ground Zero of Aetherial studies...that is just so interesting. I know the Ancient Maya's wanted to build their temples as high as possible, because they were of the believe that the higher, the closer to the Gods. The ancient tribe that had built Shangri La (lets call them the Vril Ya) might have had the perfect constructed complex, along with a fitting location (115 source) that could form a nexus of Ethereal energy and unlocking an unknown dimension for them. The Ancient Astronauts visiting early tribes would originate from the same planet! One tribe that had ascended from darkness and entered the dimension beyond our perception: not from the stars, from Agartha.

 

@RequixEclipse While it is a very interesting theory, I think the souls of the sacrificial lambs aren't actual souls. I personally believe the MPD tubes are filled with their life-force, instead of their actual souls (see: Debunked: Souls As a Source of Power), but I have no idea what happens with their, or any other, actual soul after killing them. The biggest mystery of death.

 

 

Yeah I’m gonna have to just stick with the facts. The M.P.D., or Aether Pyramid is a pyramid-shaped Vril machine, with a circular indented interface at the front that, when the Vril Generator is applied, grants the power to control the Aether's energy. When powered by souIs, it is able to open a direct portal to the Aether.

 

So 4 soul Containers on Moon need to be filled with Souls I remember doing it the other day lol. This is direct access to Æther and holds Samantha’s physical body

[Lenne]

On 6/8/2019 at 12:59 AM, RadZakpak said:

Ah, did not realize it wasn't. Just watched a vid from MrRoflWaffles doing the easter egg, it appears there are no skulls at all:

This makes me wonder: Are the Chronicles versions of the maps now the "canon ones" or are the BO1/WaW and Original Origins still the main ones when looking at the story?

[anonymous]

2 hours ago, Lenne said:

This makes me wonder: Are the Chronicles versions of the maps now the "canon ones" or are the BO1/WaW and Original Origins still the main ones when looking at the story?

I would normally guess so, since the maps even have some canonly thought add-ons in it (like the 935 guy in Shangri La, Shadowman's hat in Ascension, etc). However, things like this make me doubt. I think at least BO1 is certainly canon, and some add-ons in BO3 as well. But not BO3's removals (like the skull)

[Lenne]

2 minutes ago, anonymous said:

I think at least BO1 is certainly canon, and some add-ons in BO3 as well. But not BO3's removals (like the skull)

Isn't that kinda cherry picking? Doesn't there have to be some kind of common ground?

Has Blundell or anyone at Treyarch ever commented on that?

[anonymous]

14 minutes ago, Lenne said:

Isn't that kinda cherry picking? Doesn't there have to be some kind of common ground?

It certainly is, but since BO1 was just the first one, and the one we based our story on I guess that one HAS to be canon. The things Blundell added in BO3 wouldn't be there for no reason I guess. Why would they lay down a 935 body if it wouldn't be canon. So I guess that is canon as well. Things that are removed, or gone, could be due to lazyness not recreating the details. This would go for general map details. However, the skull is such a prominent item that I find it strange they removed it. Almost like it's removal is canon or something.

14 minutes ago, Lenne said:

Has Blundell or anyone at Treyarch ever commented on that?

I wouldn't know, honestly

 

EDIT: Dang I used alot of "I guess" 's

[Guest]

Black Ops 3 Der Eisendrache. Souls need to be contained in 4 Chests at each corner of the DE MPD. There is a Aetheric orb present above the device and disturbs the environment within that room. This is because the souls are to upgrade the 4 bows. Once your conplete your quest specific step you can then begin scraficing souls to speed up the upgrade to open a direct portal to the Aether. Note the MPD on DE utilizes the Golden Rod "Vril Device" which is put not on the Templars tomb which has  a circular indented interface at the front that, when the Vril Generator is applied, grants the power to control the Aether's energy.

[anonymous]

@RequixEclipse I have talked about this with Rad in an earlier thread:

Quote

I'm also not sure if it are souls the Keeper fetches itself with. I believe zombies have lost their soul, and merely contain 'Life Force'  (@NaBrZHuntercorrect me if Im wrong). Absorbing life force actually makes some sense: The spirit of the Keeper we initially see is merely the soul, lifeless. It needs life force to become both living and physical...and actually capable to do something. 

 

So the Keeper we see is not some vague spirit from the past, its a real, living, organic being, rezurrected from the death. And now it starts using its interdimensional capabilities.

While I turned out to be wrong -zombies do have a soul- the Energy we see at the Der Eisendrache Pyramid, the Moon MPD, the SoE eggs and the Origins chests, has most likely another explanation than simple "supernatural" dark rituals: Life Force. 

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“I believe only in science.”

“Their energy is being refocused!”

"It is the transformative power of 115! It draws energy from matter, living or dead!”

 -Dr. Richtofen, Origins

 

“The Lantern is a vessel for energy: the energy contained within all matter.” -Dr. Maxis, Buried

 

“Energy cannot be destroyed, only transferred.” -Richtofen, Origins / Maxis, Buried

 

“The egg seems to be drawing energy from the dead. This is heavier than before. Must be all that energy it sucked up.” -Jessica, Shadows of Evil

It's the energy that is left in matter that was once occupied by a soul. A quote by Maxis in Buried explains:

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“Departed souls leave residual energy in their wake, this energy must be used to fuel the lantern.” -Dr. Maxis, Buried

So the souls, in fact, are already gone by the time the energy manifested as a ball of light. What happens with the souls is unknown: an Afterlife perhaps? Or maybe the Quantum Souls theory is correct, and the souls move to a universe where their body still lives.

 

@Electric Jesus Upon reading through the first odd-looking Kronorium excerpts and Timeline parts, your theory clears alot of things up. I am a great supporter of it, and hope we are able to find more evidence for it!

 

@RadZakpak I've tried to find similar looking languages, and, while it could be very possibly Lorem Ipsum, it resembles a bit Tibetan. Though the characters appear to be a bit more round-ish.

[Guest]

Hey my friend its ok im glad that we could have the discussion. Im guilty of being wrong plenty of time but its those who take the time to have a dialogue. Worst case scenario is that we would just agree to disagree. This is CoDz Forums we like to engage in productive debate/discussions. 

 

Since BO4 the mass epidemic to speed through to cutscene has spread mass disinformation. Many items discussed in dialogue by characters and small occurrences that provide story specific details are left uncovered. The devil is always in the details. The cutscene is very important dont get me wrong, but to fully grasp the story leading us into the cutscenes has been at its worst. 

 

Its a facinating discovery  though because if you think about it.. The Wolf King is within that tomb.. embodied.

 

So the quotes from the character calling the floating lifeforce from the zombies souls arnt souls? I mean its in the captions its clearly written and in plain sight. 

 

Upon realizing that Samantha was in control of the Aether, he devised an alternative plan to gain ultimate power and defeat her — use a (Vril-generating device and sufficient supply of 115 to bend life force itself, allowing him to switch his soul with Samantha's and enter the Aether as an all-powerful being. After arriving at the Rising Sun facility to locate his diary, 

 

clearly Zombies have souls if Post-Buried Zombie Richtofen (Soul and all) then teleports and time travels to Ultimis Richtofen's catatonic (not zombie) body and remerges his soul with it, waking him up out of the coma. 

 

Check please