A paradox revolving the NAVcards

[anonymous]

This thread won't be an extensive theory of some sort. This time I'm reaching out to you guys for merely a question that I cannot find an answer for. At the end of Buried's Easter Egg Quest, Mined Games, you must finish the endgame of one of the Germans Victis is following by pressing the button of the Easter Egg Tracker, lighting either blue or orange. For this device to work, you must not merely have finished the Quests in Tranzit, Die Rise and Buried, but also have built the NAVcard readers under each Global Polarization Device and entered the NAVcards in each of them. 

 

Now about the Bootstrap Paradox in this issue: the Tranzit NAVcard must be put in the Die Rise reader, the Die Rise NAVcard in the Buried reader (and now it comes!), and the Buried one in the Tranzit reader. How could Victis have done this if they executed the endgame already in Buried? Has Victis travelled back to TranZit between 'Mined Games' and the Ending? Why doesn't the end take place in Green Run, then? 

 

One note I would like to make is that I believe the Tower in Buried is a different device than the Global Polarization Devices in Hanford and Shanghai. Might be due to the pressence of the Rift and the Easter Egg Tracker, whatever that is for. Activating the Buried tower seems ultimate.

[RadZakpak]

Well, considering Victis has to end up back in the United States after Buried for the comics to take place, it’s highly likely there was a way for them to travel between the two locations. That however raises the question of why would they travel across Africa by foot to reach Buried if they can be teleported? As far as we can tell, Maxis could not teleport Victis around, and why would Richtofen teleport Victis back to TranZit to put in the card if Maxis is close to winning? My understanding with the Buried intro was that Richtofen was angry that Victis was following Maxis and chose not to teleport them to Buried, like he did from TranZit to Die Rise.

 

The only in-lore explanation I can think of is that buy activating the three towers, Maxis can teleport them to TranZit to place the card, and then back.

 

But honestly, I doubt Zielinski’s team really cared about this detail and saw it as a cool opportunity to connect the maps.

 

For a more out-there possibility, what if Richtofen was keeping Victis in a cycle through the three maps until they followed his orders, so in a scenario where they choose Maxis at Tranzit and Die Rise, they collect the nav card at Buried, and they die, so Richtofen sends them back to TranZit without memories of what they’ve done, but they keep the navcard on their person and try it out at TranZit, and survive the whole cycle.

[anonymous]

I also come upon these scrapped quotes by Maxis in Tranzit. Since they are scrapped, they aren't canon yet nontheless interesting. Credits to @Slade:

 

Vox_maxi_turbine_terminal (maxi meaning, maxis, turbine_terminal meaning putting a turbine near the so-called terminal)

‘You have constructed a control mechanism, but to program the computer, you will need to secure an application navcard. You will have to seek it out, then return here and activate the Spire. To save mankind!”

 

 

Vox_maxi_terminal_on (terminal being the navcard table)

“Yes! The Spire is online! Now if the other sites can only be likewise empowered then perhaps there is still a chance we can complete that which was begun so many years ago! Your help has been invaluable, farewell!”

 

Now from this it almost seems like the endgame was either supposed to happen in Green Run, but was scrapped due to certain circumstances, or this was really hard evidence that Victis came back in TranZit, Die Rise and finally Buried after they already visited each place. Might certainly having something to do with where Richthofen revives them (with the exception of Buried, where they walk on foot to) or Maxis capable of the same after the three towers are activated.  

 

Also, how do you know the comic starts in America, rather than the African plains? I seem to have missed that. A possible explanation for this could be that the Earth's surface is simply fucked up. Remember how Victis walk from Shanghai, through Asia and Africa to Angola, one of the most southwestern countries of the latter continent, in a few months? And Victis sets up their camp near the Pyramids of Giza (Egypt), with Russman quickly afterwards saying that the Rift (Angola) is just one day further. It could be possible that the Earth is so broken, continents are molted into each other, and places that once laid far away from each other (e.g. America and Buried) are now close. However, the Die Rise loading screen and BO2 zombies Main Menu appear otherwise, as the globe is still a globe in a way, though broken. Possibility number 2 for these oddities is that Victis first took a plane (a crashed plane is seen burning at the Giza camp) and after this they walked 2 months to Angola, as the cutscene part where Russman says the Rift is close seems to take place at another location than Giza. Still wouldn't explain your America thing, though.

 

 

[RadZakpak]

I forgot this, but the comic actually starts with Victis teleporting in to what seems to be the United States due to buildings and English writing. This is presumed to be Primis Richtofen’s doing, so I am still not sure how they would go from Buried then Tranzit and back as he wasn’t in the picture yet.

[anonymous]

I forgot this teleportation events, and agree this certainly looks more America-like. Indeed, if this would MPD Richthofen doing, it would create a paradox on itself since in this universe, Maxis already won and Richthofen's soul was already eternally cast into the undead's body. So I bet this teleportation is post-BO2 and therefore irrelevant for the NAVcard paradox. Another question for you, why are Victis teleported to this time and place? Their sole goals were to retrieve the Elemental Shard and Kronorium, right? Why did they had to go to this American town first? 

 

So about the NAVcards, I think we got 3 current explanations:

• Maxis obtains the power to teleport physical beings after activating all three towers. 
• A far away one, but the NAVcards are special dimensional objects. Maybe they obtained the NAVcard in Buried, which caused their past selves in Tranzit to gain it as well. Remember how every game is canon, as they are countless times revived for fulfilling their purpose. And remember how the NAVtable, as well as the Global Polarization Device, remained build/activated even while a new game is started? Something similar could happen once the characters obtain a NAVcard.
• After Buried, Richthofen teleported them back to Tranzit, hoping they would choose his side this time.

 

I also wonder why MPD Richthofen didn't immediately teleport someone to Hanford to build the Tower of Babble. He literally choose Victis because they were the only ones present at that place, after waiting 8 years. Perhaps he obtained the power to teleport and rezurrect humans only after the first tower was activated. But in Maxis' favor? That is weird.

 

[caljitsu]

This sort of fits into Jimmy Zielinski's original plan for the chronology of Black Ops 2. Now what I'm about to say is leaked info that I've very little evidence to substantiate, so feel free to take it with a grain of salt.

 

The Zielinskiverse had a distinct concept known as "pockets". These are sort of comparable to Fractures, in that they allowed more freedom with the setting of the maps, though the in-lore mechanics of how these systems worked are totally different.

 

In BO1 moon, you can clearly see that the configuration of the earth's continents seems almost like Pangaea, or at the very least some time in prehistory. Taking this idea of time pockets, the in-studio explanation for Buried was that Griffin Station was contained within a pocket of time from this prehistoric period, and by launching the missiles of 115, you were forcing that period onto the modern earth - hence why Buried's setting was given as "Primary Plates" - it's quite literally the first tectonic configuration.

 

Now with all that exposition out of the way: Zielinski's idea was that (and this is a bit of a mindfuck), via time pockets, there was a huge paradox in play here in that the Maxis ending of buried takes place simultaneously. This is the reason for Maxis dialogue about a purge of the entire earth and the shaking of the screen. Of course, for Buried to even occur, the rockets have to had already impacted the earth - thus is the paradox, and I'm sure this relates directly to the Navcard paradox as well.

 

Interestingly, there is some (potential) evidence to back this up for any who would doubt this account I've given (which is 100% reasonable as I said at the beginning of the reply). In the video linked below, after GQ discussing with Zielinski about how the real life inspiration for Moon's biodome is next to the real life inspiration for Buried's maze, he says "Maybe, just maybe, these locations are not just close IRL" (timestamp 4:22), which I personally consider to be in support of this information.

 

Video in question:

 

Personally, I'm really not a fan of this plotpoint, and I'm glad we got what we got in terms of the transition to the Blundellverse. I understand what JZ was going for (if true), but it seems far too convoluted than necessary. As much as *Temporal rifts" seems like a bit of a copout for Buried, it's far easier to understand than complex pseudoscience ft. Plate Tectonics.

[anonymous]

Official or unofficial leak, this is a theory I am really fund on. Its funny, every tine I played Buried and saw 'Primary Plains', I actually thought about ancient supercontinents such as Pangaea and Gondwana, and in opposition to you I would undoubtedly prefer this 'Zielinskiverse' way than the 'Blundellverse'. Even though it now might be uncanon, I'd like to make some points:

• If Griffin Station is built on Earth's prehistoric Moon, it means the Matter Transference Device had send Richthofen, and later the rest of his colleagues, to the past. I believe the majority of the older members of this community believed the MTD was only capable of future-time travel, but this would prove the opposite. The Der Eisendrache Story Quest teleportation part would make more sense.
• As on the Moon loading screen astronauts, as well as the Lunar Excavator can be seen, I assume this is Griffin Station (thus in the prehistory). "Meanwhile" indicates the Shangri La loading screen happens at the same time, so the Vimañas ascending from Earth happened already 250 milion years ago? How would this tie with the primate skull seen in the corner, as primates appeared only recently in history.
• If Buried happens at a different time than the other maps, I could see Tranzit and Die Rise occur in different timepockets as well. This could explain how Tranzit has a mid 1900s appearance, while Die Rise features SDC zombies (futuristic).

 

Again, in my opinion so sad this idea was abandoned.

[anonymous]

So in that video it appears that Zielinski said that there is an Easter Egg in the Buried intro. It is believed that that Egg is Samantha's Lullaby that can be heard: One other connection between Moon and Buried. Maybe I'm being paranoid, but I also found this particular:

We see a Broken and fractured Earth, and instantly after that we are shown the Moon, exactly on the place where the Earth previously was seen. A shining Moon within Earth. Is this done on purpose?

[anonymous]

Upon blowing up Earth, we also see a weird glowing orb within. Our core? The Rift? Also, @RichKiller, this is the supercontinent resembling Pangea or perhaps Gondwana and Larasia, or 'Primary Plates' where Cal referred to. Can you think of any explanation how Victis could be there?:

[RichKiller]

19 hours ago, anonymous said:

 

Also, @RichKiller, this is the supercontinent resembling Pangea or perhaps Gondwana and Larasia, or 'Primary Plates' where Cal referred to. Can you think of any explanation how Victis could be there?

If you are asking me the bigger issue is not how Victis got there (this can be easily reasoned with time travel), but how did Buried itself got there:
You have a small city lying within and a mining area on top, and it's supposed to be prehistoric era.
If you were asking me that 6 years ago I would have said that all of that was copied to that area due to 115 displacement, similarly to Nacht in Tranzit.
I don't know if that argument still holds though, but I find it difficult to explain otherwise.
This whole idea conflicts the BO4 evidence of the Polarization Devices being built by US and the Soviets. 
 

[RichKiller]

You could say that the 115 displacement happened "after" the Polarization Devices were built somewhere in the 20th century.
Then you could say that the 115 displacement happens when Victis arrives Buried.
Then Moon and Buried could be happening in the same time? Does that sounds reasonable to you?