Black Ops II is a Cycle

[anonymous]

Is it coincidence that Mob of the Dead, introducing us to the concept of an eternal cycle, was released between the Victis maps? Let's start with the hypothesis: No, it is not. Mob showed us very clearly and directly what was going on in Tranzit, Die Rise and Buried: The characters stuck in an endless loop. A bit more far away, but even Tranzit itself can be seen as a metaphor for this idea, as the map itself is one big cycle with the characters trapped in it. T.E.D.D. told us all along:

 

"Error. Error. Bus transponder not operational. Default into program route cycle" - TEDD

 

The first argument for this theory was brought up by @RadZakpak in his thread about the importance of storms and magma regarding pocketuniverses. He mentions that Primis Richtofen needed the blood of both the 4 Alcatraz inmates and that of Victis as an 'insurance policy'. He believes the blood will protect him, and I believe this is because the Alcatraz and Victis crews are the only ones who have been stuck in a timeloop, and thereby consuming their blood would generate a paradox which disallows Monty to simply cease them from existence. @RichKillernoticed that there's also specific cipher in Gorod Krovi mentioning Victis' blood samples: 

 

"Finally the lab is almost complete. Security measures have been put in place so the chance of detection by the Americans is very unlikely. We also have several agents embedded with the staff as insurance. We will keep the individuals in stasis, on ice to speak, and continue the specimen rotation once we finish drawing more power from the drill . Oh, I almost forgot, the sequencing for the current blood samples is as follows: SSMJABR"

 

Notice the 'specimen rotation' that is mentioned. We know that at some point, Victis was cryogenically frozen at Alcatraz, but what does the writer of this cipher (presumably an Illuminati member) mean with their rotation. Could it refer to the loop they are trapped in in Black Ops II? 

 

So here's a crazy idea @Dizzie Bonkers came up with: What if Black Ops II happens while the characters are stored on ice in Alcatraz? Let's go back to the moment the comics start: We see Victis fighting the undead together in what seems to be a random American town (looking at the buildings and writing). We always assumed that this took place directly after Buried, but in that case several things seem a bit off: First of all, how would they get from Africa to America? Secondly, if this was after Maxis' ending, why are the characters still relaxingly killing zombies, is the sky not red and breaking down and does the universe still exist?

 

If the characters play Black Ops II after they were put on ice, it would explain this 'specimen rotation'. Aside from this, I believe that the cryogenically freezing of a character might have more importance, as we see with Samantha's cryogenic slumber party and the frozen testsubjects that must/mustn't be awoken. Weird stuff…

 

Anyways, Black Ops II being our first encounter with a Cycle would make sense, looking at a certain issues. First of all it would explain the infamous NAVcard paradox: The characters would simply still hold the Buried NAVcard upon being revived at Tranzit again. Secondly, it might explain the entity of the Wisp. During the Buried Easter Egg, we have a Lantern with energy, which exposes the Wisp.

 

"You must ensure the Lantern is safe from harm. The energy within is essential to exposing the spirits of those who came before you. Their wisdom will show you the way." - Maxis

 

"While some failed to complete this task, the others left clues for those who follow. Only a burst of electricity will have the brute force necessary to release the energy bound to this realm." - Maxis

 

It is clear that the Wisp's energy exists of the spirits of people who were here before. Even more interesting in the quote of Richtofen:

 

"Maxis calls it a wisp. It's really just a ball of life that's imprisoned in this place for all eternity! Probably best not to dwell about what it really is. It will make you so sad…" - Richtofen

 

First of all, Richtofen confirms that the Wisp exists of life (Life Force?), and is captured here for all eternity (or as Maxis says it, it is "bound to this realm"). What's more, Richtofen says that if the characters knew what it really was, it would make them so sad. Why? Because I think this ball of imprisoned life force is Victis, but in a previous cycle! That's also an instant explanation for the 'Round Infinity' thing we have during Richtofen's quest, in order to "fix a tear in space-time". Now why does Maxis not have this step? Because in Maxis' case, I don't think the Wisp is Victis. Let's compare Maxis' Wisp with Richtofen's.

 

As Richkiller noted, there is a difference between their appearance. Richtofen's Wisp seems to have four (!) small balls revolving around the main orb. I think these represent the four Victis characters that were sacrificed in a previous cycle, in Round Infinity.

 

So is solely Richtofen's Quest in a loop? Here's a summary of my idea, but of course I could be wrong and I'm open for any other potential loop:

 

Richtofen's Quest is the only loop, but not the only possibility. Think about Mob of the Dead, there are different endings. One to break the cycle (Weasel lives) and one to continue it (Weasel dies). Richtofen's ending leads to the continuation of the loop, and it is also the reason we don't see it in the Timeline/Kronorium. By mending the Rift we do something that allows to establishes Richtofen's control. I think we always overlooked something minor: Zielinski hinted that there was an easter egg hidden in the Buried intro. People assumed this hinted to the slowed version of Samantha's lullaby, and Caljitsu noted that this might mean that Buried happens in some way during Moon (that's why the lullaby is heard slower). Now at this moment, Richtofen's soul was inside the cryogenically frozen body of Samantha, while Victis' bodies were cryogenically frozen in the Alcatraz pocketuniverse. Richtofen's control post-rockets can be stabilized by the help of souls bound to that realm: Victis. He mends the Rift over and over again, and his control is basically established by the whole paradox that is the existence and actions of Victis, over and over again. His control is fragile, though, as there is a chance that at one point, Victis decide to follow Maxis. Once the silly German wins the endgame in Buried, he breaks the Cycle and reaches out for Samantha's soul in Moon. Meanwhile, Richtofen is damned inside the rotten corpses of the undead, which may even be eternal due to the loop. This is why he, quite quickly after he loses the endgame, already says that he has been trapped there for all eternity: For him, this thing has been going on for a veeeery long time already. Another consequence of breaking the loop is Origins and all the events that happen after this, from Revelations to the Great War. These events find their way in the Kronorium, and that is why only Maxis' path is seen in the Timeline.

 

Fun talks, please let me hear your thoughts about this theory. Other than that, have a nice day and see you in 6 hours, when we will hear more about Cold War. Tschüss!

[clueless]

53 minutes ago, anonymous said:

"You must ensure the Lantern is safe from harm. The energy within is essential to exposing the spirits of those who came before you. Their wisdom will show you the way." - Maxis

 

"While some failed to complete this task, the others left clues for those who follow. Only a burst of electricity will have the brute force necessary to release the energy bound to this realm." - Maxis

 

It is clear that the Wisp's energy exists of the spirits of people who were here before. Even more interesting in the quote of Richtofen:

 

"Maxis calls it a wisp. It's really just a ball of life that's imprisoned in this place for all eternity! Probably best not to dwell about what it really is. It will make you so sad…" - Richtofen

 

First of all, Richtofen confirms that the Wisp exists of life (Life Force?), and is captured here for all eternity (or as Maxis says it, it is "bound to this realm"). What's more, Richtofen says that if the characters knew what it really was, it would make them so sad. Why? Because I think this ball of imprisoned life force is Victis, but in a previous cycle! That's also an instant explanation for the 'Round Infinity' thing we have during Richtofen's quest, in order to "fix a tear in space-time". Now why does Maxis not have this step? Because in Maxis' case, I don't think the Wisp is Victis. Let's compare Maxis' Wisp with Richtofen's.

 

As Richkiller noted, there is a difference between their appearance. Richtofen's Wisp seems to have four (!) small balls revolving around the main orb. I think these represent the four Victis characters that were sacrificed in a previous cycle, in Round Infinity.

 

LOVE IT! And the Wisp in Maxis' side could be just the singular person left alive in the end of the original incident at the site, the one and only Jebediah Brown! The blacksmith that understands to an extent the machinations of Aethereal design. 

 

edit: Also those pictures make me realize I'll have to run through some of these Easter Eggs on PC if for nothing else to get better quality screenshots of specific easter egg components; a lot of data is left to phone camera pictures which doesn't give us as much room for discussion and makes details very easy to miss (not this specific case it's clearly a wisp but you know what I mean!)

[RichKiller]

On 9/30/2020 at 12:34 PM, anonymous said:

@RichKillernoticed that there's also specific cipher in Gorod Krovi mentioning Victis' blood samples: 

 

"Finally the lab is almost complete. Security measures have been put in place so the chance of detection by the Americans is very unlikely. We also have several agents embedded with the staff as insurance. We will keep the individuals in stasis, on ice to speak, and continue the specimen rotation once we finish drawing more power from the drill . Oh, I almost forgot, the sequencing for the current blood samples is as follows: SSMJABR"

 

Notice the 'specimen rotation' that is mentioned. We know that at some point, Victis was cryogenically frozen at Alcatraz, but what does the writer of this cipher (presumably an Illuminati member) mean with their rotation. Could it refer to the loop they are trapped in in Black Ops II? 

As always I can't do a full analysis, but I'll try to cover this sufficiently. One of the most important things to consider is that Victis appears in the same model the cryogenic chambers,
as seen in DE and the alternative loading screen, showcasing Ultimis Richtofen with the rest of Primis: 

 

 

 

Recall the following cipher from Classified, showing a bad ending in which Dempsey dies, "all hope is lost", with Richtofen waking up the test subjects being the only hope left.

Quote

(cough)

Field Report...

(heavy cough)

I don't know why I'm doing this.
Is anyone even receiving me?

(cough)

If you are, then all hope is lost. I'm the last one. The others...
they're... gone. We failed.

(cough)

I don't know if there are multiple outcomes, or if this has always been the only one. No matter what we do, what we fix, we still end up here... this time travel shit, multiverses, shit fries your brain.

(cough)

I hope Richtofen established contact with the others.
Woke them up. It's the only way now. It's up to them.

(cough)

Damn it's cold... very cold...

(beat)

Not much time left now.

Without a full analysis, this is going with a strong contrast to the other cipher from Rev, in which Dempsey dies pleased, where Monty doesn't find "this place". 
Looks like awaking the test subjects is the only hope left. And there's one team that wants to do so in particular, which is the Primis team from The Giant (Excluding Primis Richtofen):
 

Quote

"The future hangs by a thread. You must awaken the test subjects"- Primis Takeo to Ultimis Richtofen, The Giant intro

Perhaps even more important quote is the following:

Quote

(sighs) Having failed to secure the intel, test subject's location... is currently unknown.
Dammit, Richtofen! Why do you always have to screw everything up.

(censored quote version replaces "Dammit, Richtofen!" with "Nuts Richtofen!")

Recall that their goal is to wake up the Ultimis test subjects, in order to prevent the timeline being changed (here are a few quotes showing this):
 

Quote

"Ughhhh... I need to remember the mission: Ensure the timelines are disrupted. Ah shit, kinda late for that" 
"We cannot forget our mission: We must ensure that events follow their natural order"
"Are you nothing but an agent of chaos, Richtofen? ... Why do you seek to seek to disrupt the order of events ever further?"

People considered the DE intro as a meme for other events, but honestly... they might actually be right, in one way or another. 

 

 

Back to Victis, which are definitely in a loop. From Tranzit, we really go to Die Rise. The gap between Die Rise and Buried remains unclear:
 

Quote

"Enough! We need to remember why we're here. We've all been jumping through loops for reasons we don't fully understand."- Misty, in the campfire

 

As @PINNAZhas pointed in the past, Stu has a diary in his pocket that appears between Die Rise and Buried.

 

Stu refers to this diary in several quotes:

Quote

"Damn diary, voices. I don't need this shit!" 

Quote

"Late at night, when no one's around... I get out the book, and read all about what's really going on!"

We also have the following quote, which appears to be a cut quote from the Die Rise Easter Egg:
 

Quote

"Ohhhh it's this book! It's cursed. 

This highlights further the interesting gap. It's worth saying that into the Buried intro, we can see Victis coming from Egptians pyramids and a Sphinx 

 

This could be an interesting place to have a Victis map, sealing the gap with teleportation from Die Rise to this area. 

 

Another gap is the gap between Buried and Tranzit, but more accurately, the gap between Alcatraz and Tranzit. Here we have to consider the timeline:
 

 

We know Marlton is in the Nuketown Zombies. Moreover, we can hear the Tranzit bus in Nuketown Zombies:

 

This is particularly interesting given that Russman steals a Bus from an abandoned Broken Arrow facility. 
Stuhlinger also has quotes regarding the "flying-disc" (Nuketown drill), "Majestic 12", and so on (it's worth saying that he's pretty much right with his quotes)
and now we are back to the test subjects again: 
 

Quote

Finally the lab is almost complete. Security measures have been put in place so the chance of detection by the Americans is very unlikely. We also have several agents embedded with the staff as insurance. We will keep the individuals in stasis, on ice to speak, and continue the specimen rotation once we finish drawing more power from the drill . Oh, I almost forgot, the sequencing for the current blood samples is as follows: SSMJABR

If you ask me. That's how the cycle looks. It's one of these points where AO and Tag don't get it right, as they rushed to the end.

Victis go back and through in the cycle. They simply return through aether, or as zielinski likes to call it, the eternal return:  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eternal_return

Tag does get right one thing: The cryo-chambers of Victis don't stay in Alcatraz. So where are the cryo-chambers? Well.. our friends asks the same question:

Quote

(sighs) Having failed to secure the intel, test subject's location... is currently unknown.
Dammit, Richtofen! Why do you always have to screw everything up.

But as said he looks to awaken a rather different test subjects, Ultimis. Not Victis. And perhaps... that's the whole trick, a surprised planned by Treyarch, for us, and in-game, for Richtofen to the rest of Primis, so they won't awakwen Ultimis. The location of the test subject is not unique. It changes between different stations, periodically. This would be, "the test subject rotation". 

I want to end this comment with linking the first reveal of the SoE cutscene, in which Craig and Blundell bang at each important concepts in the zombies storyline.
A few there are "threads", "the clock", "feeding", and... you named it, the test subjects.

 

[anonymous]

@clueless and @RichKiller, two mindblowing comments! Yeah, it would make sense if Maxis' "soul already bound to this realm" is ole Jebediah! Also, Richkiller, thank you for reminding me of that Alcatraz alternative loading screen. This genuine makes me think the testsubjects Primis + Ultimis Richtofen may not be Ultimis, as I always thought, but Victis! The only thing I'm not fully sure of is that the characters stepping through the portal are Primis with Ultimis Richtofen, or Primis as we see them in BotD's intro. After all, this year (1941) fits with that particular event in Blood of the Dead. What do you think?

 

Allow me to think for some more time about this idea

[RichKiller]

1 hour ago, anonymous said:

 The only thing I'm not fully sure of is that the characters stepping through the portal are Primis with Ultimis Richtofen, or Primis as we see them in BotD's intro. After all, this year (1941) fits with that particular event in Blood of the Dead. What do you think?

The hat discloses that it's not Primis Richtofen, and with the other loading screen I think it's safe to say that's Ultimis Richtofen. The Giant has quotes suggesting the coming Primis crew were with Ultimis Richtofen as well. 

[anonymous]

Just had a quick question to the community of which I think some of you may be able to help. In Classified, there are two particular Red Phone messages which I find very interesting:

Spoiler

Ludwig Maxis: They are fools... ignorant, petulant fools. They blindly follow him, sheep herded by a false shepherd, a wolf bearing human flesh. They must know not to trust him, it's instinctive. In the darkest recessives of their minds, a voice screams out. Warning them. But they don't know why, they don't know what he did. They were all prisoners of war, left to rot. Nobody cared if they lived or die, so we took them; Group 935. We just didn't know how far he takes the experiments. The amount of Element 115 he pumped through them... I'm surprised any of them survived Siberia. And now, they follow him. Taking orders, the very man who broke them, fried their brains. The MPD, the Aether... it corrupted him, as it did my Samantha. As it does anyone who touches it. The temptation of unlimited power, it will destroy everything. If Richtofen gains control, there will be no turning back. I will be forced to take drastic measures. But they can stop him now, put an end to this madness. They just need to make sure he doesn't make it back here. If only they remember... but they won't, will they? They will help him until the bitter end, beyond the point of no return. Because that is the nature of sheep.

The odd thing about this is that Maxis (I assume House Maxis) heavily prioritizes Richtofen not getting into control. Why is that? It was Maxis' Endgame that led to the destruction of the world right? Why is it so important for Richtofen not to win? Also, he mentions 'being forced to take drastic measures' if Richtofen wins. How? What measures? Does his power stand above Richtofen's when he gets in control?

 

The other radio I found interesting is this one:

Spoiler

Samuel J. Stuhlinger: Hello? Is this thing on? Richtofen? Hey Richtofen! You've been gone from my head a really long time. I gotta be honest, I'm freaking out a bit, man. It's... it's so quiet. I can actually hear myself think, you know what that's like? It's not nice at all. So, listen, buddy, oh pal, we gotta talk. You sent us here of all places but you forgot to tell us what to do! It's dark, it's damp, it's just really filthy. I-I think the roaches are crawling with roaches, how is that even possible?! Wait. Shoot! Am I even talking to the right Richtofen? Oh, it could be the other one, right? Or you're the other other one. Yeah, you know what just, just go talk to your Richtofen pals at the hoity-toity Ricky gang clubhouse and find out what the (static) we're supposed to be doing!

I always assumed this was in the cryogenic pods in Alcatraz. But why does he mention filthyness, dampness and even roaches. If he feels anything, it's probably solely the cold of the pods, no? In what kind of place is his mind trapped?

[KronoriumExcerptB]

I think the Maxis phone is just Griffin Station Maxis. That's how I initially took it, and I still don't see anything there to make me doubt that explanation. Maxis' motives make sense, if it's Griffin Station Maxis.

 

 

The Stu phone, on the other hand, certainly doesn't make sense in any timeframe that we know of. The key part of the phone, imo, is when Stu mentions that Richtofen has been out of his head for a really long time. Richtofen has been in his head in some form all the way from TranZit up until Tag.  In my opinion, this means that this Stu phone is either from some other dimension/cycle Stu, or it's after Tag and they somehow survive.  Stu also specifically mentions it being dark, which could be a reference to the dark aether? But that might be a stretch.

 

 

[RichKiller]

2 hours ago, anonymous said:

I always assumed this was in the cryogenic pods in Alcatraz. But why does he mention filthyness, dampness and even roaches. 

 

Nuketown Zombies is full of roaches.
 

 

 

[Rapt]

On 10/1/2020 at 1:21 AM, RichKiller said:

The location of the test subject is not unique. It changes between different stations, periodically. This would be, "the test subject rotation". 

 

On 10/1/2020 at 1:21 AM, RichKiller said:

People considered the DE intro as a meme for other events, but honestly... they might actually be right, in one way or another. 

 

 

On 10/1/2020 at 1:21 AM, RichKiller said:

But as said he looks to awaken a rather different test subjects, Ultimis. Not Victis. And perhaps... that's the whole trick, a surprised planned by Treyarch, for us, and in-game, for Richtofen to the rest of Primis, so they won't awakwen Ultimis. The location of the test subject is not unique. It changes between different stations, periodically. This would be, "the test subject rotation". 

Just wanted to throw in the possibility that Der Eisendrache may have been a/the previous station where Victis were stored.
Which may have been Richtofen's true reason for visiting the castle.
The empty cryo chambers could very well be from Ultimis ofc, but it's possible they were the previous location for the Victis subjects.

 

Notice Richtofen's reaction to seeing the swords missing from the wall...

If you look ingame at where he is facing from this screenshot from: 

Just a possibility. The missing swords and his reaction could be related to something else.
7 swords, Group 601, 6+0+1=7.
Seems like someone is taunting Richtofen...
He seems in a pretty bad mood about those swords at the very least.

[anonymous]

46 minutes ago, Rapt said:

Just a possibility. The missing swords and his reaction could be related to something else.
7 swords, Group 601, 6+0+1=7.
Seems like someone is taunting Richtofen...
He seems in a pretty bad mood about those swords at the very least.

Reminds me of that sentence in Alone, the song of Die Maschine:

 

"They buried a well 

where the seven fell"

[RichKiller]

10 minutes ago, Rapt said:

Just wanted to throw in the possibility that Der Eisendrache may have been a/the previous station where Victis were stored.
Which may have been Richtofen's true reason for visiting the castle.

 

From what we know Pablo was captured in DE and was pumped with 115, making him see visions of the great war, and eventually ending up with the dark sun symbol from the great war: 

 

 

Quote

My name is Pablo or at least I think it is or... was I don't know anymore. I have been locked away, held prisoner in this cell for many months by Germans scientists. They keep experimenting on me, pumping me full of some blue liquid. I think it is responsible for the repeated visions I have been having which I swear look and feel real. In this vision, my name is Pablo Marinus and I am a knight coming back from the crusades. I fight in a great battle against strange demon like creatures who are trying to devour the Earth. At one point, it appears I am doomed, trapped in the tentacles of a great three headed beast when suddenly four knights decimate it with magical elemental staves, saving me from certain death. There are otherworldly creatures that fight on our side against the demons. The creepy thing is that the sigils on their tunics resemble the one I noticed on stones here at the castle as I was being brought to my cell. I just hope I can eventually find a way to escape this place.

 

 

We also know that test subjects are supposed to arrive from the castle to the Verruckt (but they never arrive?)

Quote

Entry 56
Just finished a very long shift. We were awaiting the test subjects arrival from the castle but they never showed. Those Group 935 pigs didnt even bother to radio the asylum to let us know they were not coming. I am getting sick of those arrogant scientists. They have given the asylum the nickname Verrückt Asylum. I loathe it. We are as every bit as important to the completion of project as they are.

 

Quote

Entry 58
We have been having power fluctuations for the past couple of days. Consequently, we have had to rely more and more on the backup generators. It's strange, ever since we have been having issues with the power, people are reporting hearing voices coming from the walls. They say they can hear quiet sobbing from a boy and a girl, as well as, a man shouting for children to close the windows. I have not heard the voices, but I admit something feels different about this place.